What will Disney announce for Disney World at the 2022 D23 expo?

[MagicHappens1971]

I wish they would announce that they are gutting Space Mountain and starting over. Same theme but completely new track/ride experience

 

[Cmdr_Crimson]

I feel stupid for not knowing, but what is that a photo of?

The burning of the Library of Alexandria in SSE.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Agree completely. Rise is exceedingly overrated. No thrill, minimally interesting tech that honestly doesn't even look that good, sub par animatronics (and barely any at that).

I like the concept and the ride transitions for different experiences but the way people talk about it you would think it was some kind miracle ride that leaves all riders forever changed...

I think the same thing…but I try to be more “reserved” about it than most things because of my inherent Star Wars bias. But it’s not that.

We’ll probably be smited by Zeus for this ️

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

What kills it for me and most trackless rides is that I can see other ride vehicles during the ride.

That doesn't bother me. And if I'm not mistaken the only other ride vehicle you see are people that were there when you come out and are taken by the first order. So it fits the story since they are escaping alongside you.

That doesn’t bother me at all…

What bothers me is there’s zero randomization in the ride systems…which is the whole point of that system. They’re all short and just quick rushes through sets.

Now ROTR definitely was ambitious…to integrate the lift and the quick sim…and the set pieces are very elaborate (when working)…but it just comes in on the weak side all in. The AAs are super cringey…look to be reused A-100s

They tried though…credit there.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

For me, Guardians is a D. The preshows might potentially be good enough for an E, but the ride content itself is middling. I don't even think it's the best coaster at Disney.

Of course I grade it based on the themed content as opposed to the physical thrill, because that generally merits a shrug from me. I don't love Space Mountain either, although I probably would like Guardians more if it was focused just on space without everything else (even though I love Guardians as an IP).

I think I appreciate guardians because it’s not overblown

It has enough enertia on it to make it interesting to ride enthusiasts…it’s not boring to make it one and done…enough IP to satisfy Disney…and a good integration of sight, movement and SOUND.

Something Disney invented…and has lost their way a bit.

 

[BrianLo]

I don't want to continue the thread drift, but people have a very strange concept of what the ticket grading system actually means.

It quite frankly has nothing to do with your 'letter grading' of how much you like an attraction. In its purest form it is simply about popularity in an a la carte system. One that conveniently (thanks to the recent introduction of ILL) pretty much puts Rise on the top of the entire resort.

It continued use internally as a term to denote an attraction in terms of scope, scale, cost, tech and drawing power. Otherwise known as a headliner being synonymous with an E-ticket. By none of these metrics can one seriously present the argument that Rise is also not an E-ticket (unless WDW simply contains none at all).


I can say with a straight face that Escape from Gringott's is an E-ticket and I don't really care for it and think it's heavily flawed and poorly designed. BUT it's an "E-ticket" because nothing about how much I like the attraction matters. It's really an objective internal classification system.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Subsequently to the loss of the ticket system, it began use internally as a term to denote an attraction in terms of scope, scale, cost, tech and drawing power.

This was not a subsequent development, it was very much part of how tickets were determined. It continued to be used because it was an establish systems that aggregated those various metrics.

 

[BrianLo]

This was not a subsequent development, it was very much part of how tickets were determined. It continued to be used because it was an establish systems that aggregated those various metrics.

Poor wording on my part! That's what I meant to say

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't want to continue the thread drift, but people have a very strange concept of what the ticket grading system actually means.

It quite frankly has nothing to do with your 'letter grading' of how much you like an attraction. In its purest form it is simply about popularity in an a la carte system. One that conveniently (thanks to the recent introduction of ILL) pretty much puts Rise on the top of the entire resort.

It continued use internally as a term to denote an attraction in terms of scope, scale, cost, tech and drawing power. Otherwise known as a headliner being synonymous with an E-ticket. By none of these metrics can one seriously present the argument that Rise is also not an E-ticket (unless WDW simply contains none at all).


I can say with a straight face that Escape from Gringott's is an E-ticket and I don't really care for it and think it's heavily flawed and poorly designed. BUT it's an "E-ticket" because nothing about how much I like the attraction matters. It's really an objective internal classification system.

I know exactly what the ticked grading System means…it’s also a been defunct for 40 years, but why parse?…

Anyway you’re forgetting that “e” translated to innovation and thrill 99% of the time. That’s why they had the “popular” lines.

Nobody had been oh a Matterhorn or a splash or a tower…because they didn’t exist before they quietly opened to the customers on a sleepy morning the day after they checked out with the ride guys the day before.

And pirates wasn’t “thrilling”…but nobody had seen anything like it before. It “excited” the mind.

So in a effort to “ah ha!!!”…you’re just drawing the curtains on how much of dips Disney customers have become…

Want examples? Not just rise of (bad) reboot…
How about 2 hour lines for mine train…of the 1985 junior coast ilk…same with slinky…
Or my favorite: saying that Everest is “the best” of anything when it’s ride system is permanently in “fail” mode.

Standards make for more intelligent, interesting people. All day, everyday.

I know…life’s a B

 

[BrianLo]

I know exactly what the ticked grading System means…it’s also a been defunct for 40 years, but why parse?…

Anyway your forgetting that “e” translated to innovation and thrill 99% of the time. That’s why they had the “popular” lines.

So in a effort to “ah ha!!!”…you’re just drawing the curtains on how much of dips Disney customers have become…

Want examples? Not just ride of (bad) reboot…
How about 2 hour lines for dinky…of the 1985 junior coast ilk…same with slinky…
Or my favorite: saying that Everest is “the best” of anything when it’s ride system is permanently in “fail” mode.

Standards make for more intelligent, interesting people. All day, everyday.

I know…life’s a B

I'm not making that argument. There's a totally interesting discussion to be had about the likes of NRJ, SDMT and Slinky. How they were classified internally, what they produced and how the public ultimately perceives them as part of the parks broader attraction menu.

If there is not consensus that Rise is an E-ticket though, then the issue is we are not using the same linguistics. That was the point.

Also it's not defunct internally OR in the public lexicon. However much people try and co-opt it into a personal review system.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I'm not making that argument. There's a totally interesting discussion to be had about the likes of NRJ, SDMT and Slinky. How they were classified internally, what they produced and how the public ultimately perceives them as part of the parks broader attraction menu.

If there is not consensus that Rise is an E-ticket though, then the issue is we are not using the same linguistics. That was the point.

Also it's not defunct internally OR in the public lexicon. However much people try and co-opt it into a personal review system.

Do me a favor and let me know the next time Disney has “the newest E ticket” on a billboard on 417 or 528, will you?

The point is - it’s really just disneyana fandom/lore now. But fun for our discussions.

As far as metrics and internal criteria…I understand that too. But look at what the bobs have “cultivated”…it’s all labels and IP “quantification” now…they pay little mind to the quality of the ride…which is how they get longterm yield out of their investment. They’ve lost their way…the prior guy - say what you Will - was not from the “new school”

Both the Star Wars rides have potential…but they are embarrassing gutless sims as they were rolled out. Themed to two awful movies.
But they can pull a rabbit out of their hat if they just have the stones to check their egos and overlay them. Real simple.

 

[BrianLo]

Do me a favor and let me know the next time Disney has “the newest E ticket” on a billboard on 417 or 528, will you?

The point is - it’s really just disneyana fandom/lore now. But fun for our discussions.

As far as metrics and internal criteria…I understand that too. But look at what the bobs have “cultivated”…it’s all labels and IP “quantification” now…they pay little mind to the quality of the ride…which is how they get longterm yield out of their investment. They’ve lost their way…the prior guy - say what you Will - was not from the “new school”

Both the Star Wars rides have potential…but they are embarrassing gutless sims as they were rolled out. Themed to two awful movies.
But they can pull a rabbit out of their hat if they just have the stones to check their egos and overlay them. Real simple.

Ha, you are lovably obtuse as ever. I do think Millennium Falcon could do with an overlay (new mission) and maybe just maybe the Studios arm will pay for one the way Star Tours seems to receive unendingly. That would not be the most out of reach D23 announcement honestly.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Ha, you are lovably obtuse as ever. I do think Millennium Falcon could do with an overlay (new mission) and maybe just maybe the Studios arm will pay for one the way Star Tours seems to receive unendingly. That would not be the most out of reach D23 announcement honestly.

That “meh” land…and if you notice - nobody actually disputes that - would turn quite favorably if they did a full classic retheme. Say for 2025? Wouldn’t that be a relatively cheap counter move?

You could also leave Anaheim alone - for now - to differentiate and then get a boost later.

…this isn’t all that hard.

 

[UNCgolf]

I don't want to continue the thread drift, but people have a very strange concept of what the ticket grading system actually means.

It quite frankly has nothing to do with your 'letter grading' of how much you like an attraction. In its purest form it is simply about popularity in an a la carte system. One that conveniently (thanks to the recent introduction of ILL) pretty much puts Rise on the top of the entire resort.

It continued use internally as a term to denote an attraction in terms of scope, scale, cost, tech and drawing power. Otherwise known as a headliner being synonymous with an E-ticket. By none of these metrics can one seriously present the argument that Rise is also not an E-ticket (unless WDW simply contains none at all).


I can say with a straight face that Escape from Gringott's is an E-ticket and I don't really care for it and think it's heavily flawed and poorly designed. BUT it's an "E-ticket" because nothing about how much I like the attraction matters. It's really an objective internal classification system.

I think most people (at least most people on this board) understand that. It's just become shorthand for what people think of an individual attraction's overall quality based on what they like.

I also think (I could be wrong) that originally it was more based around how popular an attraction was than anything else. I believed they shifted ticket classifications due to that. If they still did so, they'd have to classify a ride like Smuggler's Run (and maybe even Na'vi River Journey) as an E ticket, but I don't think it was ever intended to be one (and certainly isn't good enough if it was).

Regardless, you're right that there's a difference between people saying this ride is a whatever ticket to me vs. this ride is objectively a C/D/E ticket as designed. A ride like Guardians is an E ticket essentially by default, considering they spent nearly $500 million on it.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I think most people (at least most people on this board) understand that. It's just become shorthand for what people think of an individual attraction's overall quality based on what they like.

I also think (I could be wrong) that originally it was more based around how popular an attraction was than anything else. I believed they shifted ticket classifications due to that. If they still did so, they'd have to classify a ride like Smuggler's Run (and maybe even Na'vi River Journey) as an E ticket, but I don't think it was ever intended to be one (and certainly isn't good enough if it was).

Regardless, you're right that there's a difference between people saying this ride is a whatever ticket to me vs. this ride is objectively a C/D/E ticket as designed. A ride like Guardians is an E ticket essentially by default, considering they spent nearly $500 million on it.

But they’re not just what people think. They’re still used to describe attractions in the industry. The Pandora drawings that got out label Navi River Journey as the C Ticket. Even over at Epic Universe the different new attractions are referred to by their ticket level.

Popularity could influence changes over the years, but the base criteria was scale and scope. Peter Pan’s Flight was never elevated to an E Ticket like the Jungle Cruise because its scale and scope were not there despite its popularity.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

But they’re not just what people think. They’re still used to describe attractions in the industry. The Pandora drawings that got out label Navi River Journey as the C Ticket. Even over at Epic Universe the different new attractions are referred to by their ticket level.

Popularity could influence changes over the years, but the base criteria was scale and scope. Peter Pan’s Flight was never elevated to an E Ticket like the Jungle Cruise because its scale and scope were not there despite its popularity.

Ticket classifications from an “industry” standpoint is yet another way for WDI to trip over their own brainwaves at this junction - however. It’s almost their mental “insurance” that whatever they spend 5 years and $1 billion dollars on is worth it…however it’s almost the opposite now. Very low level of ROI.

 

[Lil Copter Cap]

I do think an interesting discussion to have (perhaps on a more appropriate board) is the classification of rides changing to fit the building of modern theme parks. We have "highly immersive lands" being created that center around 1 or 2 rides/attractions. Of course one of the rides will be considered an E-ticket to be worth the budget. Whether we agree with it or not.

Back to D23...my prediction is no E-ticket announcements

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I do think an interesting discussion to have (perhaps on a more appropriate board) is the classification of rides changing to fit the building of modern theme parks. We have "highly immersive lands" being created that center around 1 or 2 rides/attractions. Of course one of the rides will be considered an E-ticket to be worth the budget. Whether we agree with it or not.

Back to D23...my prediction is no E-ticket announcements

In Orlando?

I agree…I’d rate the chances to be about as likely as a blizzard tomorrow on I-drive

 

[Lil Copter Cap]

In Orlando?

I agree…I’d rate the chances to be about as likely as a blizzard tomorrow on I-drive

Oooo, yes, very good call out. Yes, for Orlando specifically. I cannot see them investing more money in WDW with attendance and $$ already outpacing pre-pandemic numbers, Epic Universe or not.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Time will tell.

It’s got too many things going against it in my book.

I'm sorry, but by all definitions Rise is an E-ticket. You may not like it, but it's 100% an E-ticket. My classification of stuff built in the last 10 years:

MK
Mermaid - Between a C and a D. I think technically it's a D but a weak one.
Mine Train - D (some would argue a C, but it's a D)
TRON - Will be an E, but I'd argue a weak E

EPCOT
Guardians - E
Ratatouille - D
Frozen - C

DHS
Rise - E
Smugglers Run - D
Swirling Saucers - B
Slinky Dog - C/D
Runaway Railway - Solid D, pushing an E

DAK
Flight of Passage - E
Na'vi River Journey - Very solid C disguised as a weak D.