A Spirited Perfect Ten

Brewmaster

Well-Known Member
I agree, but why would Disney care? They still make their money no matter what.

Sadly that seems to be the case, they generally don't. Backlash amongst the various social media zones can really move the needle for smaller (more responsive) businesses, but to a juggernaut like WDC it's merely a tsetse fly on their pachyderm posterior.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
I agree, but why would Disney care? They still make their money no matter what.

People often say that when talking about limited or collectable product because it does seem like a logical assumption. Disney makes the same scratch either way, right?

But you have to realize the reason for limited edition/collectable products to begin with - to entice collectors to jump through the hoops and go out of their way to collect the items. It's a fine line to walk - making something limited enough to make it desirable, but not so limited that folks just give up and say the entire endeavor isn't worth it.

If Disney just wanted to sell an item to make the most they wouldn't limit it at all - they'd just keep pressing out that pin/figure/print until everyone got their fill. But when the next pin/figure/print came out, there would be far less interest because folks would say, "Well, they are just going to make a zillion of them anyway" which either takes the rush out of needing to buy it, or in some cases the desire to buy it at all.

As to the site listed, yup, just like...another site about a Joyful Place does...or at least used to do. I haven't been there in years. People like that simply go to WDW, walk around the shops, take pics of everything, and then place the pics up as items (that they do not have) for sale in their online shops with a huge mark up. Then once or twice a week they take a "shopping trip" to buy the things that people have ordered and paid for - though they usually aren't that up front about it. (And often a decent amount of folks get refunds because the item is not longer there, etc.)

That's one reason I think you'll find Disney has been so aggressive at putting parks merchandise online - they have always sold nearly all of the non-limited product via mail order, but you had to know to call the Merchandise line and it was kind of "underground". At least now that $35 HM throw pillow can be bought directly from Disney at the regular over-priced price, not the over-priced and then scalper-tax added on top of it.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Sadly that seems to be the case, they generally don't. Backlash amongst the various social media zones can really move the needle for smaller (more responsive) businesses, but to a juggernaut like WDC it's merely a tsetse fly on their pachyderm posterior.

It all depends on what the media picks up, really. I am so tired of seeing "news" stories or what actually become scandals because a couple hundred or thousand Twits or FaceNerds type one line of agreement about something inane (usually something some tiny group or tiny portion of a group find "offensive") and it literally becomes news.

"7000 people 'signed' a petition asking that so-and-so step down because he made some comment 27 years ago that could be interpreted as discriminatory against singing green frogs." (Kermit - you better watch out!)

When you could get 7000 people on the Internet to "type type send" for five seconds in support of launching an investigation into if the moon is truly made of cheese.
 

asianway

Well-Known Member
This.
Why won't Disney enforce a purchase limit for these types of merch. It's really not that hard to say "limit 3 per person, per day", or something of that nature. It's not fail safe, but it's a deterrent. I detest parasites that turn a buck by manipulating the market this way (not specifically the disney collectables market, I'm looking at you beer traders)
For limited items-those most likely to be a money maker-they limit to 2. Everything else is 25,but DL ratcheted that back to 5 for 60th stuff.

I have no idea why someone would pay triple for an open stock popcorn bucket, a fool and his money?
 

hopemax

Well-Known Member
Because it's about Guest Service, not simply sales.

You also can't have another company competing with your online sales business too.

So what about the Soda Fountain? They clip everyone looking for Mickey Cohen's missing H?

Not when Disney fosters an environment where you are measured by your daily till. When everyone is in competition with each other, guest service doesn't enter the equation. I wish it was different, but it's been like this since the late 90s in terms of merchandise scalping, and very little done on Disney's side to change it.

I have errands to run, so I won't be able to explain the Soda Fountain until I get back. But it does involve the police.
 

asianway

Well-Known Member
Not when Disney fosters an environment where you are measured by your daily till. When everyone is in competition with each other, guest service doesn't enter the equation. I wish it was different, but it's been like this since the late 90s in terms of merchandise scalping, and very little done on Disney's side to change it.

I have errands to run, so I won't be able to explain the Soda Fountain until I get back. But it does involve the police.
Just saw another roller named *** hawking bootleg parade tshirts.

There's a difference between being enterprising yet sleazy and an IP thief.
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
People often say that when talking about limited or collectable product because it does seem like a logical assumption. Disney makes the same scratch either way, right?

But you have to realize the reason for limited edition/collectable products to begin with - to entice collectors to jump through the hoops and go out of their way to collect the items. It's a fine line to walk - making something limited enough to make it desirable, but not so limited that folks just give up and say the entire endeavor isn't worth it.

If Disney just wanted to sell an item to make the most they wouldn't limit it at all - they'd just keep pressing out that pin/figure/print until everyone got their fill. But when the next pin/figure/print came out, there would be far less interest because folks would say, "Well, they are just going to make a zillion of them anyway" which either takes the rush out of needing to buy it, or in some cases the desire to buy it at all.

As to the site listed, yup, just like...another site about a Joyful Place does...or at least used to do. I haven't been there in years. People like that simply go to WDW, walk around the shops, take pics of everything, and then place the pics up as items (that they do not have) for sale in their online shops with a huge mark up. Then once or twice a week they take a "shopping trip" to buy the things that people have ordered and paid for - though they usually aren't that up front about it. (And often a decent amount of folks get refunds because the item is not longer there, etc.)

That's one reason I think you'll find Disney has been so aggressive at putting parks merchandise online - they have always sold nearly all of the non-limited product via mail order, but you had to know to call the Merchandise line and it was kind of "underground". At least now that $35 HM throw pillow can be bought directly from Disney at the regular over-priced price, not the over-priced and then scalper-tax added on top of it.

When you flood the market with "limited edition" items I hardly consider them "limited edition."

I will admit there are some true limited edition items. I am not going to debate this but if you feel by something having the label "limited edition" on it makes it special you play right into their game.

The amount of LE pins and crap I have seen through discount outlets and property control proves this point. Why would any department pay for LE merchandise for giveaways to guests and clients if it was selling? Oh...it wasn't. Because it wasn't a LE specialty item. It was labeled LE to create flase buzz to sell it. Same concept of why the add FP to attractions that don't need it.

Once again...this is not all LE merchandise.
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
Because it's about Guest Service, not simply sales.

You also can't have another company competing with your online sales business too.

So what about the Soda Fountain? They clip everyone looking for Mickey Cohen's missing H?

Since when has Disney been about Guest Service and not simply sales? I agree with what you are saying but these online stores are small fries compared to the money Disney has already made off of the merchandise.

I think someone mentioned earlier it is ok if was CM doing it? If they use their Cast discount and resell it at a higher price I could see this as a violation of their benefits the same as selling their Maingate so probably not.

Oh yeah...you are ignoring me. smh
 

Brewmaster

Well-Known Member
It all depends on what the media picks up, really. I am so tired of seeing "news" stories or what actually become scandals because a couple hundred or thousand Twits or FaceNerds type one line of agreement about something inane (usually something some tiny group or tiny portion of a group find "offensive") and it literally becomes news.

"7000 people 'signed' a petition asking that so-and-so step down because he made some comment 27 years ago that could be interpreted as discriminatory against singing green frogs." (Kermit - you better watch out!)

When you could get 7000 people on the Internet to "type type send" for five seconds in support of launching an investigation into if the moon is truly made of cheese.

Agreed on all points there. I was referencing the line level interaction a small(er) business can/does have with its customer base through social media sites like Twitter et. al.. Of course that also assumes that the company cares what the loyal customer thinks and takes that into consideration when planning these type of releases.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Because it was for the same damn thing. The 'association ' is just how Disney could demand a premium because the of the exclusivity of such a unique opportunity. At the end of the day they were selling exposures... Same as a stadium naming deal. Which is very much alive... Theme parks aren't much different. What is different is there is a lot more competition diluting the value and exclusivity that once existed.

I'm really not sure why you are so testy or what it is you are arguing.

You are talking about very different types of sponsorship.

10M people visited Epcot last year.

What, 50M a week watch a NFL game? It's simply an expansion of advertising revenues. No one is under any delusion that the NFL needs that money to put on the game. Someone is just paying to see that name said during the program and not during the commercial breaks where folks might miss it while relieving themselves of their last beer or nacho order. It's also an advertisers dream because the audience is so targeted.

When it comes to stadium naming, it's often because construction on them is partially publicly funded or at least bonded, and generally building one is actually done at a loss to increase overall revenue/attractiveness of a municipality. This cost is off-set by naming rights, because going from the Fleet Center to the TD Banknorth Garden means someone is saying and advertising their name constantly on tickets, television, etc. (although in that case it's why most of us just refuse to call it anything but the Gah-den even today).

In any case, there is a stark difference between those (largely revolving around professional sports which are so heavily monetized with advertising it's nearly the entire point they exist in their current forms) and Disney claiming they "need" sponsors to fund paid attractions behind it's high dollar admission gates in privately owned parks in a privately owned resort with record profits. That's the excuse given for why WS hasn't had an attraction added in thirty years. It's even a lot different than Walt's Disneyland, which as I'm sure you know, actually did need the financial help to get built (folks have written books about it).

You can disagree with that, whatever - you are talking about mainly television advertising and civic construction projects. In any case, the entire point was that it isn't nearly as attractive to be a "partner" with the WDC on attractions as it once was, particularly in Epcot which was the mother-lode of sponsorship. Back when EPCOT was EPCOT and not Epcot, it was seen as an elite thing - companies/countries (or tourism boards within) were lining up.

That's no longer the case today - it's no longer a status symbol to be associated with a dated theme park. It was cool and hip thirty-five years ago to be part of Disney's grand EPCOT experiment. Now, being associated with Disney can be seen as much of a liability as it is a benefit (frequent conservative boycotts, image clashes, etc).

And again, the notion of Disney needing a sponsor in order to build something is absurd from the start, with the single location, untargeted advertising never really having the impact of what a big money sponsorship deals usually entail to begin with. They got away with it for a good long while, but most companies apparently wised up that dumping tens of millions of dollars into capital expenditures of another companies very profitable business didn't really do them any good, and certainty no longer brings the perceived prestige it once did.
 

asianway

Well-Known Member
Since when has Disney been about Guest Service and not simply sales? I agree with what you are saying but these online stores are small fries compared to the money Disney has already made off of the merchandise.

I think someone mentioned earlier it is ok if was CM doing it? If they use their Cast discount and resell it at a higher price I could see this as a violation of their benefits the same as selling their Maingate so probably not.

Oh yeah...you are ignoring me. smh
I said it's ok UNLESS a cm is doing it
 

Brewmaster

Well-Known Member
For limited items-those most likely to be a money maker-they limit to 2. Everything else is 25,but DL ratcheted that back to 5 for 60th stuff.

I have no idea why someone would pay triple for an open stock popcorn bucket, a fool and his money?

Thanks for the info, I was working on the assumption that it was a free for all. However, those secondary market sellers that have the ability will utilize 'mules' to flood the release and buy up as much as possible. Not much a business can do to combat that.
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
For limited items-those most likely to be a money maker-they limit to 2. Everything else is 25,but DL ratcheted that back to 5 for 60th stuff.

I have no idea why someone would pay triple for an open stock popcorn bucket, a fool and his money?

What is crazy too is that people always assume "limited edition" means a set limited number produced. Nope.

In the case of anniversaries and celebrations a "limited edition" means they will produce and sell as many as they can during that time. If they can sell a billion within an 18-month period how special is it?
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
When you flood the market with "limited edition" items I hardly consider them "limited edition."

I will admit there are some true limited edition items. I am not going to debate this but if you feel by something having the label "limited edition" on it makes it special you play right into their game.

I'm not telling you how I feel - I'm was explaining the thought processes that go on with those that purchase and are enticed by "limited edition" items. It's heavily psychological, a very large industry - one that Disney has clearly capitalized on in it's parks.

@PhotoDave219 is absolutely correct - in addition to the limited edition stuff (which does benefit somewhat from high resale prices, but as I said to begin with - it's a fine line to walk with folks that crazy to be interested in the first place), even just in general - it is not in Disney's best interest for folks to be hawking their wares at inflated resale prices for all sorts of reasons.

If you have $150 to spend on Disney merchandise, and you buy an item from someone for $150 that the WDC got $100 for, that's $50 of spending on Disney merchandise that Disney could have gotten. It also can leave a false impression when the consumer doesn't understand that the reason the items are so over-overpriced is because of the scalper selling it to you - yes, their own fault for being dumb, but the effect and perception back on the Disney brand stays the same nonetheless. No one ever claimed consumers were smart or savvy.

That's how it's looked at from a retail perspective. I agree, it's not the end of the world - it's one of those annoying gnats that the Internet has brought us. If it were up to Disney, it probably would not exist. It's not, so it happens.
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the info, I was working on the assumption that it was a free for all. However, those secondary market sellers that have the ability will utilize 'mules' to flood the release and buy up as much as possible. Not much a business can do to combat that.

Not to mention how many different locations can they hit in one day and by the time they get back to the first one is the first CM on break or gone or remembers them or cares? lol
 

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