The Spirited 8th Wonder (WDW's Future & You!)

[GiveMeTheMusic]

'Defense of mediocrity', 'Voice of sanity'. Whatever.

You think less frequent visitors should be subjected to 20+ year old community theater masquerading as "professional entertainment" just because they haven't seen it before?

Providing something fresh, new and top of the line for all of your guests used to be Disney's MO. Now? 20 years for a show or parade is standard, regardless of how embarrassing it is.

There's no excuse for crappy product in any business, and Disney is no exception.

 

[Mike S]

Vehemently defends? My basic positions in that thread were as follows: Maelstrom isn't as awesome as you guys are claiming AND I think that Frozen is a pretty good match to Norway.

I guess that anyone who isn't decrying every single decision that TPTB make must be 'vehemently defending' them, in your mind.

No one says Maelstrom is awesome. I've loved the ride since childhood and even I don't say it's awesome (it's good). It could be better though if they would just do a PROPER refurb that keeps in theme with actual Norwegian folklore, not Frozen.

 

[jt04]

Dad, I am sure you feel that the acts and comments of some of the posters here are worn and tired.....so is yours. Fact is it is a shopping mall with a Disney slant put on it. Nothing more....nothing less. Just because its getting some plastic surgery doesn't change what it is. The new face lift doesn't make it unique, another fact is that none of us knows exactly what the list of clients and their stores will be. That said food trucks and an Apple store surely isn't unique. The fact that it draws huge crowds isn't much of an indicator also. Very much like my local mall you can go on a Friday night and the place is packed. But you just don't see very many people carrying packages. Its a social gathering of sorts.

Just lie any other shopping venue we will be able to tell how successful the new lifestyle center will be in a few years when we see how much turn over will happen among the vendors. The problem with the old DTD when it did have unique stores and merchandise....no one bought anything. So they dummied down the merch to mass produced crap. They decided to go after a different clientele.

But wait! was this the customers fault or was it the clientele that Disney was going after in their parks also? Disney has changed the way they do business. The top 1%ers and even the faux 1%ers don't mind spending money if there is value. A uniqueness in that value. The client Disney is going after will not buy a $800 lithograph. But they will buy an $18 snowman plush. Uniqueness cost money something Disney is opposed to when there isn't a quick ROI.

So @WDWDad13 explain to us how DS is unique? Explain how it isn't like anyother mall in America? Instead of the tired snark comments why don't you come in here and give a intelligent argument...try something ...ummmm unique.

Name one other place like it. Especially after the new work. Disney never claimed they were reinventing the wheel or building another theme park. But they may be creating the greatest entertainment and shopping district in the US. That includes a world-class Cirque show and a Disney Quest which are both popular and already make it unlike any other mall right there.

 

[dadddio]

I understand where your coming from. But after twenty years just maybe start thinking about changing it up. I agree some things are iconic. SOmethings I never want to see changed....others I think they need to be changed like the BatB show. I think its had its run. We can all argue weather certain attractions have been updated for the better but even Disney has updated them. Look at DTD in itself....its being "updated" I think where the problems are is "how" its updated. But like most things we cant please everybody.

I completely agree with your post. The nugget that sticks out the most is the very last sentence.

 

[Mike S]

I guess that you are right, if you lap up every spoonful that the OP feeds you.

I guess you're right too, if you lap up every spoonful that Disney feeds you.

 

[theRIOT]

Hey, that's our favorite outlet! I believe all the "________ Premium Outlets" follow the same basic design, with local flourishes tossed in (Palms in FL, Craftsman-style details out west). The ones in Cincy are a bit generic, but what type of local influence could we expect? A plate of Skyline?

As long as it's Skyline and not that rip-off Gold Star.

 

[dadddio]

You think less frequent visitors should be subjected to 20+ year old community theater masquerading as "professional entertainment" just because they haven't seen it before?

Providing something fresh, new and top of the line for all of your guests used to be Disney's MO. Now? 20 years for a show or parade is standard, regardless of how embarrassing it is.

There's no excuse for crappy product in any business, and Disney is no exception.

What are you going on about? Are you making up fake things to argue about?

Obviously, I don't think that it would be ok if Disney's shows were 'community theater', but that's not what they are so I'm not sure what your point is. BTW, I'm against rats in the kitchen and roaches in the rooms, also. Luckily, I've never seen those things. If only they could do something about the water. Let's whine about that for a while.

 

[SandraAnn]

I wouldn't have a problem with the price for admission...if for a few things.

Upkeep the parks.
Upkeep the rides/queues.
Do something about your frontline workers. Treat them better, pay them better, demand excellence.
Do something about guests who act like idiots.

In the last 5 years the decline in all of those areas has been noticeable. To the point that we are not planning on doing our annual trip there next year or any year in the near future.

Yeah, I agree some of the rides need some help. I think the parks themselves look fine. I've never had a bad experience with a CM.

I guess my point was that I don't feel overly ripped off by the WDW ticket price, even with the parks the way the are right now (I do agree that there is room for improvement). In contrast, I actually feel ashamed after paying their prices for food or their resorts...that's how bad the quality is IMO.

 

[jt04]

You think less frequent visitors should be subjected to 20+ year old community theater masquerading as "professional entertainment" just because they haven't seen it before?

Providing something fresh, new and top of the line for all of your guests used to be Disney's MO. Now? 20 years for a show or parade is standard, regardless of how embarrassing it is.

There's no excuse for crappy product in any business, and Disney is no exception.

Any show, parade or attraction that they seek to change will always be met with protest with those that have a sentimental attachment to it. (see maelstrom for instance). And these boards will quickly fill with complaints from people who think things should never change. And others, like me, who think change is usually for the best will defend most ideas. But look at how those who suggest IaSW be moved or Frozen installed in Norway or Pandora added to DAK are ridiculed.

Disney should just deliberately go about doing what it thinks is in the overall best interest of guests because that is how it will remain successful.

 

[wm49rs]

Any show, parade or attraction that they seek to change will always be met with protest with those that have a sentimental attachment to it. (see maelstrom for instance). And these boards will quickly fill with complaints from people who think things should never change. And others, like me, who think change is usually for the best will defend most ideas. But look at how those who suggest IaSW be moved or Frozen installed in Norway or Pandora added to DAK are ridiculed.

Disney should just deliberately go about doing what it thinks is in the overall best interest of guests because that is how it will remain successful.

Not "those who suggest IASW be moved." Just you....

And "those" who have a sentimental relationship to a ride and/or attraction are those who have experienced it, especially in the recent past. Not you....

 

[GrammieBee]

If you want to enjoy WDW you have to take it as it is. Not how you remember it was or how you wish it to be. We like to stay on property because of the convenience and a certain pixie dust ambience even if the rooms are overpriced.

Anyway, we cancelled a three week stay at the Boardwalk Inn this Fall because we didn't like it the way DWD is currently. Too crowded, didn't feel like messing with the new fast pass system, despite the low occupancy rate were not sure we could get a room discount and too many construction walls. We will be spending our money on a cruise, time at the shore and a Fall visit to Sea World and Universal. If you think our not being there will matter to Disney, I've got a bridge to sell you. It would take a mass exodis of customers for Disney to notice and I don't see that happening.

Ah, well, despite everything, we will probably go back next Fall.

 

[Tigger1988]

Why are we talking about Malestrom? Didn't @WDW1974 request that petty fights that have been played out a dozen times stay OUT of this new thread?

 

[ParentsOf4]

I guess that you are right, if you lap up every spoonful that the OP feeds you.

I don't need to consider what the OP wrote. All I have to do is look at the numbers.

Disney's Parks & Resorts (P&R) investments have been at record low levels under Iger.

With the notable exception of Cars Land, which reportedly was ramrodded through despite Rasulo's objection, most of Disney's P&R investments under Iger have been in cruise ships or overseas.

Since Iger took charge at the beginning of FY2006, WDW has generated roughly $50B in revenue, yet the only appreciable capital investments (vs. required FF&E and capital maintenance) have been MyMagic+ (which mostly was a long overdue infrastructure upgrade required due to deferred capital maintenance resulting from Disney's constant attempts in recent years to squeeze out pennies), the New Fantasyland, and Toy Story Mania (TSM).

Essentially, we've spent $50 Billion over 8 years and received the $425M New Fantasyland and the $80M TSM in return. For anyone who's counting, that's about 1%.

The amount of money being reinvested in WDW's theme parks under Iger is insulting to paying customers.

The OP's rumor is completely consistent with corporate Disney's behavior during Iger's entire tenure.

 

[jt04]

I don't need to consider what the OP wrote. All I have to do is look at the numbers.

Disney's Parks & Resorts (P&R) investments have been at record low levels under Iger.

With the notable exception of Cars Land, which reportedly was ramrodded through despite Rasulo's objection, most of Disney's P&R investments under Iger have been in cruise ships or overseas.

Since Iger took charge at the beginning of FY2006, WDW has generated roughly $50B in revenue, yet the only appreciable capital investments (vs. required FF&E and capital maintenance) have been MyMagic+ (which mostly was a long overdue infrastructure upgrade required due to deferred capital maintenance resulting from Disney's constant attempts in recent years to squeeze out pennies), the New Fantasyland, and Toy Story Mania (TSM).

Essentially, we've spent $50 Billion over 8 years and received the $425M New Fantasyland and the $80M TSM in return. For anyone who's counting, that's about 1%.

The amount of money being reinvested in WDW's theme parks under Iger is insulting to paying customers.

Do you have the numbers for what has been spent on infrastructure and restorations under Iger? I know they have been playing catch-up after years of neglect by previous management.

 

[SandraAnn]

As an experienced DVC member, I can tell you that the villas are truly hit or miss. To date, I have yet to receive a room that was just okay; my villas have either been good or very worn. Our best experiences have been at Animal Kingdom Villas - Jambo House. These villas are mainly comprised of darker colored fabrics and woods, which better hide their wear.

Do you really want to know Disney's best kept secret? DVC villas are average, extended stay suites that are not well maintained. This, truly, is the secret.

That is what they are indeed, well-said. In the case of BCV/BWV/BLT, the great location helps you overlook a lot.

We have started staying at other timeshare resorts in Orlando and it's the same thing really. But paying a lot less helps with satisfaction.

 

[ScoutN]

Yet it's a STANDARD room Obviously Disney can not demo and start over with properties every decade to keep up with the latest 'new guy on the block' - but the point was to illustrate more contemporary designs and show that Disney's "rehabs" people gush over are at best attempting to keep up with trends.. instead of creating them.

If people want another comparison closer to home for Disney... The Raddison LBV.. which is right next to Crossroads basically (Horrible traffic area tho!).

View attachment 59420

This huge room easily slept my family of five comfortably and had modern amenities in the bathroom like a basin sink, etc. The rate on the web right now for a room tomorrow.. $139

For ROOMS... Disney's generally lack. I'm not saying they need to match this price... location is worth paying for... but services and rooms? Disney is way behind.

Stayed there this Spring for the 4th or 5th time. Great go to place!

 

[jt04]

That is what they are indeed, well-said. In the case of BCV/BWV/BLT, the great location helps you overlook a lot.

We have started staying at other timeshare resorts in Orlando and it's the same thing really. But paying a lot less helps with satisfaction.

Do DVC members staying on WDW property get the same perks as regular resort guests staying at WDW?

 

[ScoutN]

Now, give me a minute to stand behind a wall because DVC members are going to begin to hurl rocks at me.

Nah, even though there are strong differing opinions, WDWm typically has the saner of the Disney fan crowd (minus a few obvious nuts).

 

[flynnibus]

Since Iger took charge at the beginning of FY2006, WDW has generated roughly $50B in revenue, yet the only appreciable capital investments (vs. required FF&E and capital maintenance) have been MyMagic+ (which mostly was a long overdue infrastructure upgrade required due to deferred capital maintenance resulting from Disney's constant attempts in recent years to squeeze out pennies), the New Fantasyland, and Toy Story Mania (TSM).

That's not fair

These have been resorts, dvcs, shows (like castle show), attractions, transportation expansions (bus depot, alt bus testing), plussing of attractions (not just rehabs), and many more. No they aren't things on the scale of carsland but to talk in extremes like that does not convey an accurate picture.

 

[culturenthrills]

Ummmmm don't you think there is a smidge of contradiction in your post?....maybe just a little?



Bowling alley....unique? When was the last time Cirque changed shows? Cirque comes to my town a couple times a year. DQ? surely you gest.

There is nothing wrong with La Nouba. It is one of the best Cirque shows out there. They have changed up some of the acts over the years. It has one of the best finale's of any Cirque show.