Basil of Baker Street
Well-Known Member
Yes Fictional land. Fictional race. I don't see why this is even a discussion.
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
Wish (Walt Disney Animation - November 2023)
- Thread starter DCBaker
- Start date
Tha Realest
Well-Known Member
To be fair, it’s a fictional setting in a real place (the Iberian Peninsula). Not unlike the smattering of New England towns in Steven King novels (like Castle Rock)
Jedijax719
Well-Known Member
Churros
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
If you stop looking at them as an entertainment company and instead, start to look at the Walt Disney Co. as purely a Wall Street investment vehicle, a lot of their moves in modern times start to make a lot more sense.
Hint: They've learned a thing or two from IP trolls.
Case in point:
The Valentino plush is available on shopDisney as of today.
View attachment 746256
Valentino Plush – Wish – 13 3/4'' | Disney Store
Valentino's first wish may have been to be able to talk, but running a close second is his wish to get a warm hug. Inspired by Disney's enchanting movie Wish, this cute and cuddly plush of Asha's pet goat is beautifully detailed and includes his very elegant collar.www.shopdisney.com
Here's a link to the whole collection.
For a movie that's still almost two months away.
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
I just watched the season 2 finale of Wheel of Time.
If anyone gave up after season 1, season two is way, way better.
Anyway, my point is, I think that is a great example of using culturally diverse actors in a way that works. The main cast is a complete melting pot* - like way, way more than anything else I can think of in contemporary times - and it doesn't matter. It has basically zero bearing.
The cultures depicted seem to have a strong nomadic history and a few of the main "power" groups intentionally pull, sometimes by force, from all over that world (for better or worse depending on who you think is good and bad) which just kind of hyper-accelerates the idea of it.
It isn't historical fiction. It's fantasy and takes place in a totally different world so they're free to make those rules up as they please and they have without any winks or nods or pop culture references or with the sense that there was some representation mandate - it's just how it is.
And I really, really love that about it.
I don't see why Wish can't be any different in that sense... unless Disney ham-fists it.
*as are a ton of the supporting cast
[EDIT: I'm sure someone on the internet has a problem with it but it's not because they didn't handle it right]
Last edited:
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
I can’t believe I keep saying this, but are you saying Disney is going bankrupt?
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
As bad as it seems, even with all the mistakes, TWDC is owned mostly by institutional shareholders, therefore, in my opinion, TWDC is too big to allow to fail.I can’t believe I keep saying this, but are you saying Disney is going bankrupt?
Last edited:
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Disney is not going bankrupt.I can’t believe I keep saying this, but are you saying Disney is going bankrupt?
Sorry, I hate it when people keep showing the chart of how low the stocks are.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
While the stock is low it is not the complete measure of Company. And it certainly doesn't have anything to do with the movie this thread is about.
So ignore those that keep pointing to the stock price. Also note they never mention when it has an up day, like it has the past 3 trading days.
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
Yes, and also how when Disney announces big spending on the parks the stock price goes down as it might show how the big investors don't actually want the same things as the fans.
Last edited:
This thread is about the movie: Wish.
Yes, you’re right! Just to let you know, I didn’t started that stocks chart.
I hereby declare that you are released on your own recognizance.
Last edited:
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
Today, management understands that anything movie-wise they make that doesn't completely bomb and get basically abandoned (the way Strange World did) will sooner or later become profitable and once it does, it will continue to earn money from then on out.
Obvious outlier extreme example that illustrates it - Nightmare Before Christmas.
People didn't go all that crazy for this movie when it first came out.
It made about $50 million on initial release on a budget of about 24 million. Assuming the same boxoffice math we do today, that means it would have barely done better than break even.
Fast forward to today and it's total box office haul after multiple re-releases is $91+ million.
And that doesn't factor the VHS, DVD, Blueray and various special edition sets.
Additionally, there is the soundtrack which sold on cassette and CD and which now is streaming everywhere and on at least three different types of vinyl currently available with one of those being a new special release just this year.
Just think of all the licensed Hot Topic merch that movie has moved in the 30 years since it came out.
Even 22 years after, Funko Pop started releasing vinyl figures. Right now, if you go into a Gamestop, they are selling newly released mini-vinyl three packs of NMBFC characters.
Does Disney care if these end up in a clearance bin?
Well, it didn't cost them anything to produce them so probably not really.
Despite there being no permanent presence in the parks, they've sold park merch for various years and you can still buy Jack t-shirts at Target and Old Navy.
That $91+ million boxoffice it took them 30 years to get to is only the tip of the iceberg which has been dwarfed by their merchandising and licensing deals that it'll continue to earn money every year on for the foreseeable future and enjoying an upward tick every fall, without the Disney Co. themselves having to do much of anything.
Sure, they have to pay royalties to various parties but that comes out of profit. It isn't like Tim burton and Danny Elfman are having to be paid anything at this point if Disney isn't also making money on it.
The point is, the IP has continuing profit value, even if Disney never has to touch a single frame of that film, ever again for some sort of remaster.
Now compare that to say, Cosmic Rewind. It cost an estimated $500 million to build and yes, they'll eventually see their return on that ride but it'll continue to cost them every hour of every day it operates - not just things like track maintenance but the staffing and electricity it takes to operate it.
Every time a lightbub on the outside of the attraction has to be replaced, that'll cost 'em.
It doesn't matter if we're in an economic downturn and attendance is light. They still have to keep those lights on.
And two funny things about Cosmic Rewind are, it only exists because the movies came first since it's one of those IP cash-ins and at the same time, it helps cement the status of those movies as "classics" because for decades to come, there will be an attraction in Epcot helping remind people of the movies so the studios even see long-term marketing support that Parks, Experiences and Products will be footing the bill on.
Now lets compare that to Tower of Terror which is IP based but it's IP Disney doesn't own the rights to. Estimated cost for construction was $140 million. Obviously, it helps push attendance at Hollywood studio but it is helping keep CBS's IP relevant - not Disney's. It also moves merch with it's own gift shop but someone else takes a cut of every piece of that and when you leave the park, ToT isn't likey to have you signing up to D+ for the nastalgia.
That'll be Paramount Plus.
That new Haunted Mansion movie which didn't do well is already on D+. It'll settle into its place as a perenail favorite in a year or two and find an audience. We just watched the Muppets one tonight but people will be streaming the one with Owen Wilson in it to marvel at all the ride easter eggs for decades to come.
How important is it to Disney that the final Indy movie didn't do that well? It got a lot of us talking about the 3 we loved in ways most probably haven't in years. I'm sure viewership of them saw at least a decade spike.
They were obviously hopeful it would serve as a platform to launch a reboot they may or may not still try to do but it coming out at all helps keep Jock Lidney's relevant and do you think they'd be dangling the possibility of a themed land in AK if that movie hadn't been made?
A land that would again, circle back to reinforce the IP.
... and in a few years, people will be watching it as part of the five movie collection. They took the hit for it in 2023 and in years to follow, they'll keep making money off it.
The economy can go to crap and Disney will still be pulling in royalties every time We Don't Talk About Bruno plays on Spotify. Meanwhile, until they find a way to shut them down, those Monorials still need to operate.
Bob buying up IP is profit because even if they do very little with it, they make some money off it. If all they do is re-release something every now and then, they make even more. If they're able to get a sequel or a spinoff show or something out of things, they make even more... plus the whole licensing thing.
Now, compare that to a costly redo of Spaceship Earth.
Here's the thing:
When Disney was a company that cared about doing things, they did great things. Their goals were to make money but also to be a fantastic entertainment company. Their customer service in the parks was impeccable because yes, profit was the biggest goal but it wasn't the only goal. Customer satisfaction and company legacy mattered, too. They had this ideal of a virtuous circle where it all would feed back in - sort of like a not entirely tangible corporate idea of karma.
Compare a guest relations trip from a decade or two ago to one from more recently when people were being initially denied ILL refunds after an attraction broke down. Obviously, that has now been sorted but an older version of the company would never have let that happen to begin with. A castmember trying to pull that on a guest would have gotten in trouble where what we ended up with was a level of management making that decision and then hiding behind front-line cast to support it.
Disney today is an IP holder that squeezes that IP for profits. They're not an entertainment company. I don't believe that they're interested in doing great things anymore, just things they see a clear avenue to monetizing.
And even if D+ doesn't work out, they'll now be making extra money off those first three Star Wars movies being repackaged and sold or streamed somewhere, as well as getting a slice of Avatar and Simpsons and every other IP they squired for as long as they own them thanks to the overpriced Fox deal.
It may (or may not) take them a long time but they'll get there, even if part of it is by selling some of those assets.
Speaking of Simpsons, as long as Universal keeps selling Crusty Burgers and Lard Boy Donuts, that park will be doing a better job of improving Disney's EBIDA than Spaceship Earth will.
My son needed a
Disney didn't make that pack and isn't responsible for selling it - no cost or risk or inventory management for them at all.
That's Disney laughing their a$$ off, right there.
Today, they're just a money company and movies, despite their costs, are a relatively cheap and safe way to make it because even the ones that don't do good have their costs buried in a certain year and can continue to bring in endless money for years to come, after. In fact, due to the way revenue splits are done on theatrical releases, it's probably more profitable for them that way when certain movies don't hit big in theaters, in a relative sense due to certain benchmarks tied to points and bonuses not kicking in which, I think has been a big part of the writers and actor's complaints with their strikes.
Again some will do so badly they'll be forgotten before they get there but it's the minority and in the end, the final quality of most of this stuff doesn't even have to be that great for it to work.
At lest that's how I've now come to see it.
As a fan, it's kind of soul-crushing to consider it all that way but I don't think most of upper management have been fans of their own product for quite some time now.
Last edited:
TalkingHead
Well-Known Member
Sure, Bob
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
This year, next year, in ten years? It will probably happen sooner or later... or much later but they account for it this year which means on the books next year and forward, it's profit the way things appear to work.
I don't like it but if you look on D+ there is now a section that has the new Haunted Mansion, the Muppets one and the gawd-awful Eddie Murphy one and you know what? I know people who've watched that Eddie Murphy one (for the first time) as a result of that and been... okay with it.
I think all of this is eroding the long-term value of their brand(s) and for those who care, the soul of the company but anything to turn a buck, right?
Remember when Disney was staunchly against gambling?
Back to Wish, though - with the way they are tying it to the 100th anniversary and pushing the Disney of it all, this feels like kind of a make-or-break moment for me. Either they really have something wonderful on their hands or Bob and Co. would be willing to sell their moms for a fiver.*
We'll see.
*I guess both could be true
Last edited:
Having seen some of the book tie-ins now, I really, really doubt that this is going to be a worthy film for the centennial of the animation studio that made films like Fantasia and Beauty and the Beast, but it is certainly on brand with what the Walt Disney Company has become, a corporation that occasionally produces good work despite itself. As for winning the Best Animated Feature Oscar in a year with a new Hayao Miyazaki film and Across the Spider-Verse to compete against, I doubt its chances unless it's a Frozen-sized hit with family audiences and thus the movie voters think of first. At least it has the advantage of a fallow field for kiddie movies right now (its only direct competition is Trolls 3 opening week, and after that there's nothing for kids until Wonka a few weeks later).