I’ve not heard otherwise personally
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News Tron coaster coming to the Magic Kingdom
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
wannabeBelle
Well-Known Member
I was stunned to find out that ALL Of EPCOT only took 3 years to build!! Marie
That takes two years? When EPCOT Center was built in three?
John park hopper
Well-Known Member
Interesting so what has changed to slow construction to a snails pace?
Pixieish
Well-Known Member
My husband and I were just talking last night about how there are very few stores that have unique merch now in comparison to when we were on our honeymoon in 2000. Obviously there are exceptions, but for the most part, it's the same stuff everywhere...which is a huge shame because the attraction/land specific stuff is the stuff people want and will pay more for, but they shouldn't have to hunt for it.
Missing20K
Well-Known Member
I can't speak to the exact process here, just speaking from experience in designing and administering construction of large scale buildings. You might be amazed at the glacial pace of construction these days. Engineers, particularly, are not known for their speed in creating documents, at least the one's we use.
You would know far better than I, but EPCOT Center wasn't designed and constructed in three years, was it? There seems to be many years of design iteration for EPCOT before shovel went to ground, no? Truly asking, as I am in awe of your knowledge of the Disney history.
EDIT: Also, did they use third party architecture and construction firms then, or did they do everything in house then? I have no clue.
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Missing20K
Well-Known Member
No clue about the gazebo, but the Poly is essentially a 50's/60's motor lodge dressed up. Not to mention we aren't discussing creating the design and construction documents. As well as the fact the regulatory environment regarding ADA accessibility and International, State, and Local Building Codes wasn't remotely what it is today.
These things are true, But the way we build and manufacture things have also improved and expedited to negate most of that as well. It is fiscal calendar and pleasing shareholders now more than anything else.
Also, this coaster is a predesigned model in a show building that already has media completed and proof of concepts.
ZodIsGr8
Well-Known Member
And isn't it amazing they can put up hotels and restaurants in no time at all, but a single ride takes 4 years. They can go fast when they want to.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
I
The Polynesian was a lot more than a 60s motor lodge... That is an over simplification... and I am sure there are more regulations now, but 2 years and 4 months worth of regulations? I have no expectaion of them building this ride in 8 months, but 3+ years seems awfully excessive.
Missing20K
Well-Known Member
I
The Polynesian was a lot more than a 60s motor lodge... That is an over simplification... and I am sure there are more regulations now, but 2 years and 4 months worth of regulations? I have no expectaion of them building this ride in 8 months, but 3+ years seems awfully excessive.
Take the "thatch" roofs off and you have a collection of two story motor lodges.
And yes, the regulatory environment adds an incredible amount of time to the process. There are so many agencies that need to "sign off" on plans that to get them approved alone can take months in some locales.
EDIT: As an example, I'm currently working on what is essentially a utility shed for a national telecom. It's 20 feet by 40 feet. I've been working on it for 4 months. No approvals from the Historic Board yet, no Building Permit yet, no shovel to ground. This is a structure that does not even hold any people, just equipment. Yes the regulatory environment for construction is a major hurdle to the speed of the process.
Fair point about the design time. Design for the park as-built began in early 79 and finished roughly in August 1982 (no joke). Design was virtually all in house I belive but construction was sub contracted to just about everyone. The running joke was phase one opened October 1982 but was finished December 1982.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
Buildings are buildings, but to build that amount of them, plus several restaurants, a monorail station, a lobby building with waterfalls, two elaborate swimming pools and a wave making system in the lake, a marina... it is much more complex than building a Howard Johnson's...
and getting different approvals can be a lengthy process, but are you then suggesting that they construction is going to sit for 2+ years awating approvals and then be built in a year? No, of course not... A lot of those approvals and plan designs are done long before the first dirt is moved and usuall long before any public announcement is ever made...let alone artwork of the completed attraction created... Before we see anything and any sort of concept art released publicly, working plans etc are already done... Not saying they don't go through rounds of cuts afterwards, but the basics are complete.
they didnt tell the art department to draw something up to release to the public and they will figure it out later...
aladdin2007
Well-Known Member
which was a big mistake, in my opinion anyway, especially with the hordes of crowds. As it is people are now camping out in the middle of stores sitting in the middle of the floors, on store shelves etc...I couldn't believe how bad it was in the magic kingdom last week. the emporium was gridlock. ok sorry I got off topic.
Missing20K
Well-Known Member
Never said it wasn't more elaborate as a resort. I said the buildings are not complicated. There is a reason in that pic the buildings are all being completed at roughly the same time, and it's not because they were difficult to build.
I'm not trying to tell anyone what is happening with the TRON coaster delays, I'm just saying what I've experienced personally designing and construction large scale building projects. That's all. I'm not sure everyone here appreciates the time it really takes to go from the idea, to a design, to construction documents, to actual construction. Just trying to help shed light on the process.
Missing20K
Well-Known Member
Still a very quick timeline that would just be nearly impossible for any firm to meet based on current design and construction processes. Thanks for the info!
EDIT: Did they use multiple outside firms for construction? I mean it seems they would have had to considering the size. My guess is these days one General Contractor is awarded the overall bid, and they subsequently sub-contract out the individual trades. This also adds time to the process. When the GC has to wait on an electrical contractor's worker who was sick or something, it all starts to snowball.
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cmb5002
Well-Known Member
It is a very quick timeline. Something else to consider: Building EPCOT is also the type of work that brings multiple national companies into an area, that have more resources to throw around. Building Tron and other current projects is more of a job for local/regional construction companies. Plus they didn't earn a dime on Epcot til it was open. MK doesn't need Tron to make money.
There's also a tremendous lack of quality construction employees. Frankly the industry is still seeing the fallout from the 2008 crash. Crews I see are a mix of a few grizzled veterans ready to retire and bunch of young guys that don't have a clue. In 2008, all the young guys were laid off and lots of them found other jobs and never came back. They'd be the foremen right now, helping train the new generation, but they just aren't there.
Not to say all of the projects couldn't be done quicker. Quality project/quick project/cheap project - choose 2.
