What's with the wait times!? (hint.. they're low)

[SirWillow]

But that SR ride is only 35 minutes for parts of the day so some think the sky is falling.

Just want to remind that 35 minute wait is also not being inflated at all by fastpass folks slowing the standby line down. So it's not quite an equal comparison to the wait times on other rides where many of the riders didn't wait due to fastpass.

 

[Deleted member 107043]

Also said SWGE is "kind of lame," and Falcon wouldn't be worth waiting any longer than 25 minutes to ride.

That doesn't say much. I tried to think of a Disney park attraction I've experienced that I thought was worth waiting longer than 25 minutes to ride and came up with nothing.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

I don't even like Disney rides. I'd rather go to Universal.

 

[FRD714]

Been watching the wait times like a hawk for the past few weeks to get a sense of what to expect next week when we go. One thing I have noticed at DCA is Incredicoaster never gets above a 20 minute wait and usually hovers around the 10 minute mark. Odd for an E ticket at a park that offers only a handful. Does nobody care for that ride?

 

[TROR]

Been watching the wait times like a hawk for the past few weeks to get a sense of what to expect next week when we go. One thing I have noticed at DCA is Incredicoaster never gets above a 20 minute wait and usually hovers around the 10 minute mark. Odd for an E ticket at a park that offers only a handful. Does nobody care for that ride?

California Screamin usually capped out at 25. It’s a very efficient ride.

 

[drizgirl]

Been watching the wait times like a hawk for the past few weeks to get a sense of what to expect next week when we go. One thing I have noticed at DCA is Incredicoaster never gets above a 20 minute wait and usually hovers around the 10 minute mark. Odd for an E ticket at a park that offers only a handful. Does nobody care for that ride?

Not to worry. It's a great ride!

 

[BubbaQuest]

Been watching the wait times like a hawk for the past few weeks to get a sense of what to expect next week when we go. One thing I have noticed at DCA is Incredicoaster never gets above a 20 minute wait and usually hovers around the 10 minute mark. Odd for an E ticket at a park that offers only a handful. Does nobody care for that ride?

As others have mentioned, it's a very efficient roller coaster. With the dual loading trains (queuing 48 people at a time), the FastPass line rarely has people waiting so the standby is usually always moving. I have seen it swell to a 30-60 minute wait on busy summer days, but even then fast passes are usually readily available for a quick return time.

 

[DanielBB8]

Except its not quite that simple. Yes as a business Disney wants the park packed. But at the same time they know that a packed park has the potential at lower overall revenue due to lower guest satisfaction. As higher gate clicks doesn't always equate to higher overall revenue. So its a balancing act.

A packed park won’t lower revenue. There’s no proof of that. Lower guest satisfaction won’t affect revenue. Disney already offers an experience above the competition. There’s a ready made market of customers. The balancing act is about how to manage costs with revenue to increase margins, thus the cut in entertainment and service that causes the lower guest satisfaction. More guests equals more revenue means more entertainment and future attractions thus more guest satisfaction.

 

[SirWillow]

Been watching the wait times like a hawk for the past few weeks to get a sense of what to expect next week when we go. One thing I have noticed at DCA is Incredicoaster never gets above a 20 minute wait and usually hovers around the 10 minute mark. Odd for an E ticket at a park that offers only a handful. Does nobody care for that ride?

What you, and some others, are missing is how many people they can push through on that ride in comparison to others. It's an extremely high capacity ride, being able to push through around 2400 riders per hour (in comparison, Matterhorn and Space Mountain can both do about 1500 per hour) When you have a ride that is super high capacity like that, it's going to keep the lines relatively short and fast moving, even when there are a lot of people in the park.

 

[SirWillow]

A packed park won’t lower revenue. There’s no proof of that. Lower guest satisfaction won’t affect revenue. Disney already offers an experience above the competition. There’s a ready made market of customers. The balancing act is about how to manage costs with revenue to increase margins, thus the cut in entertainment and service that causes the lower guest satisfaction. More guests equals more revenue means more entertainment and future attractions thus more guest satisfaction.

A packed park won't necessarily lower overall revenue, it WILL lower per cap spending, which is also a measure of guest satisfaction. When people are happy, they spend more money. When they have to wait in long lines for everything, including food, drinks and souvenirs, they are far more likely to skip it and decide that it's not worth waiting in the line to spend the money. Per cap spending absolutely drops when the parks are crowded- sometimes dramatically.

Which is why a park can often make just as much money, sometimes even a bit more, if they have a small drop off in attendance compared to a crowded day. Even with photopass at the time we sold more photos in the parks, we would sell a lot more on moderately busy days than we would on packed days because people were so sick of waiting in lines that they didn't want to do it anymore. At the park my wife worked at in merch, her sales were down on crowded busy days compared to moderate days for the same reasons. She would make more money at her store on a day that was at 65-70% of capacity than she would when it was 85% of capacity.

 

[DanielBB8]

A packed park won't necessarily lower overall revenue, it WILL lower per cap spending, which is also a measure of guest satisfaction. When people are happy, they spend more money. When they have to wait in long lines for everything, including food, drinks and souvenirs, they are far more likely to skip it and decide that it's not worth waiting in the line to spend the money. Per cap spending absolutely drops when the parks are crowded- sometimes dramatically.

Which is why a park can often make just as much money, sometimes even a bit more, if they have a small drop off in attendance compared to a crowded day. Even with photopass at the time we sold more photos in the parks, we would sell a lot more on moderately busy days than we would on packed days because people were so sick of waiting in lines that they didn't want to do it anymore. At the park my wife worked at in merch, her sales were down on crowded busy days compared to moderate days for the same reasons. She would make more money at her store on a day that was at 65-70% of capacity than she would when it was 85% of capacity.

In park spending can certainly go up, but revenues includes admission and parking fees that Disney can get up front before they even enter the gates. Disney can sell special dining packages that they couldn't do if the park isn't crowded. The incentive is upfront seating and other perks that deep pocketed customers highly value. Disneyland added sufficient new park capacity to absorb higher crowds. Thus, Disneyland seems even less crowded with Galaxy's Edge. They're leaving quite a bit of money on the table. Stores and dining aren't getting sufficient customers to buy their wares and eat their food. Thus, the laying off of employees.

Disneyland appears to be well under park capacity, maybe 50 - 60% throughout the summer. There's no reason why lines for the most popular rides shouldn't be at least 1 hour all summer long. No one will feel exhausted from long lines since this is the theme park ritual most anticipate year after year. Sometimes longer lines drive interest unlike short lines make customers apathetic. They finish the park earlier and leave after half a day, thus cutting back opportunity to spend more money in the parks. That's what I would do. If I can get my rides in before dinner, I'll leave and eat dinner at home or nearby restaurant.

 

[shambolicdefending]

There's no reason why lines for the most popular rides shouldn't be at least 1 hour all summer long. No one will feel exhausted from long lines since this is the theme park ritual most anticipate year after year. Sometimes longer lines drive interest unlike short lines make customers apathetic. They finish the park earlier and leave after half a day, thus cutting back opportunity to spend more money in the parks. That's what I would do. If I can get my rides in before dinner, I'll leave and eat dinner at home or nearby restaurant.

There has to be a point where lines are "too long," and the park is "too crowded." Where that point is probably varies somewhat from one customer to another, but I think you have to do some real mental gymnastics to conclude that hour-long waits are actually better for customers than shorter ones.

 

[DanielBB8]

There has to be a point where lines are "too long," and the park is "too crowded." Where that point is probably varies somewhat from one customer to another, but I think you have to do some real mental gymnastics to conclude that hour-long waits are actually better for customers than shorter ones.

Of course, but Disney was touting 5 hours lines for Smugglers Run at DHS, and Universal was touting 10 hours waits for Hagrid's Motorbike on the first day. Avatar's Flight of Passage had 3 hours waits for 2 years straight. DCA's Radiator Springs Racers had 120 minutes waits up to right before Galaxy's Edge opened. These long waits drove up attendance for all these parks with new records. It's not a fluke. The opposite proves to be the killer. 1 hours waits is barely even worth mentioning. It's not long at all. Go to any Six Flags park. Their roller coasters can be 1 hour waits on a slow day.

 

[Disney Irish]

A packed park won’t lower revenue. There’s no proof of that. Lower guest satisfaction won’t affect revenue. Disney already offers an experience above the competition. There’s a ready made market of customers. The balancing act is about how to manage costs with revenue to increase margins, thus the cut in entertainment and service that causes the lower guest satisfaction. More guests equals more revenue means more entertainment and future attractions thus more guest satisfaction.

I don't see how you can make the claim that lower guest satisfaction won't affect revenue. If a guest isn't happy they aren't going to be ready to fork over their money for in-park purchases. Whereas a happy guest will be more likely to spend money in-park.

A crowded park only increases gate clicks (ie ticket purchases). It doesn't mean in-park purchases will actually increase just because there are more bodies in the park. It just means there is more potential for purchases. But this goes back to guest satisfaction. If a guest is happy because the park is less crowded they are more willing to spend money. Hence a less packed park can actually increase total revenue due to more in-park purchases even though your upfront revenue (ticket purchases) might be down.

 

[Phroobar]

I know when I go to the park when it's crowded I don't want to buy anything. If I have to buy food, I swim through the crowds and walk to Tiffys and get food poisoning.

 

[DanielBB8]

I don't see how you can make the claim that lower guest satisfaction won't affect revenue. If a guest isn't happy they aren't going to be ready to fork over their money for in-park purchases. Whereas a happy guest will be more likely to spend money in-park.

A crowded park only increases gate clicks (ie ticket purchases). It doesn't mean in-park purchases will actually increase just because there are more bodies in the park. It just means there is more potential for purchases. But this goes back to guest satisfaction. If a guest is happy because the park is less crowded they are more willing to spend money. Hence a less packed park can actually increase total revenue due to more in-park purchases even though your upfront revenue (ticket purchases) might be down.

You're equating more sales with "happy" guests, which you know that's not the only tool Disney uses. Disney is a marketing powerhouse. They do whatever they can to sell items. A happy guest is one that wants something because it's available at Disneyland. Thus the popcorn buckets, the limited item bakery item, the special drinks, the spirit t-shirts. Nobody will buy it just because they are unhappy with waiting a long line. People will wait a few hours for the priviledge of buying a limited item fresh candy cane. Plus, Disney has to prepare these items in bulk so they must sell out the food stuff or they gets trashed. This can only occur with sufficient crowds to buy the food.

 

[shambolicdefending]

Of course, but Disney was touting 5 hours lines for Smugglers Run at DHS, and Universal was touting 10 hours waits for Hagrid's Motorbike on the first day. Avatar's Flight of Passage had 3 hours waits for 2 years straight. DCA's Radiator Springs Racers had 120 minutes waits up to right before Galaxy's Edge opened. These long waits drove up attendance for all these parks with new records. It's not a fluke. The opposite proves to be the killer. 1 hours waits is barely even worth mentioning. It's not long at all. Go to any Six Flags park. Their roller coasters can be 1 hour waits on a slow day.

I think the window of time when an outrageously long wait is desirable to customers is very small. Probably no more than 30 days.

And are we really making comparisons to Six Flags? The whole point of Disney parks is to NOT be like those places.

 

[Disney Irish]

You're equating more sales with "happy" guests, which you know that's not the only tool Disney uses. Disney is a marketing powerhouse. They do whatever they can to sell items. A happy guest is one that wants something because it's available at Disneyland. Thus the popcorn buckets, the limited item bakery item, the special drinks, the spirit t-shirts. Nobody will buy it just because they are unhappy with waiting a long line. People will wait a few hours for the priviledge of buying a limited item fresh candy cane. Plus, Disney has to prepare these items in bulk so they must sell out the food stuff or they gets trashed. This can only occur with sufficient crowds to buy the food.

Except the guests you're talking about buying those limited time items are APs, not daily ticket guests. And even then half of those waiting in long lines for those items likely leave once they get the special item.

 

[DanielBB8]

I think the window of time when an outrageously long wait is desirable to customers is very small. Probably no more than 30 days.

And are we really making comparisons to Six Flags? The whole point of Disney parks is to NOT be like those places.

This is absolutely not true. Lines for popular rides will continue to be very long. That's why you use Fastpass whenever you can.

The comparison to Six Flags is apt. 1 hour waits is common everywhere. It's actually on the low side for a Disney theme park.

 

[shambolicdefending]

Galaxy's Edge at Disneyland is 103 days old, today.

How interesting has it been to watch the narratives evolve. From, "Just wait until the reservation period ends!" to "Just wait until all of the AP blackouts are lifted!"

And here we are. Still no big crowds. No buzz. No word-of-mouth excitement. Wasn't there a nostalgic thread just before opening about how we were about to enter a new era, and Disneyland would never be the same? Who could've guessed what our conversation points we be 100 days later...