A Spirited Valentine ...

[WDW1974]

I'm interested about this too. The Disneyland Parking Garage thread recently started to pick up again, not because of construction updates but rather lack of any updates. I can't imagine Disney is giving up on the pedestrian overpass, but it they are having problems getting it approved it would probably mean they can't close the current pedestrian esplanade which I believe was part of the Marvel Land expansion.

It will be approved. The issue is Disney providing guarantees that the current Harbor Blvd. ped entrance won't disappear, which would gravely harm businesses along the road and make DLR more of a bubble. I don't see anyway this will be allowed. Anaheim isn't Orlando.

 

[mickEblu]

Nothing lately. I am wondering if the plan is still to clone the TDS ride (yes, it is happening ... just was delayed and pushed back behind other projects). Recall that rushed HKDL leak followed by announcement that included what sure seemed like a clone of WDW's shoehorned ride with Olaf and the Weird Sisters. That seemed like a very odd and cheap choice when you could do the more pricey trackless sleds version. But I readily admit that I am not getting constant info on these things. I don't believe the location for the attraction has changed one bit.

Oh yeah, on 2020. Have strong and recent info that they're shooting for having much of this done by summer of that year. And looking at how SWE is moving along, I do think that may be realistic.

Nothing I know of says they're touching Hyperion as a facility!

I hope it's still the trackless version and it hasn't been scaled down to the boat ride.

So if Marvel Land is still looking good for 2020 does that mean we can expect an announcement at D23 and / or Comic Con this year?

 

[Mike S]

While I am hot, bring back resort specific soap and shampoo for crying out loud. I don't want H20. I want bottles and wrappers that say the Polynesian on them or whatever resort I am at. Curse you bean counters.

Yeah, it's really not that hard.

I can now proudly state that Kong is never worth more than 45 minutes of waiting.

Not many rides are imo.

 

[ParentsOf4]

They got cold feet and sold to Marriott and there is a very high end Marriott Vacation Club on the Newport Beach land that was sold off. Much like the one overlooking Golf Disney at DLP (where I have stayed in a spectacular grand villa that I wanted to move into!) ... People forget, or don't know, that DVC was supposed to be a national/international project, not a WDW Timeshare Kingdom. They had land eyeballed from the White Mountains of New Hampshire to the ski slopes of Colorado, from the heart of Miami's South Beach to NYC's Times Square.

Between the death of Frank Wells, the negative campaign that cost us Disney's America in VA., the financial pains of Euro Disney and the takeover of ABC/Cap Cities, Eisner and Disney got very conservative on the DVC business. And Iger has stayed the same way. Aulani exists for multiple reasons, but part of it was to one day take advantage of the location to combine with AbD tours and DCL cruises. That really hasn't happened. And I don't care how beautiful it is, it is in one of the worst locations on Oahu. It also isn't doing great or CMs wouldn't be able to book there for 60-70% rack most of the year.

With some exceptions, when the vast majority of the public thinks "Disney vacation" they think "theme park". Disney has a hard time justifying DVC prices at anywhere except near a theme park.

Hilton Head and Vero Beach are both small timeshares compared to the typical WDW DVC resort. Both opened ahead of nearly all WDW DVC resorts at a time when the Disney brand was at its zenith and DVC options were extremely limited. 20 years later, direct and resale prices at those resorts languish far behind prices at WDW DVCs.

Aulani is proof that the public doesn't have an appetite for a Disney timeshare away from a theme park. Opened six years ago, it still hasn't sold out, selling slower than the expansive, beautiful Animal Kingdom Villas, which the public was slow to embrace because of its incorrectly perceived "bad" location on the southwest corner of WDW property. (I still can't figure out why AKV resale prices are about the same as the massive, rather ho-hum SSR. Seriously, AKV is WDW's most beautiful resort.)

Remember, building/converting at WDW is cheap. Disney already owns all the land and infrastructure. Building anywhere else is significantly more expensive for Disney.

This is all about volume and margin. Disney is never going to find a timeshare location that will sell as quickly and with as high of a margin as at WDW.

 

[ford91exploder]

Just to add a bit of reason, you've heard lots of talk about WDW adding this or doing that and ... I wouldn't get your hopes up that all you hear is going to come to pass. Things are finally happening (but, hey, Iger has only been big boss since 2006 -- but really sorta 2005), but if Disney did everything you're reading about the bill would likely come to between $5-7 billion. Disney is going to spend in the swamps, but not close to that.

I would think y'all have to know that in your minds.

Yet Disney will spend 8-10 Billion on stock buybacks this year alone

 

[DDLand]

They got cold feet and sold to Marriott and there is a very high end Marriott Vacation Club on the Newport Beach land that was sold off. Much like the one overlooking Golf Disney at DLP (where I have stayed in a spectacular grand villa that I wanted to move into!) ... People forget, or don't know, that DVC was supposed to be a national/international project, not a WDW Timeshare Kingdom. They had land eyeballed from the White Mountains of New Hampshire to the ski slopes of Colorado, from the heart of Miami's South Beach to NYC's Times Square.

Between the death of Frank Wells, the negative campaign that cost us Disney's America in VA., the financial pains of Euro Disney and the takeover of ABC/Cap Cities, Eisner and Disney got very conservative on the DVC business. And Iger has stayed the same way. Aulani exists for multiple reasons, but part of it was to one day take advantage of the location to combine with AbD tours and DCL cruises. That really hasn't happened. And I don't care how beautiful it is, it is in one of the worst locations on Oahu. It also isn't doing great or CMs wouldn't be able to book there for 60-70% rack most of the year.

Aulani seems like it was a Jim Lewis pet project. Judging by their behavior in the late 2000s, Lewis wanted to lead a new Disney Vacation Club Renaissance. Aulani, GCH, Treehouse Villas. He even mentioned they had kicked around ideas for new locations beyond the berm.

The fact that the concept failed miserably probably is what did him in. I guess that was about the time Disney lost faith in theme parks and decided to do Cruise Ships and Timeshares.

With some exceptions, when the vast majority of the public thinks "Disney vacation" they think "theme park". Disney has a hard time justifying DVC prices at anywhere except near a theme park.

Hilton Head and Vero Beach are both small timeshares compared to the typical WDW DVC resort. Both opened ahead of nearly all WDW DVC resorts at a time when the Disney brand was at its zenith and WDW DVC options were extremely limited. 20 years later, resale prices at those resorts languish far behind resale prices at WDW DVCs.

Aulani is proof that the public doesn't have an appetite for a Disney timeshare away from a theme park. Opened six years ago, it still hasn't sold out, selling slower than the expansive, beautiful Animal Kingdom Villas, which the public was slow to embrace because of its incorrectly perceived "bad" location on the southwest corner of WDW property. (I still can't figure out why AKV resale prices are about the same as the massive, rather ho-hum SSR. Seriously, AKV is WDW's most beautiful resort.)

Remember, building/converting at WDW is cheap. Disney already owns all the land and infrastructure. Building anywhere else is significantly more expensive for Disney.

This is all about volume and margin. Disney is never going to find a timeshare location that will sell as quickly and with as high of a margin as at WDW.

This underscores an interesting point, DVC is actually a pretty bad timeshare. Sure it's good if you want to vacation at WDW, but if you want to buy into a diverse set of offerings DVC is actually unimpressive. Why would someone who's not an avid Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when there are other timeshares with more diverse locations? Just as critically, why would a Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when they could buy at an established Disney Resort?

Before it's taken seriously in the timeshare market, it needs more locations. They don't seem to care about be taken seriously though.

 

[twebber55]

Aulani seems like it was a Jim Lewis pet project. Judging by their behavior in the late 2000s, Lewis wanted to lead a new Disney Vacation Club Renaissance. Aulani, GCH, Treehouse Villas. He even mentioned they had kicked around ideas for new locations beyond the berm.

The fact that the concept failed miserably probably is what did him in. I guess that was about the time Disney lost faith in theme parks and decided to do Cruise Ships and Timeshares.

This underscores an interesting point, DVC is actually a pretty bad timeshare. Sure it's good if you want to vacation at WDW, but if you want to buy into a diverse set of offerings DVC is actually unimpressive. Why would someone who's not an avid Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when there are other timeshares with more diverse locations? Just as critically, why would a Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when they could buy at an established Disney Resort?

Before it's taken seriously in the timeshare market, it needs more locations. They don't seem to care about be taken seriously though.

i still think a New York City DVC would sell well
lots of disney fans in NY/NJ

im disappointed they backed out of their DVC idea in Washington DC

 

[orky8]

i still think a New York City DVC would sell well
lots of disney fans in NY/NJ

im disappointed they backed out of their DVC idea in Washington DC

Why would NY/NJ folks want a timeshare in NY? Even if they wanted to maybe stay there a night or two, it seems at best they'd want a WDW timeshare and then to use some points in NY. I think that is the problem with most of the offsite Disney timeshares - people think that might be a nice place to try with their points, but they don't want to buy there as the theme parks are their primary destination.

 

[twebber55]

Why would NY/NJ folks want a timeshare in NY? Even if they wanted to maybe stay there a night or two, it seems at best they'd want a WDW timeshare and then to use some points in NY. I think that is the problem with most of the offsite Disney timeshares - people think that might be a nice place to try with their points, but they don't want to buy there as the theme parks are their primary destination.

1. to have dvc points for WDW
2.weekend getaway to NYC

 

[homerdance]

Opened six years ago, it still hasn't sold out, selling slower than the expansive, beautiful Animal Kingdom Villas, which the public was slow to embrace because of its incorrectly perceived "bad" location on the southwest corner of WDW property. (I still can't figure out why AKV resale prices are about the same as the massive, rather ho-hum SSR. Seriously, AKV is WDW's most beautiful resort.)
.

The only reason I can figure out is the higher maintenance fees at AKV vs. other DVC resorts, same with the "off site" DVC, they have higher maintenance fees than comparable on site hotels.

 

[truecoat]

Aulani seems like it was a Jim Lewis pet project. Judging by their behavior in the late 2000s, Lewis wanted to lead a new Disney Vacation Club Renaissance. Aulani, GCH, Treehouse Villas. He even mentioned they had kicked around ideas for new locations beyond the berm.

The fact that the concept failed miserably probably is what did him in. I guess that was about the time Disney lost faith in theme parks and decided to do Cruise Ships and Timeshares.

This underscores an interesting point, DVC is actually a pretty bad timeshare. Sure it's good if you want to vacation at WDW, but if you want to buy into a diverse set of offerings DVC is actually unimpressive. Why would someone who's not an avid Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when there are other timeshares with more diverse locations? Just as critically, why would a Disney Parks fan buy into Aulani when they could buy at an established Disney Resort?

Before it's taken seriously in the timeshare market, it needs more locations. They don't seem to care about be taken seriously though.

Wasn't this guy fired because the numbers at Aulani were wrong. Something about fees charged wouldn't cover the project? I seem to remember something like this.

 

[DDLand]

Wasn't this guy fired because the numbers at Aulani were wrong. Something about fees charged wouldn't cover the project? I seem to remember something like this.

Indeed. Aulani was a disaster. Sales out of the gate were weak, and then they suddenly realized that member dues wouldn't cover operations. They had to yank sales and recalculate member dues increasing them significantly. This in turn hurt sales more and now we have the situation where it's still slowly selling 5 years later.

This led to the termination of Lewis and two other key Parks executives in what was described as a pretty shocking and abrupt move. It and the resurgence of Disneyland all but ended Disney's future attempts to go beyond the berm.

Disney Vacation Club has been particularly unimpressive since, with GF, Poly, and WL being the newest projects.

When his strategy and vision proved to be costly and underperforming, all it would take was a small issue to have him terminated. That came in the miscalculation.

 

[VJ]

Something I've always noticed, a small detail I really love:

In the Pirates of the Caribbean movies, the first four movies (and the fifth one, if the poster's credits are any indication) have had "Based on Walt Disney's Pirates of the Caribbean" in the end credits and on the poster. I don't know if Disney's legally obligated to put that there or if they just do it out of respect but it makes me feel good.

 

[orky8]

1. to have dvc points for WDW
2.weekend getaway to NYC

Yes, but as I said, I would think someone wanting that would buy points at WDW, which still leaves the problem of selling the NY resort. Most people don't plan weekend getaways 11 or 7 months in advance. We all want resorts around the world for the occasional visit, but we want to buy at resorts at WDW (or DL), which puts DVC in a predicament such that it makes little sense to build resorts away from the parks.

 

[truecoat]

Looking good over at Disneyland.

 

[disneyflush]

Because being in my 40s (for some reason, most here picture me as over 60 or even 70 ... scary!) .

Totally just blew my mind. Always assumed you were in your 60s and a retired marketing/communications exec who had made a lot of contacts over the years. Being in your 40s...with your ability to see the overall picture from back in the 70s up through present day is a pretty unique/amazing gift. Cheers.

Now I'll find out @Lee is a 28 year old grad student at a Kentucky junior college and my entire worldview will shift.

 

[ford91exploder]

Indeed. Aulani was a disaster. Sales out of the gate were weak, and then they suddenly realized that member dues wouldn't cover operations. They had to yank sales and recalculate member dues increasing them significantly. This in turn hurt sales more and now we have the situation where it's still slowly selling 5 years later.

This led to the termination of Lewis and two other key Parks executives in what was described as a pretty shocking and abrupt move. It and the resurgence of Disneyland all but ended Disney's future attempts to go beyond the berm.

Disney Vacation Club has been particularly unimpressive since, with GF, Poly, and WL being the newest projects.

When his strategy and vision proved to be costly and underperforming, all it would take was a small issue to have him terminated. That came in the miscalculation.

DVC was far better under Jim Lewis, They did amazing projects however underperforming is context sensitive DVC has always made money but Burbank wants 'drug dealer' levels of profitability not simply making above average profits.

 

[Rodan75]

beautiful Animal Kingdom Villas, which the public was slow to embrace because of its incorrectly perceived "bad" location on the southwest corner of WDW property. (I still can't figure out why AKV resale prices are about the same as the massive, rather ho-hum SSR. Seriously, AKV is WDW's most beautiful resort.)

it is gorgeous and spacious, but somehow soulless outside of the main lobby. But I think the real issue is Transportation, every trip requires a bus. The bus ride from MK to AKV is a nightmare in a way that rides from other resorts aren't. And if I wanted to drive everywhere, I wouldn't stay on property.

Getting a non-bus transport option to AK at the very least, would help a lot IMO.

 

[HMF]

Something I've always noticed, a small detail I really love:

In the Pirates of the Caribbean movies, the first four movies (and the fifth one, if the poster's credits are any indication) have had "Based on Walt Disney's Pirates of the Caribbean" in the end credits and on the poster. I don't know if Disney's legally obligated to put that there or if they just do it out of respect but it makes me feel good.

It's a nice touch though it's only partially true.

 

[ford91exploder]

Totally just blew my mind. Always assumed you were in your 60s and a retired marketing/communications exec who had made a lot of contacts over the years. Being in your 40s...with your ability to see the overall picture from back in the 70s up through present day is a pretty unique/amazing gift. Cheers.

Now I'll find out @Lee is a 28 year old grad student at a Kentucky junior college and my entire worldview will shift.

Why is this surprising Spirit is a person who has visited the parks since he was a kid and has a long career in media so having a history of park visits going back 30 years or so like many of us is not terribly surprising and Disney does play an outsized role in US media.