MagicHappens1971
Well-Known Member
I have a plastic card (for my AP) but it’s just a normal ticket. I thought they were still giving plastic but I’m not sure
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News Walt Disney World to eliminate self-service paper straws and plastic lids
- Thread starter wdwmagic
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Splash4eva
Well-Known Member
All the plastic cards they use for the gift cards… the plastic cards they send for your party tickets. The list is endless. So yea. Take the paper straws toss them away where they belong and use plastic straws and stop trying to make believe you are changing the world.
John park hopper
Well-Known Member
Plastic is here to stay---used in every aspect of life you can't get away from it.
Ayla
Well-Known Member
That's what I was going to say. Disposable diapers weren't the norm until the 70's and mass-produced plastic products didn't come about until the 60's.
JMcMahonEsq
Well-Known Member
This times a thousand. Its not a fundamental technology issue, its a marketing/lifestyle issue.
Plastics and disposable products starting gaining popularity when it was discovered 1) it was cheaper to work in plastics and mass produce items; 2) plastics and mass production of single use items meant repeat sails over long term, turning into more profits. And to be fair to businesses 3) a fundamental change in the work force makeup in the 60's and 70's where you started to have more 2 parent work families, and more women entering the workforce such that being able to spend less time on prep/cleaning, and a more on the go lifestyle benefitted from disposable singe use items.
And while there are certainly certain items that are always going to utilize plastics, that doesn't mean that we give up on trying to limit waste, or their utilization where we can. To the extent we can limit any single use product, not only are we helping to eliminate the waste in disposing of them, we are helping to reduce waste/use of resources in their fabrication.
AEfx
Well-Known Member
What's funny about that is that even those that do use cloth diapers now (usually upper middle class folks who can afford a service that picks them up and drops off fresh ones) are considered just as bad for the environment as normal disposables, because of the chemicals they are required to use to sanitize them to modern standards (and they are only reusable so many times due to how the chemicals degrade them). It's basically another version of the "reusable shopping bag" fallacy - the materials that are needed to make them and the chemicals that are used to maintain them are no better than, if not worse, than using disposables unless you reuse them for decades.
I do agree that so much of this is classic virtue signaling, this "every little bit helps" nonsense that people want to believe. Sure, we should not just wantonly waste, but this hyper-focus on things like straws and shopping bags is just a distraction and a way for the real polluters to placate people and put the onus on us.
Dranth
Well-Known Member
Would it be possible for people to stop with the all or nothing arguments? It is disingenuous and blatantly ignores reality.
You can be for replacing as much plastic usage as we reasonably can without collapsing the economy or sending us all back to the stone age. You can also change your mind if the replacement ends up being worse. It is called being reasonable.
In this case sure, replacing plastic straws at Disney is a tiny, infinitesimal step in the grand scheme but because it doesn’t stop all plastic from now until the end of time across all reaches of the universe we shouldn’t bother? Is that how you folks live the rest of your life? You all just give up whenever something isn’t accomplished instantly? You have never chipped away slowly at a ridiculously complicated problem?
I’m just glad you all weren’t around when humans were working their way out of the caves or we would all be sitting there still.
You can be for replacing as much plastic usage as we reasonably can without collapsing the economy or sending us all back to the stone age. You can also change your mind if the replacement ends up being worse. It is called being reasonable.
In this case sure, replacing plastic straws at Disney is a tiny, infinitesimal step in the grand scheme but because it doesn’t stop all plastic from now until the end of time across all reaches of the universe we shouldn’t bother? Is that how you folks live the rest of your life? You all just give up whenever something isn’t accomplished instantly? You have never chipped away slowly at a ridiculously complicated problem?
I’m just glad you all weren’t around when humans were working their way out of the caves or we would all be sitting there still.
DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
I've actually read that there is so much aluminum in landfills that it would be more economical (both in energy and cost) to mine the landfills than to mine for ore and process it.
John park hopper
Well-Known Member
I saved aluminum cans had 200 lbs got 30 cents a pound for them almost not worth the effort.
DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
Because the reasonable approach would be to use reusable straws when convenient and disposable straws in situations where it is more convenient to do so. For instance, I use reusable straws at home to take drinks into my car. However, when I'm on a road trip and buy a drink at a gas station, it is more convenient to use a disposable straw so I don't have to deal with washing straws and things like that. At WDW, if I want to walk around with a drink I need a lid and a straw to not make a mess. It is not convenient to carry a reusable straw around with me in a theme park nor a reusable drink lid.
That is what I consider a "reasonable" solution to cutting back on waste, minimizing waste at home but not taking crazy steps to make it difficult to enjoy the conveniences of modern civilization while on vacation.
The people who want "all or nothing" are the ones in favor of this kind of policy. They want to ban plastic straws when there is no compelling reason to do so. In the US, if they are disposed of in a trash can (as they would all be at WDW, either by the guest or a custodial CM), there is no "environmental damage."
These policies serve to make two groups of people fell good about themselves. The first group are the people within the company who come up with the policies and then get to pretend that they are saving the earth. The second group are the people who keep a close eye on their carbon footprint and inherently feel guilty about going to WDW. They see initiatives like this and it makes them feel good that the business they are patronizing is saving the earth so they no longer have to feel guilty about the "impact" they have by going to WDW.
If you are an environmental activist and really want to make a difference to eliminate plastic pollution in the ocean then do what the whale hunting protesters did and get a bunch of boats and harass the garbage barges leaving China and the several other Asian countries who are the main contributors to the problem and make it a mission to stop allowing them to dump plastic in the ocean. THAT would be "doing something" to help the environment, not eliminating single use plastics at WDW.
Dranth
Well-Known Member
Wait, how is what Disney is doing not EXACTLY what you just said?
They are replacing plastic straws with paper ones. The straws still exist, the lids still exist. You can still get them. If you consider having to ask for them a "crazy step" then that is certainly your prerogative but we have very different ideas of crazy.
Okay, but they haven't banned straws, they just switched to a different material. Second, the US ships an absurd amount of trash (in particular plastic) to other countries to deal with so no, it ended up in a trash can does not mean there is no environmental impact. That is an assumption on your part, that in some cases will be correct and some cases not.
In the specific case of Disney, you may be right if it all stays local which I believe at least a good bit of it does. My understanding is that is one of the reasons they want to switch to paper straws instead of the plastic. It will use up significantly less space over time in a land fill.
Just in case anyone wants to talk about how small a straw is that is true. Now multiple that be the millions of guests who use them on property each year. With the paper you only ever have a few months of straws at any one time eating up space in a landfill as anything older will be fully decomposed while the plastic will be there for the next 100+ years taking up room.
Reductive and inaccurate. This is exactly what I was talking about with the absolutes. Just because you can't imagine anything other than the groups you listed doesn't mean that is all that exists or that those are even a tiny majority of the people who support these types of policy changes.
Here, I'll help. I support this change, feel zero pleasure or self-satisfaction from it and derive no sense of accomplishment. I also drive a car, will fly when needed and purchase other products that use or contain plastic and feel no guilt when doing so. You know why, because I live in reality where complex, insanely difficult to solve problems can't be fixed instantly but still shouldn't be ignored entirely.
Sure, that is one option but not everyone can do this kind of thing or even would agree that is the best approach.
For example, why not start at home. We (the US) ship a lot of our trash to other countries where it then ends up in the ocean. How about stopping that practice? No, that wouldn't stop another country from dumping their own trash but it would be a large if incremental step forward. Besides, I guarantee that if trash started piling up locally solutions and progress would start coming at a much quicker pace which is what we really need to solve this issue long term.
"Doing what you can" is a stalling action to buy time for real, more realistic and permeant solutions to come along.
MickeyLuv'r
Well-Known Member
Newer physical gift cards are often cardboard, and not just Disney gift cards, all brands. The cardboard ones have their own flaws though, especially when trying to remove the scratch off strip.
Electronic gift cards are usually an option now at many retailers. Mostly they are easy to use, except if you have both the card and MDE on your phone. There's also a small complication when using them to pay for TS dining- if they are only on your phone. Often the CM has to write the number on paper. So for TS dining, a physical card is a bit easier.
JMcMahonEsq
Well-Known Member
There are just so many things wrong with this post.
First it doesn't matter if plastic/single use items are dispose of properly....well it does matter but its not the only thing that matters. Repeated use of disposable items ever increases demand for the item, which means more production, more use of plastic and other resources to continually create more disposable items. Recycling what is used so that there isn't as much "waste" is a good goal. Helping to eliminate the need to produce so much crap has environmental benefits all its own, and in many cases exceed the benefits of recycling.
Second utilizing a non-disposable straw, hell a non-disposable cup/cover/straw isn't that big of a deal. Its always going to be easier to use a disposable product, that's the whole selling point of disposable items. Lack of effort and thought on the end user side. But as a society/culture in order to transitions away from just doing what is easiest, to instead what is more efficient/better for the environment and retention of resources, your going to have some change. Disney already provides reusable cups, with lid for resorts. Starbucks, Dunks, many coffee shops offer similar products. Hell Six Flags offers a similar service.
Third, once again going to extremes is an absurdity. Just because Disney hasn't chosen to shut down all its electrical rides, plow under the park, and grow carbon neutral plants, doesn't mean they can't run a business, and implement cost effective measures that also have a positive environmental outcome. Just like people can choose to use cloth bags, and non-disposable refillable bottles, and not have to decide to quit their jobs to join sea shepards, or live in a cave without electricity and gas, and still being doing something about the environment.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
Splash4eva
Well-Known Member
I dont think ive ever used a cardboard gift card in my life let alone seen Disney or any other major company Have you gone to any chain pharmacy and looked at the gift card section?
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
This whole cup/cover/straw thing for Disney is about MONEY!!!!!!
And Disney tells us its about the environment.
Some folks believe Disney, and it does feel good to help the environment and some folks know, its about the money.
MickeyLuv'r
Well-Known Member
Yes and no. They have certainly grown tremendously, but nylon stockings date to roughly the 1940's.
Early plastics were a substitute for ivory.
Early Bakelite was a substitute for shellac. Shellac is made from secretions of the lac insect. (Yes, shiny candy and cosmetics use shellac, also called confectioner's glaze. Mmm!) Shellac is also highly useful as a thermoplastic used for industrial purposes, and wood finishing. Bakelite, patented in 1909, has both heat resistance and electrical nonconductivity, so it is often used as an electric insulator.
Nylon and Plexiglass were both widely used during WWII. To make important items like parachutes, ropes, and aircraft windows.
I inherited items that were made from an early plastic called celluloid, or Ivorine. It was (often) used to make hand mirrors and combs.
It was also used to replace tortoise shells. Think of guitar picks!
MickeyLuv'r
Well-Known Member
They are new.
They come in a paper package that looks like this:
If you see gift cards that are in a sealed paper package, it may well be cardboard. The older plastic ones tend to have the plastic visible.
I've now seen them at a number of places, like big box stores, grocery stores, etc.
Ayla
Well-Known Member
Target gift cards are all cardboard. I have one in my wallet right now. Barnes and Noble's rewards card has switched over to cardboard. My medical/dental insurance cards are cardboard. Those are the ones I can think of off the top of my head. I'm sure there are dozens of other examples.