A Spirited Perfect Ten

[PhotoDave219]

Random, I know, but wondering if the Shanghai Disney's Pirates ride vehicles have already been discussed here?

Have you asked the concierge's desk?

 

[LuvtheGoof]

That's one spectacular thing, for sure. But it doesn't increase the level of service that a hotel gives you. It may be an additional draw, and there are definitely folks who would agree that in that one instance, if you happen to be able to book one of those rooms, it has some value. You've managed to point out virtually the only outlier exception here, though.

It's also not being about a snob. I'm the opposite of a hotel snob. If it's a clean room where bugs aren't going to eat me and the bathroom is clean with running water (at least mildly warm) I'm a happy camper, so to speak.

The point is, Disney is selling and advertising luxury and world-class experience, is charging for it, and not offering what the industry standards are for those services.

Personally, I think anyone that spends $500 a night to stay anywhere that isn't in outer space or under water needs their head examined, period, no matter where they are - but when Disney charges that much but gives no additional service past a 3-star or 3.5 star chain, that's what we are talking about. Not being "snobby" but disguising what they actually offer as something it's not.

Value means something different to everyone, and so you don't see the value, but many of us do, and that's fine. Being a DVC member, I never actually pay for a room anymore, and we only stay in deluxe. We don't use the resort just to sleep in, as you do. We relax, hit the pool, read on the balcony with an excellent glass of wine, hit the lounge later in the afternoon, and usually have a nice sit-down for dinner. We never commando the parks from opening until closing.

Oh, and just because you don't think they deserve it, Disney is judged by an outside agency every year for every hotel and restaurant. So I guess Disney must have paid off AAA to get the diamond ratings that their hotels get? Here is the 4 diamond listing for Disney:

Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Jambo House (2011)
Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Kidani Village (2011)
Disney's Beach Club Resort (2003)
Disney’s BoardWalk Inn (2009)
Disney’s Contemporary Resort (2007)
Disney's Grand Floridian Resort & Spa (1989)
Disney’s Polynesian Village Resort (2007)
Disney’s Wilderness Lodge (2013)
Disney's Yacht Club Resort (1991)

AAA is an outside agency that evaluates them on their merits, NOT what YOU think it's worth.

 

[Shaman]

Probably not, and for the most part, you get what you pay for or are willing to pay for. If things are overpriced and you know it, yet, you still spit out the cash necessary to buy into it, then it is not Disney's fault and the true meaning of Caveat Emptor. There is another old time saying that goes with that as well, you can charge whatever the public is willing to pay for whatever you are offering. As long as you are not held at gunpoint, there is always another option.

So much this. It applies to the hotels and parks.

When I'm planning a trip I always hit the WDW website first. These days I expect to laugh at the so-called discounted rates I see for APers. And then I hit the Marriotts, Hyatts, Wyndhams. Sometimes it's an easy decision, sometimes not so much. A couple of times I have opted for vacations elsewhere (most recently a cruise) because it seemed like I would get more bang for my buck. Interestingly, I got a survey recently, when Disney noticed I was researching rates but didn't reserve. That was fun.

Honestly, I find myself considering if I should even renew my AP, but I probably will because of the little ones in the family which I enjoy hanging out with at the parks.

A couple of resorts aside, I personally feel that, Disney doesn't know the meaning of Deluxe.

But, if you build it, "they" will come.

 

[Phil12]

Well, we always found real value in staying at the Motel 6 for $47.00 a night and then hiking over to the All Star Movie Resort to catch the bus. We'd play a game with our children and tell them we were going on a Disney adventure. We'd then start hiking through the woods and climbing over various obstacles until we reached our destination. It was educational as well since the kids got to learn first hand the location of Reedy Creek and the best spots at which to cross.

Value means something different to everyone, and so you don't see the value, but many of us do, and that's fine. Being a DVC member, I never actually pay for a room anymore, and we only stay in deluxe. We don't use the resort just to sleep in, as you do. We relax, hit the pool, read on the balcony with an excellent glass of wine, hit the lounge later in the afternoon, and usually have a nice sit-down for dinner. We never commando the parks from opening until closing.

Oh, and just because you don't think they deserve it, Disney is judged by an outside agency every year for every hotel and restaurant. So I guess Disney must have paid off AAA to get the diamond ratings that their hotels get? Here is the 4 diamond listing for Disney:

Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Jambo House (2011)
Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Kidani Village (2011)
Disney's Beach Club Resort (2003)
Disney’s BoardWalk Inn (2009)
Disney’s Contemporary Resort (2007)
Disney's Grand Floridian Resort & Spa (1989)
Disney’s Polynesian Village Resort (2007)
Disney’s Wilderness Lodge (2013)
Disney's Yacht Club Resort (1991)

AAA is an outside agency that evaluates them on their merits, NOT what YOU think it's worth.

 

[Stevek]

We did concierge at the DL hotel for my 40th...got us a more expensive room and access to the concierge lounge which had random food, snacks and drinks and a nice view of the DL fireworks. To be fair, we didn't use if for the other possible concierge amenities but I personally wouldn't pay the price again for what we used or was offered.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

View attachment 92649
Well, we always found real value in staying at the Motel 6 for $47.00 a night and then hiking over to the All Star Movie Resort to catch the bus. We'd play a game with our children and tell them we were going on a Disney adventure. We'd then start hiking through the woods and climbing over various obstacles until we reached our destination. It was educational as well since the kids got to learn first hand the location of Reedy Creek and the best spots at which to cross.

And that's fine if that is your value. For us, we would never consider staying anyplace like this - ever. Consider us deluxe snobs and you would be right. Saying that, there is absolutely nothing wrong with your choice of where to stay. To each his/her own.

 

[bhg469]

So much this. It applies to the hotels and parks.

When I'm planning a trip I always hit the WDW website first. These days I expect to laugh at the so-called discounted rates I see for APers. And then I hit the Marriotts, Hyatts, Wyndhams. Sometimes it's an easy decision, sometimes not so much. A couple of times I have opted for vacations elsewhere (most recently a cruise) because it seemed like I would get more bang for my buck. Interestingly, I got a survey recently, when Disney noticed I was researching rates but didn't reserve. That was fun.

Honestly, I find myself considering if I should even renew my AP, but I probably will because of the little ones in the family which I enjoy hanging out with at the parks.

A couple of resorts aside, I personally feel that, Disney doesn't know the meaning of Deluxe.

But, if you build it, "they" will come.

Ugh, "They" are why we can't have nice things.

 

[flynnibus]

Oh, and just because you don't think they deserve it, Disney is judged by an outside agency every year for every hotel and restaurant. So I guess Disney must have paid off AAA to get the diamond ratings that their hotels get? Here is the 4 diamond listing for Disney:

Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Jambo House (2011)
Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Kidani Village (2011)
Disney's Beach Club Resort (2003)
Disney’s BoardWalk Inn (2009)
Disney’s Contemporary Resort (2007)
Disney's Grand Floridian Resort & Spa (1989)
Disney’s Polynesian Village Resort (2007)
Disney’s Wilderness Lodge (2013)
Disney's Yacht Club Resort (1991)

AAA is an outside agency that evaluates them on their merits, NOT what YOU think it's worth.

Least we forget... at the end of the day, AAA travel is a travel agent, not a critical industry judge. They have checklists and if you have these things, or other similar things, you get the checkbox. They are not really judging the effectiveness or quality of things.. but rather saying they have set things. So sure, the property gets good marks for having themeing, big pool, many, etc.. but doesn't actually say anything about value/dollar... or the quality of services offered, etc.

No one denies Disney has a large range of offerings at the deluxe resorts... but so does Walmart. That doesn't make Walmart a top end experience or the best at customer service.

Offering a service and excelling at it are two different things - and no that is not captured in stupid AAA ratings (coming from a AAA member for over 25 years). AAA ratings are about 'what services to expect a property offers' - not 'how good a property is at delivering'.

 

[tribbleorlfl]

That's not my point. I'm not talking about "kiddie" attractions. I'm talking about seeing things through a child's eyes as a way to keep them fresh. I LOVED Peter Pan's Flight when I was a kid. Then I lived in Orlando as a pass holder for three years, rode it a ton if times, and got sick of it. When I went on with my daughter this year, it was like riding for the first time.

 

[Phil12]

And that's fine if that is your value. For us, we would never consider staying anyplace like this - ever. Consider us deluxe snobs and you would be right. Saying that, there is absolutely nothing wrong with your choice of where to stay. To each his/her own.

I think the important part was the educational value for the children. Teaching them that if they lost their sense of direction in the woods all they had to do was listen for the heavy traffic sounds coming from Rt. 192. And that if they wanted hike up to the MK all they had to do is remember that moss grows on the north side of trees. Those are the kinds of lessons that remain with you for your entire life.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

Least we forget... at the end of the day, AAA travel is a travel agent, not a critical industry judge. They have checklists and if you have these things, or other similar things, you get the checkbox. They are not really judging the effectiveness or quality of things.. but rather saying they have set things. So sure, the property gets good marks for having themeing, big pool, many, etc.. but doesn't actually say anything about value/dollar... or the quality of services offered, etc.

No one denies Disney has a large range of offerings at the deluxe resorts... but so does Walmart. That doesn't make Walmart a top end experience or the best at customer service.

Offering a service and excelling at it are two different things - and no that is not captured in stupid AAA ratings (coming from a AAA member for over 25 years). AAA ratings are about 'what services to expect a property offers' - not 'how good a property is at delivering'.

Actually, you are quite wrong on this. Here is an excerpt from the AAA Diamond Ratings Guidelines:
A high level of guest services is the hallmark of the coveted AAA Four and Five Diamond Ratings. All properties must first match the physical guidelines respective of the Four or Five Diamond levels to qualify for a series of anonymous visits by AAA inspectors. Our overnight hospitality assessment includes a review of twelve critical areas and measures approximately 300 guest interaction points. All properties must achieve at least a Four Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Four Diamond Rating overall; similarly, a property must achieve a Five Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Five Diamond Rating overall.

As you can see from their guidelines, a series of anonymous visits by them determines whether a property is given a 4 or 5 diamond rating. Which includes guest services. Walmart would never qualify.

 

[Funmeister]

Something strange is afoot at the Circle K!

 

[PhotoDave219]

Actually, you are quite wrong on this. Here is an excerpt from the AAA Diamond Ratings Guidelines:
A high level of guest services is the hallmark of the coveted AAA Four and Five Diamond Ratings. All properties must first match the physical guidelines respective of the Four or Five Diamond levels to qualify for a series of anonymous visits by AAA inspectors. Our overnight hospitality assessment includes a review of twelve critical areas and measures approximately 300 guest interaction points. All properties must achieve at least a Four Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Four Diamond Rating overall; similarly, a property must achieve a Five Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Five Diamond Rating overall.

As you can see from their guidelines, a series of anonymous visits by them determines whether a property is given a 4 or 5 diamond rating. Which includes guest services. Walmart would never qualify.

I'm holding out for five diamond and complimentary "turn down" service. (See also "Ophelia" in keeping with the trading spaces jokes)

 

[MKCP 1985]

Phil, you are making me laugh with your description of going off-road to catch the value bus. You really can find anyone to do just about anything on these forums!

We are not so different though. Where you stay off site and tromp through the woods to get free transportation to the parks, I stay offsite and use back roads to drive to places that offer free parking (sometimes). We do the same things, in essence, only at different price points.

 

[flynnibus]

As you can see from their guidelines, a series of anonymous visits by them determines whether a property is given a 4 or 5 diamond rating. Which includes guest services. Walmart would never qualify.

I didn't say anything to the contrary... I know they visit the properties. But for most of the rankings these are checklists and not critical judgments. This is 'do you have X' more than anything. Only when it comes to the rankings they hold tight like the 5 diamond is it really nickpicky. Then you need to overlook the biases... etc. They rate so many properties it's mainly down to a formula of requirements and scores for y/n.

If you want a rundown of what they look for in their checklists.. simply read through this
http://newsroom.aaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/diamondguidelinesDec08.pdf

To keep things in perspective... A Super 8 motel can be a 2 two diamond... which pop century is as well. A springhill suites can be a three diamond alongside a higher end marriot. It's all about hitting the checkboxes, not necessarily measuring if a property excels.

They are nice to gauge what a hotel offers... but don't replace your actual judgement of what services you actually get.

 

[Cesar R M]

Have you asked the concierge's desk?

then I imagine dave going all:

 

[Cesar R M]

Value means something different to everyone, and so you don't see the value, but many of us do, and that's fine. Being a DVC member, I never actually pay for a room anymore, and we only stay in deluxe. We don't use the resort just to sleep in, as you do. We relax, hit the pool, read on the balcony with an excellent glass of wine, hit the lounge later in the afternoon, and usually have a nice sit-down for dinner. We never commando the parks from opening until closing.

Oh, and just because you don't think they deserve it, Disney is judged by an outside agency every year for every hotel and restaurant. So I guess Disney must have paid off AAA to get the diamond ratings that their hotels get? Here is the 4 diamond listing for Disney:

Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Jambo House (2011)
Disney’s Animal Kingdom Villas - Kidani Village (2011)
Disney's Beach Club Resort (2003)
Disney’s BoardWalk Inn (2009)
Disney’s Contemporary Resort (2007)
Disney's Grand Floridian Resort & Spa (1989)
Disney’s Polynesian Village Resort (2007)
Disney’s Wilderness Lodge (2013)
Disney's Yacht Club Resort (1991)

AAA is an outside agency that evaluates them on their merits, NOT what YOU think it's worth.

AKL definitively deserves the merit.. their theming is superb.

Not so much (imho) for the Contemporary or the poly nowadays... (too much constructions? areas blocked? lowered quality in the restaurants?)

 

[LuvtheGoof]

I didn't say anything to the contrary... I know they visit the properties. But for most of the rankings these are checklists and not critical judgments. This is 'do you have X' more than anything. Only when it comes to the rankings they hold tight like the 5 diamond is it really nickpicky. Then you need to overlook the biases... etc. They rate so many properties it's mainly down to a formula of requirements and scores for y/n.

If you want a rundown of what they look for in their checklists.. simply read through this
http://newsroom.aaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/diamondguidelinesDec08.pdf

To keep things in perspective... A Super 8 motel can be a 2 two diamond... which pop century is as well. A springhill suites can be a three diamond alongside a higher end marriot. It's all about hitting the checkboxes, not necessarily measuring if a property excels.

They are nice to gauge what a hotel offers... but don't replace your actual judgement of what services you actually get.

Check boxes are there to keep the ratings consistent and objective from one property to the next. You obviously have a bias that AAA doesn't.

 

[MKCP 1985]

Actually, you are quite wrong on this. Here is an excerpt from the AAA Diamond Ratings Guidelines:
A high level of guest services is the hallmark of the coveted AAA Four and Five Diamond Ratings. All properties must first match the physical guidelines respective of the Four or Five Diamond levels to qualify for a series of anonymous visits by AAA inspectors. Our overnight hospitality assessment includes a review of twelve critical areas and measures approximately 300 guest interaction points. All properties must achieve at least a Four Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Four Diamond Rating overall; similarly, a property must achieve a Five Diamond Rating in guest services to be considered for a Five Diamond Rating overall.

As you can see from their guidelines, a series of anonymous visits by them determines whether a property is given a 4 or 5 diamond rating. Which includes guest services. Walmart would never qualify.

So despite the cost, none of the exalted Disney properties have been awarded the AAA Five Diamond Ratings. But the Ritz-Carlton Orlando Grande Lakes has. I just found a room there for a Saturday night in June for $195.00, but the usual rates for that same night are about $300 and a suite can be had for about $600 per night.

So, what does that say for the prices at the Polynesian and the Grand Floridian? My recollection of those properties' rack rates the last time I checked was substantially more. Do you agree?

It tells me that if I choose to stay on-site at the Poly or GF, I am paying for the monorail and the view of the Magic Kingdom park but I am not getting the very best of luxury accommodations. Isn't that what you were really talking about? Whether Disney's flagship hotels are incomparable to off site offerings? Disney's great, but there's better to be had.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

AKL definitively deserves the merit.. their theming is superb.

Not so much (imho) for the Contemporary or the poly nowadays... (too much constructions? areas blocked? lowered quality in the restaurants?)

Just because a resort is going through construction, does not equate to lesser service.