Do you think that Disney world will reclose its gates due to the rising number of COVID cases in Florida and around the country?

DisneyCane

Well-Known Member
Its funny cause in Erie they have people going to the low income areas handing out masks and talking to the people and making them informed. Yet another thing that can be done to help slow the spread.

I have to ask @legwand77 @DisneyCane @LUVMCO tell me why making masks mandatory, fining people and businesses who don't comply with social distancing and going into low income neighborhoods and handing out masks won't work.
Because the people in many low income neighborhoods in the US don't like the "government" coming in to tell them what to do. Businesses should be fined for not enforcing rules. In Florida they shut some down. Personal fines would require laws passed to be legal.
 

kong1802

Well-Known Member
The questioning did not happen because it wasn't happening then. The heavy back filling didn't start until end of June when the CDC changed guidance.

Who would question why is it raining on a sunny day?

So you are saying you changed your mind based off of new information....

Interesting concept.
 

legwand77

Well-Known Member
A google search says otherwise.

View attachment 485796

That chart spells disgraceful no matter which way you spin it.

Let's do Florida since this is a Disney board. All Florida DOH stats

florida-covid-case-testi.png

florida-covid-case-testi(1).png
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Since when am I against limited capacity for restaurants? Are there not a huge number of people working from home in Florida/the US? Has the guidance since March not been to stay at home if you are sick? Are workplaces not screening people for symptoms? I haven't seen anybody that appeared sick working anywhere for months.

There, I brought it up. The poster I replied to is suggesting that strict full lockdowns are the right thing to do and would have "smashed" the virus if they were done in Florida. I brought up Sweden because they didn't do that.

I have said since the beginning that all businesses should be allowed to operate as long as they can implement social distancing and sanitary guidelines.
If Florida followed the Swedish approach then Walt Disney World would not have been allowed to reopen.
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
Because the people in many low income neighborhoods in the US don't like the "government" coming in to tell them what to do. Businesses should be fined for not enforcing rules. In Florida they shut some down. Personal fines would require laws passed to be legal.
So again just don't do anything. In Erie PA it wasn't government officials handing out masks, it was people that live in Erie doing it.
 

carolina_yankee

Well-Known Member
You missed the bit that said Florida on my post. Keep spinning it. It’s an absolute disgraceful shambles for a developed nation.

I agree with your point. However, the numbers do indicate a potential easing. Using the 14 day numbers posted in the other thread of daily updates, the previous 7-day period had 82,257 new cases and the current 7 day period has 73,792 cases, about 9,000 less. Spot positivity is all over the map (and is up again today, as are new cases compared to the last two days). Deaths are increasing, but are also a lagging indicator, so would likely increase and then decrease well after new cases started decreasing.

My whole thing with Disney closing is I don't see the point unless other places also close. Nearly a third of the nation and most of the world can't get there anyway. Now, if staying open isn't working financially, that's a different but related argument. If their protocols aren't working and they are the source of infections that has so far escaped the public radar, then sure.

Regardless, I'm sure Disney is analyzing numbers every which way, financial and health, and will make a decision that is in their best interest, and hopefully everybody else's, whatever that decision may be.
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Let's do Florida since this is a Disney board. All Florida DOH stats

View attachment 485800
View attachment 485801

The data is all over the place probably due to the lags and possibly errors in reporting, but if we are to believe this data, the trend is percent positive is going down. This is good! You can’t really argue against that when you consider FL is opening and not locked in their houses.
 

havoc315

Well-Known Member
You are making the leap that 90% of the virus is eliminated. It is highly possible that the 90% still happens, it just gets spread out.

Examine the logic of what you're saying -- Yes, if there were never vaccines and never improved treatments... then the effect might be just to spread it out.. and the people will die in 2021 and 2022, instead of everyone dying in 2020.
But if you develop vaccines and improved treatments -- And you "spread" those infections out so they would occur in 2021 or 2022, instead of right now -- Then you have vaccines and improved treatments, you save millions of lives!

It is also possible that some of that gets stopped if/when there is an effective and widely available vaccine. If one of the current phase 3 vaccines works and is widely available then flattening and elongating could lead to an overall lower number at the expense of unsustainable economic damage. However, what if these vaccines don't work and it takes another two years to get one that does?

Lots of "what ifs." But our scientists are very confident they will have at least a partially effective vaccine by late 2020, early 2021.

You also I'm not sure you can compare the peaks in Spain to the current peak in Florida. I can't find a chart for Spain but going from memory of the testing numbers for Spain, Florida is testing a higher percentage of the population per day now than Spain did at the peak. Florida is likely finding a higher percentage of actual cases now than Spain did at their peak.

At times., Spain was doing far more testing than Florida. At times maybe less. I wouldn't try to make it an exact comparison, down to the exact number of cases. It's very very very clear that Spain's case load was driven way way down.

BTW, why is Spain's drastic recent increase not a concern or a sign that the lockdowns didn't work as long term solution? Also, Sweden didn't lock down at all or implement mask requirements (at least as of a few weeks ago for masks) and their daily death number has continued to drop since the peak. Their daily cases also have dropped since a "spike" that lasted most of June.

There are so many factors at play that contribute to death numbers.... improved therapies will reduce death numbers, even as cases increase. Further, as you said above, I don't know whether cases are actually increasing in Spain now, or just testing is capturing a greater percentage of the cases. And we know, if more of the spread tilts younger, deaths may still somewhat decline. Finally, we know deaths are a lagging indicator -- the case increase in Spain is all over the last 1-2 weeks, so wouldn't expect to see it impacting death numbers yet.

Sweden -- something is very wrong with their data. They stopped reporting most of their data. And their strategy resulted in the absolute highest mortality in their region.

Now as to Spain's recent increase -- When did I say it wasn't a concern? A single lockdown, even done right, doesn't necessarily become a permanent long term solution. One of the reasons you keep testing (and contact tracing) is to quickly identify and respond to potential spikes. Depending on the type of spike, it may require different responses. May require a further lockdown in a more specific location, may require a re-evaluation of the operation of a specific industry, etc.
 

schuelma

Well-Known Member
The data is all over the place probably due to the lags and possibly errors in reporting, but if we are to believe this data, the trend is percent positive is going down. This is good! You can’t really argue against that when you consider FL is opening and not locked in their houses.

Its all over the place and any decline is very slight. Its certainly not clearly trending down. If this is Florida's new normal for the summer, we will see weekly deaths over ONE THOUSAND in Florida alone for weeks.
 

DisneyCane

Well-Known Member
If Florida followed the Swedish approach then Walt Disney World would not have been allowed to reopen.

I was using Sweden as compared to a full strict lockdown in a debate with @havoc315 not as a be all, end all conclusion on the Swedish exact measures.
No. It means I think anyone who spins anything positive from this at the moment are full of it.

There's nothing "positive" about the situation. However, it isn't the worst pandemic to ever hit humanity and isn't the apocalypse either. Life doesn't need to completely stop in response and WDW can operate as currently configured without endangering the population.
 

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