News Toy Story Mania to be available via standby queue ahead of entrance relocation

[AJDMB05]

It will be funny to see people realize that FP has ruined wait times for other attractions.. They probably won't but 2 and 2 together anyway.

I agree, I would bet if you averaged a lot of data out, it's overall not much of a time-savings to have FP+ at basically all rides/shows, and in my opinion, planning out my rides is a worse experience than pre-FP+. Sure, you save a few hours on FoP, maybe an hour on stuff like TSMM, but everything you wait stand-by on is worse off for it.

In a situation where FP+ is really needed for non E-ticket rides (NYE, Christmas..?), you're probably waiting a very long time for everything anyway. I wonder if things would get better if they *really* limited FPs per time window, so it doesn't impact standby as much. But with how much they promote that part of the experience you'd have a ton of complaints. Feels like they really painted themselves into a corner with a solution that does not scale well.

 

[TeriofTerror]

@lentesta, how do you anticipate this will affect standby times? Is this currently reflected in wait time estimates on TouringPlans.com? (She asked selfishly, as she is currently reworking her own touring plans for early May.)

 

[bhg469]

I agree, I would bet if you averaged a lot of data out, it's overall not much of a time-savings to have FP+ at basically all rides/shows, and in my opinion, planning out my rides is a worse experience than pre-FP+. Sure, you save a few hours on FoP, maybe an hour on stuff like TSMM, but everything you wait stand-by on is worse off for it.

In a situation where FP+ is really needed for non E-ticket rides (NYE, Christmas..?), you're probably waiting a very long time for everything anyway. I wonder if things would get better if they *really* limited FPs per time window, so it doesn't impact standby as much. But with how much they promote that part of the experience you'd have a ton of complaints. Feels like they really painted themselves into a corner with a solution that does not scale well.

They need to charge for all fastpass use or get rid of it all at once. That is the best solution for everyone.

 

[Rteetz]

I can’t seem to find a definitive answer on why FPs can’t be booked after May 7th. I also don’t understand why this “news” came out today. It’s been known for weeks if not a month now that no FP would be available at least from April 9th to May 7th.

 

[Goofyernmost]

They need to charge for all fastpass use or get rid of it all at once. That is the best solution for everyone.

I vote for charging. It will cut down on the numbers of FP's issued and speed up the standby lines. That is how it works in Universal. I've never needed a pass yet to have reasonable waits. (Unless something was broken) That said, I would cheer about the discontinuation of FP completely. I don't think that will fly though. I could tolerate the people going ahead of me much better if I knew that they had to pay extra for that privilege.

 

[Kman101]

They need to charge for all fastpass use or get rid of it all at once. That is the best solution for everyone.

Agreed

 

[Uncle Lupe]

This should be a great experiment for the great FP debate. So it will be down to 2 ride tracks again for a month? But with both now a "normal" line it should flow unless a track goes down which does happen.

 

[MisterPenguin]

How can this be an experiment when there are tracks down? Note the plural. There are only three tracks. It's going to no-FP because only one track will be open, which was what was rumored to be happening.

Anyone have data on TSM with only one track?

 

[Rteetz]

How can this be an experiment when there are tracks down? Note the plural. There are only three tracks. It's going to no-FP because only one track will be open, which was what was rumored to be happening.

Anyone have data on TSM with only one track?

Well currently it’s operating at two tracks vs. three with standby and FP. My guess is when they go down to one track is will be the third track that they use but I could be wrong. It’s not going to be fun if you want to ride during that time period.

 

[lentesta]

@lentesta, how do you anticipate this will affect standby times? Is this currently reflected in wait time estimates on TouringPlans.com? (She asked selfishly, as she is currently reworking her own touring plans for early May.)

We've already updated to TSM wait times to account for reduced capacity and no FP availability. The ride hasn't operated like this, so the first couple weeks will be interesting.

The lack of FP should lower standby times. The lack of extra capacity should almost exactly offset that. So it could be a wash.

 

[disney4life2008]

It will be funny to see people realize that FP has ruined wait times for other attractions.. They probably won't but 2 and 2 together anyway.

The fact that space ship earth ever has a wait more than 20 minutes is crazy.

 

[Goofyernmost]

The fact that space ship earth ever has a wait more than 20 minutes is crazy.

It was the norm in the 80's. Actually more then 20 minutes. The queues on both sides were in full use.

 

[marni1971]

The fact that space ship earth ever has a wait more than 20 minutes is crazy.

It was the norm in the 80's. Actually more then 20 minutes. The queues on both sides were in full use.

There was often a line. Thing was the line kept shuffling forward.

 

[mikejs78]

For evidence, all one has to do is look back only six years ago before FastPass+ was implemented.

Not really evidence as there are many other factors that affect wait times, including increased crowds. Again, this will be a good comparison because we have an attraction with FP+ that will be closing it for a month with current crowd levels. We can make a 1:1 comparison.

For evidence all one has to do is look how quickly lines move during extra magic hours when there are no fast passes.

Also not evidence as crowd levels are significantly less during EMHs. Only on-site guests, so most of the crowd isn't there. Plus EMHs aren't during peak time of day.

 

[mikejs78]

We've already updated to TSM wait times to account for reduced capacity and no FP availability. The ride hasn't operated like this, so the first couple weeks will be interesting.

The lack of FP should lower standby times. The lack of extra capacity should almost exactly offset that. So it could be a wash.

I'm curious @lentesta - let's say TSMM was operating at full capacity, and they did away with FP+ and ran the whole thing as standby? By how much would standby wait times actually theoretically decrease, given that the people with FP+ reservations now need to wait in the standby line?

 

[nickys]

I'm curious @lentesta - let's say TSMM was operating at full capacity, and they did away with FP+ and ran the whole thing as standby? By how much would standby wait times actually theoretically decrease, given that the people with FP+ reservations now need to wait in the standby line?

I'll let Len answer the math involved here.

But the important thing for me is that the line would continually move, so the perception is that the line is shorter. It's the constant stop-start of the SB line that drives me insane!

Even the line for Escape from Gringotts @universal moved constantly, so although we probably queued for about an hour, we were always moving forward (so much so I was holding back at times trying to read the signs) so it didn't seem that long at all.

 

[neoshinok]

^ That exactly. Without fastpass, the line would move forward faster than the speed of a fastpass line, as there are no interruptions from two lines being arranged into one. Regardless of the difference in wait time, that alone makes waiting in line much more tolerable.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I'll let Len answer the math involved here.

But the important thing for me is that the line would continually move, so the perception is that the line is shorter. It's the constant stop-start of the SB line that drives me insane!

Even the line for Escape from Gringotts @universal moved constantly, so although we probably queued for about an hour, we were always moving forward (so much so I was holding back at times trying to read the signs) so it didn't seem that long at all.

If lack of FP meant the line continually moved, then there would be no stop-and-go after the FP merge... which isn't the case with TSM in my experience.

 

[mikejs78]

^ That exactly. Without fastpass, the line would move forward faster than the speed of a fastpass line, as there are no interruptions from two lines being arranged into one. Regardless of the difference in wait time, that alone makes waiting in line much more tolerable.

But that's perception, not actual wait times. If an attraction has a capacity of 1500 pph, and 750 come from standby and 750 from FP+, and say an additional 100 guests per hour want to ride, that forms the standby line. Now if we get rid of FP+, those 750 people are now displaced and in standby. So we now have 1500 pph in standby and 100 in line, because those FP+ people don't just go away. They're now in the standby line, so they add to that line. The only three scenarios where I see getting rid of FP+ decreasing standby wait times is:

1. Some people who had FP+ may decide to forgo the attraction altogether
2. There is an actual time penalty to merging, which I'm not convinced of yet (but could be if presented the evidence)
3. Less popular attractions that people make FP+ reservations for in order to simply fill out their 3. This to me is the most credible and is less an issue with the idea of a FastPass line and more with the current implementation of FP+ that sets an artificial benchmark of 3.

I'd love to be proven wrong and to see the math that shows that FP+ actually does increase standby times....

It's easy to hate on FP+ and blame it for all the crowd woes... And that may be the case, but I'd like to see the data, as one thing I've learned in life is that anecdotal evidence and conventional wisdom is often wrong.

 

[lentesta]

I'm curious @lentesta - let's say TSMM was operating at full capacity, and they did away with FP+ and ran the whole thing as standby? By how much would standby wait times actually theoretically decrease, given that the people with FP+ reservations now need to wait in the standby line?

There are a couple of factors to consider here:

1. What percent of people with FP now, would ride TSMM even without the FP?
2. At what time of day would they ride it?

I think for (1) we all have rides that we only go on if the wait is under 20 minutes (a "balking constraint"). FP increases the demand for some rides because it eliminates balking constraints for lots of people.

The other thing FP does is spread guest arrivals out over the entire day, in relatively even numbers. TSMM should be allowing around 103 people into the FP line every 5 minutes or so. Without FP, guests might just go to TSMM when they arrive at the park. You'd expect to see higher wait times in the late morning, then, because that's when most people arrive.

It's also possible that FP is keeping people in the park a little longer than they'd stay otherwise. If your normal inclination would be to leave the Studios around 3 pm, but you've got a TSMM FP for 4:30 p.m., you'd probably stay the extra 90 minutes.

Make some assumptions around those things and we could probably work through the math.