VIDEO and PHOTOS - Morocco's B'net Al Houwariyate debut at Epcot

[Gabe1]

Interestingly enough, I was listening to a podcast with several well known members who were at the last Mulch, Sweat & Shears show and one commented that he had seen a head of entertainment person from a competing park at DHS watching Mulch on their last day. Could be nothing, but it was an interesting observation. Marie

Exactly. Doesn't surprise me at all. There are not too many flops at Disney, Stitch's Supersonic Celebration likely being one of the worst I ever endured though Mo'Rockin' IMO is certainly in that category.

But Disney since giving the wildly popular Adventurers Club, OffKilter or even at the resorts like the FQ Elliot Dyson the heave ho a pattern has emerged right down to their smaller street entertainers or everyone needing to audition for the Festival of the Lion King at AK in its new digs. I believe the rational is Disney had enough of negotiating with talents that had a following. Two, Disney had enough of the followers of their entertainment. We all had seen it at the Adventurers Club, Mulch and certainly with OffKilter. Me, the worst when lodging at the FQ and not being able to get near the Lounge because the 'regulars' had taken up camp in the tiny lounge for Elliot, he is genuinely a talented entertainer.

The Adventurers Club would have fit nicely into the new Springs even if it was in a different building but Disney seems to be getting what they perceive as a handle on their entertainment and also the regulars that tend to hang at those venues.

 

[boufa]

For the most part I agree Boufa, the difference for me with Off Kilter and Mulch, is that I am friendly with these particular cast members. To see them losing a job they have had for 17 years and 11 years, respectively, is heartbreaking for me. I would feel the same way about any of my friends losing a job for any reason. A ride, as cool as it is, is just machinery to me. It doesnt have the same impact for sure. In most cases, I have taken a very "well let's wait and see what Disney does, it should be cool" type of approach to most attractions closing. Not so much with these attractions, as part of the appeal of catching up with friends and enjoying their performance more because I do know them. Marie

I see your point, and the personal connection. There are certainly valid reasons why things move on, especially in entertainment. I won't insult your friends by making statements that I have no knowledge of about what happened. Having said that, those are great runs, and no one would ever call those years a failure. Future opportunities I am sure will open up for them.. though I did hear that many of the guys from Off Kilter still work for Disney... but that might be wrong.

2 coutner points... 1) 17 years is a long time, and people talk about the shows at DHS getting stale. ... even the best group gets stale after a bunch of years. I do think the shorter turnover concept might be a good one.... it would also give more performers an opportunity to exploit the Disney Stage exposure. 2) having worked at a local amusement park, many, many years ago, I can tell you from a personal level, rides are far more than just machinery. There are a lot of people, I would argue in most cases, way MORE people who work an attraction than a musical act like Mulch.

 

[ford91exploder]

Exactly. Doesn't surprise me at all. There are not too many flops at Disney, Stitch's Supersonic Celebration likely being one of the worst I ever endured though Mo'Rockin' IMO is certainly in that category.

But Disney since giving the wildly popular Adventurers Club, OffKilter or even at the resorts like the FQ Elliot Dyson the heave ho a pattern has emerged right down to their smaller street entertainers or everyone needing to audition for the Festival of the Lion King at AK in its new digs. I believe the rational is Disney had enough of negotiating with talents that had a following. Two, Disney had enough of the followers of their entertainment. We all had seen it at the Adventurers Club, Mulch and certainly with OffKilter. Me, the worst when lodging at the FQ and not being able to get near the Lounge because the 'regulars' had taken up camp in the tiny lounge for Elliot, he is genuinely a talented entertainer.

The Adventurers Club would have fit nicely into the new Springs even if it was in a different building but Disney seems to be getting what they perceive as a handle on their entertainment and also the regulars that tend to hang
at those venues.

Heaven forfend that acts which are popular and bring guests back time after time might actually SHARE in the success. Off Kilter and MSS are in a different category than the fanbois who clogged the AC, In the former case people paid for admission.

The AC with the lack of a cover charge the fanbois hanging out and NOT buying drinks was simple mismanagement on WDW's part.

The situation with OK and MSS is "Today's Disney" is too greedy to want to pay entertainers any more than minimum wage. Even though those shows drove attendance by PAYING CUSTOMERS. This cost cutting dynamic you even see at ESPN sacking popular but expensive hosts and replacing them with nobodies. You are seeing the acts of a company which believes itself invincible that people watch ESPN because its ESPN not that they watch ESPN because of the content it provides. And that guests visit WDW because it's WDW, Not because guests visit WDW because of the quality of experience WDW provided in the past.

When this type of corporate behavior sets in a crash is definitely in the future, Will the individual businesses go away like WDW or ESPN and PIXAR, No they will go to a new owner who will hopefully take better care of them
but I think TWDC as a corporate entity is riding for a hard fall.

 

[wannabeBelle]

Agreed and I hate to see anyone lose their job be it at an attraction or an entertainment venue, but I would think an attraction will be replaced with another one so the jobs will change but may not be lost entirely. As far as the years, yes Mulch at 11 and Off Kilter at 17 were incredible runs especially for that business. I would love to see Mulch brought back in another format/ location/ incarnation but as you said some of the guys from OK have been hired at Disney in other roles, one is a soundman and one is selling DVC. Also Off Kilter is still touring doing Irish and other music festivals and I know that they are happy with that as well as coming out with a new CD soon!! Marie

 

[boufa]

Heaven forfend that acts which are popular and bring guests back time after time might actually SHARE in the success. Off Kilter and MSS are in a different category than the fanbois who clogged the AC, In the former case people paid for admission.

The AC with the lack of a cover charge the fanbois hanging out and NOT buying drinks was simple mismanagement on WDW's part.

The situation with OK and MSS is "Today's Disney" is too greedy to want to pay entertainers any more than minimum wage. Even though those shows drove attendance by PAYING CUSTOMERS. This cost cutting dynamic you even see at ESPN sacking popular but expensive hosts and replacing them with nobodies. You are seeing the acts of a company which believes itself invincible that people watch ESPN because its ESPN not that they watch ESPN because of the content it provides. And that guests visit WDW because it's WDW, Not because guests visit WDW because of the quality of experience WDW provided in the past.

When this type of corporate behavior sets in a crash is definitely in the future, Will the individual businesses go away like WDW or ESPN and PIXAR, No they will go to a new owner who will hopefully take better care of them
but I think TWDC as a corporate entity is riding for a hard fall.

My perspective may be a bit off kilter (see what I did there) but I cannot imagine a measurable dip in attendance from the loss of these bands. I'm not taking away from the overall point. The certainly add value to the experience, but negatively or positively effecting attendance in any real, measurable, or meaningful way, I doubt it. Sure a handful of loyal visitors, but that would be it. 90% or more of the total fanatics for these bands will still come to the parks.

 

[ford91exploder]

My perspective may be a bit off kilter (see what I did there) but I cannot imagine a measurable dip in attendance from the loss of these bands. I'm not taking away from the overall point. The certainly add value to the experience, but negatively or positively effecting attendance in any real, measurable, or meaningful way, I doubt it. Sure a handful of loyal visitors, but that would be it. 90% or more of the total fanatics for these bands will still come to the parks.

Right now Disney is importing guests from the UK and South America (with HUGE discounts BTW on room and dining) who spend a lot on their 'one and done' trips if this changes for any reason WDW is once again going to be dependent on the locals and AP holders who right now have little reason to be loyal to WDW.

 

[wannabeBelle]

My perspective may be a bit off kilter (see what I did there) but I cannot imagine a measurable dip in attendance from the loss of these bands. I'm not taking away from the overall point. The certainly add value to the experience, but negatively or positively effecting attendance in any real, measurable, or meaningful way, I doubt it. Sure a handful of loyal visitors, but that would be it. 90% or more of the total fanatics for these bands will still come to the parks.

Like the Off Kilter bit!! As far as the other stuff, my perspective is this. I have been to Disney a number of times, 5 times this year alone so far. I don't go to ride the newest coaster or to meet the characters, these are nice for me but I certainly don't plan a trip around them. My next trip, I am going because one of my closer friends is going at that time and I arranged my dates to match her and her family. Master Yoda and his family will also be coming down to hang and see the Osbourne lights one last time. I will also be going to see the Canadian Holiday Voyageurs which has many of the members of Off Kilter performing. If Off Kilter and Mulch were performing, they would be scheduled in to see as well. My point here being I don't come for the rides, I live an hour away from Six Flags Great Adventure and can go there anytime I want, without dropping money on hotels, airfare etc. The atmosphere and entertainment are what draws me. As Master Yoda put it the last time we were in the parks together, I don't go to Disney to do Disney, I go to hang out with my friends. If my friends end up at another park, I would certainly have no problem switching over. Marie

 

[wannabeBelle]

Right now Disney is importing guests from the UK and South America (with HUGE discounts BTW on room and dining) who spend a lot on their 'one and done' trips if this changes for any reason WDW is once again going to be dependent on the locals and AP holders who right now have little reason to be loyal to WDW.

This. Remember 9/11 when the locals and AP holders were the ones who supported Disney through that time frame when people were just scared to travel. The One and Done crowd is a nice thing to have, but throw your loyal customers who keep coming back and spending their money a bone as well to keep a good balance of a loyal customer base and attracting new people. Marie

 

[ford91exploder]

This. Remember 9/11 when the locals and AP holders were the ones who supported Disney through that time frame when people were just scared to travel The One and Done crowd is a nice thing to have, but throw your loyal customers who keep coming back and spending their money a bone as well to keep a good balance of a loyal customer base and attracting new people. Marie

Unfortunately this line of thought is not being followed by Disney. I've had an AP a LONG time I let it lapse I'm tired of paying more for less and less.

 

[sshindel]

If only Disney would commit to updating Epcot itself yearly instead of just the entertainment offerings.

 

[Andrew C]

If only Disney would commit to updating Epcot itself yearly instead of just the entertainment offerings.

updating future world yearly?

 

[sshindel]

updating future world yearly?

As much as I personally am a Future World crusader, it has been pointed out to me that Word Showcase is nearly just as stagnant.
Though, we see what happens when they decide to update an attraction, so maybe I don't want it to happen. #frozen #ellen #nemo #drNigel #RIPHorizons

(Man, I've gotta get off of Twitter and back onto the forums more).

 

[Andrew C]

As much as I personally am a Future World crusader, it has been pointed out to me that Word Showcase is nearly just as stagnant.
Though, we see what happens when they decide to update an attraction, so maybe I don't want it to happen. #frozen #ellen #nemo #drNigel #RIPHorizons

(Man, I've gotta get off of Twitter and back onto the forums more).

I think the main focus really needs to be to build future world back up. Hopefully that occurs and then we can go from there....

 

[sshindel]

I think the main focus really needs to be to build future world back up. Hopefully that occurs and then we can go from there....

I wholeheartedly agree. Future World is a dead zone. I'm still waiting for Disney to give me that call to come in and help them revamp it

 

[ford91exploder]

I wholeheartedly agree. Future World is a dead zone. I'm still waiting for Disney to give me that call to come in and help them revamp it

Always thought they should give Future World to the tech companies of the world as a showcase and just make it a "Worlds Fair" of technology rent the companies exhibit space and just let them do whatever they want. None of this sponsor BRAVO-SIERRA. Would you like to see a Tesla powertrain and battery system I would, Show of 100GB ethernet that would be cool, Smart Grid tech - yeah I'd like to see that. New wireless technology like 802.11ad (10 Gb Wireless) and 802.11ax yeah that would be cool

 

[wannabeBelle]

Always thought they should give Future World to the tech companies of the world as a showcase and just make it a "Worlds Fair" of technology rent the companies exhibit space and just let them do whatever they want. None of this sponsor BRAVO-SIERRA. Would you like to see a Tesla powertrain and battery system I would, Show of 100GB ethernet that would be cool, Smart Grid tech - yeah I'd like to see that. New wireless technology like 802.11ad (10 Gb Wireless) and 802.11ax yeah that would be cool

A friend had suggested only a few weeks ago, to use the Innoventions area exactly like this. I think this would be awesome!!! Marie

 

[sshindel]

Always thought they should give Future World to the tech companies of the world as a showcase and just make it a "Worlds Fair" of technology rent the companies exhibit space and just let them do whatever they want. None of this sponsor BRAVO-SIERRA. Would you like to see a Tesla powertrain and battery system I would, Show of 100GB ethernet that would be cool, Smart Grid tech - yeah I'd like to see that. New wireless technology like 802.11ad (10 Gb Wireless) and 802.11ax yeah that would be cool

It's exactly what I'd do with Innoventions.

Went to this tech expo a decade ago put on by Wired and it was fantastic. Innoventions should feel like an expo, exhibits swapped out all the time, hands on, discussions with knowledgable people about the technology.

The rest of Future World? Well, I have plans for that too.

 

[wdwmagic]

Always thought they should give Future World to the tech companies of the world as a showcase and just make it a "Worlds Fair" of technology rent the companies exhibit space and just let them do whatever they want. None of this sponsor BRAVO-SIERRA. Would you like to see a Tesla powertrain and battery system I would, Show of 100GB ethernet that would be cool, Smart Grid tech - yeah I'd like to see that. New wireless technology like 802.11ad (10 Gb Wireless) and 802.11ax yeah that would be cool

I would like to see this, but it appears that many of the tech companies are no longer interested in this form of advertising. They see the Internet as being their gateway to consumers, and those who have an interest in such things will seek it out. I believe it is a hard slog for Disney trying to recruit any tenants for Innoventions.

 

[sshindel]

I would like to see this, but it appears that many of the tech companies are no longer interested in this form of advertising. They see the Internet as being their gateway to consumers, and those who have an interest in such things will seek it out. I believe it is a hard slog for Disney trying to recruit any tenants for Innoventions.

I think that they could still do it. Having an interactive hands on demo could really be good publicity for smaller firms. I really have a hard time thinking that Disney would have a hard time getting companies to agree to a space with 11+ million visitors a year.
Maybe it should be for start-up and small sized tech companies. The kind that need to get their product in front of people for that initial introduction.

Oh well. Not like it's happening anyway. Back to our discussion on new music in Morocco.

 

[ford91exploder]

I would like to see this, but it appears that many of the tech companies are no longer interested in this form of advertising. They see the Internet as being their gateway to consumers, and those who have an interest in such things will seek it out. I believe it is a hard slog for Disney trying to recruit any tenants for Innoventions.

Perhaps it's just me but there is no substitute for actually seeing and touching things for yourself, Example T5 at JFK features a decommissioned jet engine from one of JetBlue's planes and you can actually TOUCH it, That engine always has a crowd around it. It's been cut away so you can see parts of the engine which are usually only visible with a borescope.

I think a interactive tech showcase is far from dead, You could also demonstrate 3D liquid resin printing - design something simple and for a small fee to cover materials and print it out. An IP related example those personal carbonite blocks (I'm suggesting liquid resin because it's a fast process)

We techies make the bad assumption that EVERYONE knows about this stuff.