EPCOT Test Track to be reimagined

[wbostic12]

What’s the Memphis referring to? I’ve never smelled BBQ or seen mallard ducks in the indoor fountains? (I’m being silly but genuinely interested)

As a Memphian myself, I appreciate this way of thinking.

 

[marni1971]

So now, the expectation with Disney is that you’re going to see your family’s favorite characters. You’re going to see Tiana, Anna, Star-Lord. Because that’s what Disney is to that family.

So put it in the appropriate place.

 

[Moth]

Still impressed on the TRON and GOTG fumble. Absolutely the worst mix-up of all time on where IPs should go.

 

[Brer Panther]

IP Based:

1. Guardians of the Galaxy: Cosmic Rewind
2. Seas with Nemo and Friends
3. Journey of Water Inspired by Moana
4. Ratatouille
5. Frozen
6. Three Caballeros
7. Beauty and the Beast Sing Along
8. Celebracion Encanto

Non-IP Based:

1. Spaceship Earth
2. Mission Space
3. Test Track
4. Journey into Imagination
5. Soarin
6. Living with the Land
7. Impressions de France
8. Reflections of China
9. Canada: Far and Wide

And who knows how long those non-IP based rides are going to STAY non-IP with Iger in charge? Apparently they might be considering turning Living With the Land into an Zootopia ride.

So put it in the appropriate place.

Yes. This is something that Disney seems not to get.

Ratatouille in the France pavilion? Fits fine, even if the attraction itself sucks.

Encanto and Indiana Jones in Animal Kingdom? Does not fit.

 

[etc98]

Still impressed on the TRON and GOTG fumble. Absolutely the worst mix-up of all time on where IPs should go.

The Tron box next to Space Mountain already looks bad, I can’t even imagine what the Guardians box would look like next to Space

 

[OptimusPrime]

And who knows how long those non-IP based rides are going to STAY non-IP with Iger in charge? Apparently they might be considering turning Living With the Land into an Zootopia ride.

That was a joke someone made. You’re fighting air right now

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

That was a joke someone made. You’re fighting air right now

That was not a joke.

 

[James Alucobond]

Encanto and Indiana Jones in Animal Kingdom? Does not fit.

Encanto and IJ look to be having the most effort put into them to make them fit out of literally all the things announced for WDW, so continuing to whine about them endlessly in every topic (related or not) is not especially productive. People would generally complain far less if other attractions had equal effort put into reworking the surrounding land to make things feel cohesive.

 

[MisterPenguin]

What’s the Memphis referring to? I’ve never smelled BBQ or seen mallard ducks in the indoor fountains? (I’m being silly but genuinely interested)

Oversized geometric architecture and furniture with solid blocks of color in teal, tomato soup orange, and primary accents.

The Swolphin's interior was envisioned as striped seaside cabana-tents blown up way out of proportion. That's all gone from the lobbies now. But, if you enter the Dolphin lakeside, on the ground floor and going up the escalators, you can still see those elements.

Also, the outside of the Dolphin is supposed to be a an island raise out of the sea, and it's just a triangle -- in teal and orange.

Welcome to Memphis!

 

[Quietmouse]

And who knows how long those non-IP based rides are going to STAY non-IP with Iger in charge? Apparently they might be considering turning Living With the Land into an Zootopia ride.

Yes. This is something that Disney seems not to get.

Ratatouille in the France pavilion? Fits fine, even if the attraction itself sucks.

Encanto and Indiana Jones in Animal Kingdom? Does not fit.

Couldn’t disagree more. The land itself is fine and if they themed around jungles/adventure/animals then it will fit just fine.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

They're not wasting any time here. Maybe this really will be ready by next July.

 

[Mr. Sullivan]

would an ip free Epcot survive in this day and age ? I look at my own kids as an example, and I genuinely think they would be board out of their minds with the majority of the rides Epcot had to offer back then outside of journey into your imagination.

The real answer is no, but I know that’s hard pill to swallow. I’m a major EPCOT fan, wish more than anything that I got to experience most of the original stuff, but the truth is that we don’t get any element of the park’s core ideas and themes, even fleeting ones, without the inclusion of IP.

That’s not even necessarily all Disney’s choice. The guests actively want that. The percentage of people hungry for OLDCOT style attractions with no IP and such is far dwarfed by the percentage of people who aren’t.

But beyond that, time just caught up to EPCOT in the same way it did Tomorrowland. The future gets here eventually and it just isn’t workable to come in and redo attractions every 10 or 15 years when the world catches up to their views of tomorrow. All of the muses of tomorrow of those classic EPCOT rides have been passed.

The original ones that remain either rooted themselves mostly in the past (SSE, though it does touch on tomorrow, it is mainly a look back) or deal with ideas relevant to today (LWtL).

That combined with the demands of I’d say a solid 95-97% of the guests visiting these parks is what has changed EPCOT.

The original EPCOT was wonderful. Iconic. But no, it would not survive in 2024. In some other timeline maybe but the world we live in showed that the future EPCOT looked to just was never going to come to fruition and it would make those attractions seem very out of place these days.

It’s hard to remember now but there was a time when EPCOT was viewed as a dying place and that was right when they began this almost 25 year cycle now of tinkering with it. Had they just let it sit any longer I honestly think EPCOT would look even less like it’s original self today.

What the audiences want changed. We cannot sit here and say “it worked then” and still blindly believe it would now. It wouldn’t. The audience of 1981 and the audience of 2024 are not the same. Time changes all cultures. What the people who participate in that culture, especially pop culture, want changes.

Disney fans, and EPCOT fans in general; just have to remember that they are but a small drop of water in a large sea. Disney cannot, and should not, cater just to us. If they did, these parks would one day cease to exist because what we want is not always (in fact rarely) is not going to align with what the majority wants.

Disney parks are parks for the majority. They always have been, that was Walt’s whole point. He didn’t anticipate the parks picking up a dedicated fandom, and you know I doubt he’d be playing right to them even he became aware of one had he lived to see it.

I understand Disney Adults are attached to these places and their memories of them. That’s what makes us Disney Adults.

But we cannot be selfish, and demanding they stay as whatever they were when we were kids getting to experience them is the most selfish thing we as fans can do. We have to accept the change because, well, these parks are for other people to come in and make their own memories now. We can either choose to come along for that, or be the curmudgeons sitting around with a frown saying “well back in my day.”

I would much rather be the former than the latter.

 

[V_L_Raptor]

The “future” in “Future World” became the next year’s worth of earnings calls. All the riffing on meeting characters and everything else hangs from that.

 

[OptimusPrime]

The real answer is no, but I know that’s hard pill to swallow. I’m a major EPCOT fan, wish more than anything that I got to experience most of the original stuff, but the truth is that we don’t get any element of the park’s core ideas and themes, even fleeting ones, without the inclusion of IP.

That’s not even necessarily all Disney’s choice. The guests actively want that. The percentage of people hungry for OLDCOT style attractions with no IP and such is far dwarfed by the percentage of people who aren’t.

But beyond that, time just caught up to EPCOT in the same way it did Tomorrowland. The future gets here eventually and it just isn’t workable to come in and redo attractions every 10 or 15 years when the world catches up to their views of tomorrow. All of the muses of tomorrow of those classic EPCOT rides have been passed.

The original ones that remain either rooted themselves mostly in the past (SSE, though it does touch on tomorrow, it is mainly a look back) or deal with ideas relevant to today (LWtL).

That combined with the demands of I’d say a solid 95-97% of the guests visiting these parks is what has changed EPCOT.

The original EPCOT was wonderful. Iconic. But no, it would not survive in 2024. In some other timeline maybe but the world we live in showed that the future EPCOT looked to just was never going to come to fruition and it would make those attractions seem very out of place these days.

It’s hard to remember now but there was a time when EPCOT was viewed as a dying place and that was right when they began this almost 25 year cycle now of tinkering with it. Had they just let it sit any longer I honestly think EPCOT would look even less like it’s original self today.

What the audiences want changed. We cannot sit here and say “it worked then” and still blindly believe it would now. It wouldn’t. The audience of 1981 and the audience of 2024 are not the same. Time changes all cultures. What the people who participate in that culture, especially pop culture, want changes.

Disney fans, and EPCOT fans in general; just have to remember that they are but a small drop of water in a large sea. Disney cannot, and should not, cater just to us. If they did, these parks would one day cease to exist because what we want is not always (in fact rarely) is not going to align with what the majority wants.

Disney parks are parks for the majority. They always have been, that was Walt’s whole point. He didn’t anticipate the parks picking up a dedicated fandom, and you know I doubt he’d be playing right to them even he became aware of one had he lived to see it.

I understand Disney Adults are attached to these places and their memories of them. That’s what makes us Disney Adults.

But we cannot be selfish, and demanding they stay as whatever they were when we were kids getting to experience them is the most selfish thing we as fans can do. We have to accept the change because, well, these parks are for other people to come in and make their own memories now. We can either choose to come along for that, or be the curmudgeons sitting around with a frown saying “well back in my day.”

I would much rather be the former than the latter.

This. Entirely this. While I think we don’t have to necessarily “accept change” from the POV of just letting it happen, I think that it’s important to remember that, when this stuff happens, there’s usually reasons behind it (and on multiple occasions the replacement is better. Especially with some of the recent Epcot replacements (Guardians. Frozen))

I think the time to truly be spiteful about change is when you take something that everyone loved and royally mess it up to the point where even the general public doesn’t like it (Communicore. WithFig)

Imagineering didn’t have to make Guardians fit Epcot. But they went out of their way to make the attraction fit Epcot, and I think that the queue and set up makes it feel like an Epcot attraction enough. (You can’t throw everything in Hollywood Studios for the love of SpongeBob. Guardians fits less on Sunset than it does in the future technology place, even based on your skewed childhood version of it)

At the end of the day, they make these things for the general public, but they’re starting to throw bones to the people like us when they do it. They made the Moana attraction an educational walkthrough.

 

[OptimusPrime]

The “future” in “Future World” became the next year’s worth of earnings calls. All the riffing on meeting characters and everything else hangs from that.

And it’s been like that ever since it became Eric Idle and Ellen. The only difference is that, unlike when they were doing it in the 90’s and 00’s, Guardians and Moana are pretty good. But also I can’t imagine Communicore Hall was part of such an earnings call lmao

 

[danlb_2000]

They're not wasting any time here. Maybe this really will be ready by next July.

Goes fast when someone else is paying the bill.

 

[DisneyCane]

“Keep IP out of Epcot” is one of the many statements made by Disney Adults who are culture blind and think that the parks are theirs.

At the end of the day, it’s foolish to say this, along with some other classics I’ve seen on this forum like “Marvel has no place in the parks.”

These parks are for families. Yes, they have offerings to appeal to those like us, but at the end of the day it’s elitist to say these things.

Families have expectations of what they will see when they go to Disney. Right now, those expectations include Frozen, Moana, Guardians of the Galaxy, catch my drift? These people want to go to Disney to see what their family currently loves.

What most forum members want is to go to exactly what their childhood was. They would rather alienate the family audience coming to see Elsa and Star-Lord so that they can see an outdated energy lecture and a hodgepodge Norway boat ride.

IP free Epcot doesn’t work today because audience taste changes. And this isn’t a “general audience is getting dumber” thing. This is simply how times change. Disney is in the home now more than ever whatnot with how cheap DVDs have gotten and especially now with Disney+. Previously, seeing original characters such as Figment, the Country Bears, or even for many Br’er Rabbit, was part of the Disney experience, as it is a similar feeling to seeing a new Disney movie in theaters. You go to the theater and you meet Aladdin and his Genie, just as you go to the park and meet Dreamfinder and Figment.

Nowadays, Disney’s brand is built heavily around the characters you know. Yes, new characters get popular, but they become popular via cultural osmosis as opposed to people going to experience the new Disney adventure. This is how Encanto got so big.

So now, the expectation with Disney is that you’re going to see your family’s favorite characters. You’re going to see Tiana, Anna, Star-Lord. Because that’s what Disney is to that family.

IP isn't really the issue. It's putting IP into places that don't make thematic sense. One of Walt's main ideas was to cross promote between the studio and Disneyland. There were plenty of IP based attractions in Walt's day as well. People like to remember only the non-IP based ones.

 

[larryz]

Encanto and Indiana Jones in Animal Kingdom? Does not fit.

Once again, as I've said before:
1) Encanto's plot is heavily animal dependent
2) EVERY Indiana Jones movie prominently features animals (or insects, sometimes both)

Animal = Animal

IP isn't really the issue. It's putting IP into places that don't make thematic sense. One of Walt's main ideas was to cross promote between the studio and Disneyland. There were plenty of IP based attractions in Walt's day as well. People like to remember only the non-IP based ones.

Welcome to the 21st Century at Disney, where the only thematic convention has become "If we build it, they will spend."

 

[DisneyCane]

Once again, as I've said before:
1) Encanto's plot is heavily animal dependent
2) EVERY Indiana Jones movie prominently features animals (or insects, sometimes both)

Animal = Animal


Welcome to the 21st Century at Disney, where the only thematic convention has become "If we build it, they will spend."

Snakes, why does it always have to be snakes?!?

 

[doctornick]

Still impressed on the TRON and GOTG fumble. Absolutely the worst mix-up of all time on where IPs should go.

Thematically I'd agree that they should be in each other spots. Definitely feel like Tron would be a good IP for Epcot if you needed something there.

But from a ride and experience standpoint, Cosmic Rewind is the better choice for Epcot. The park really needed something like that and Tron is too "thrilling"/height restricted/short for what Epcot needed.