Tiana's Bayou Adventure: Disneyland Watch & Discussion

[denyuntilcaught]

I don't know if it was brought up in this thread or not and I'm admittedly not reading through the whole thing, but I'm sure that many of you are aware that Disney went and preemptively changed Snow White's Scary Adventures to Snow White's Enchanted Wish at Disneyland and also changed several scenes in the ride, then got backlash from the very people they were trying to appease due to the "final scene". If you don't know what I'm talking about, look it up. The point is, people who live in their mom's basement who can't even afford to go to Disney and make a stink online will never be happy. They're miserable individuals. Disney needs to worry about people in their parks and unless they're getting serious backlash from their actual guests, they should chill out when it comes to changing things that their regulars have enjoyed for years.

Valid point, yes, except you're talking about two different groups of people and two different objectives. It's been well known now that the whole controversy around Snow White's finale scene was drummed up by a pair of SJW reporters for the SF gate, to which then Twitter took to task and pretty much everyone agreed that the reporters' claims were bogus.

The audience Disney is targeting with the Splash change isn't this nuanced group. It's a broader play to address their wrongs and to take a more meaningful and respectful approach to storytelling that avoids offending not SJWs, but the larger portion of the population that was negatively depicted in the attraction's source material.

Nuance.

 

[ElvisMickey]

Valid point, yes, except you're talking about two different groups of people and two different objectives. It's been well known now that the whole controversy around Snow White's finale scene was drummed up by a pair of SJW reporters for the SF gate, to which then Twitter took to task and pretty much everyone agreed that the reporters' claims were bogus.

The audience Disney is targeting with the Splash change isn't this nuanced group. It's a broader play to address their wrongs and to take a more meaningful and respectful approach to storytelling that avoids offending not SJWs, but the larger portion of the population that was negatively depicted in the attraction's source material.

Nuance.

And how many of those folks actually frequent Disneyland or WDW? Is Disney trying to appease their guests or the potential “new money”?

 

[EagleScout610]

Valid point, yes, except you're talking about two different groups of people and two different objectives. It's been well known now that the whole controversy around Snow White's finale scene was drummed up by a pair of SJW reporters for the SF gate, to which then Twitter took to task and pretty much everyone agreed that the reporters' claims were bogus.

The audience Disney is targeting with the Splash change isn't this nuanced group. It's a broader play to address their wrongs and to take a more meaningful and respectful approach to storytelling that avoids offending not SJWs, but the larger portion of the population that was negatively depicted in the attraction's source material.

Nuance.

A. Snow White hasn't been turned into the Disney equivalent of The Ring where you die after watching its that terrible. B. No Snow White ride changes will have quite the impact Splash leaving will.

 

[EagleScout610]

The controversy did not kick back up until Frederick Chambers posted his idea for a retheme in 2020... THIRTY-ONE YEARS AFTER THE RIDE OPENED. If the ride featuring characters from the animated segments of Song of the South (which are often singled out as being the film's only redeeming factor) was such a bad thing, it wouldn't have taken us thirty-one years to notice it.

The funny thing is, I bet most of you went on Splash Mountain at least once and liked it before this mess got started.

1. Again with the Chambers attacks huh? Splash has ALWAYS been under scrutiny for its theme. Why did Disney stop mentioning the ride being based on SOTS in the 00s? Was that Mr. Chambers? Why hasn't Disney openly released the film since the 80s? Again Mr. Chambers? Why had plans been drafted to replace Splash Mountain before? I bet Frederick was behind those The point is Disney has been trying to boot Song from the parks for a while. Give it a rest with Frederick Chambers.

2. Just like any Disney Attraction, some people love it, some people hate it. We've come to the point where most people have accepted the fact that Splash is changing. Doesn't mean we love the ride any less, we've just come to terms with the inevitable. Splash Mountain, at least in California for now, is going away.

 

[Californian Elitist]

The controversy did not kick back up until Frederick Chambers posted his idea for a retheme in 2020... THIRTY-ONE YEARS AFTER THE RIDE OPENED. If the ride featuring characters from the animated segments of Song of the South (which are often singled out as being the film's only redeeming factor) was such a bad thing, it wouldn't have taken us thirty-one years to notice it.

The ride and the movie are separate things, and Dumbo, Fantasia, and Peter Pan having racist stuff in 'em has always seen about as well-known as Song of the South is. Removing Splash Mountain out of fear that someone is offended by the movie it was based on but allowing attractions based on other movies that someone is offended by is hypocritical.

The bit about the controversy reappearing after that CM wrote that post is false.

The ride and the movie aren’t separate things to the public. Peter Pan, Fantasia, Dumbo, etc. don’t compare. Not only have they not been hidden from the public, but they haven’t been labeled racist films in general, at least not on a grand scale. They commonly are called out for racist scenes, but SotS is commonly known as a racist movie.

 

[Brer Panther]

1. Again with the Chambers attacks huh? Splash has ALWAYS been under scrutiny for its theme. Why did Disney stop mentioning the ride being based on SOTS in the 00s? Was that Mr. Chambers? Why hasn't Disney openly released the film since the 80s? Again Mr. Chambers? Why had plans been drafted to replace Splash Mountain before? I bet Frederick was behind those The point is Disney has been trying to boot Song from the parks for a while. Give it a rest with Frederick Chambers.

2. Just like any Disney Attraction, some people love it, some people hate it. We've come to the point where most people have accepted the fact that Splash is changing. Doesn't mean we love the ride any less, we've just come to terms with the inevitable. Splash Mountain, at least in California for now, is going away.

1. Show me proof that plans had been drafted to replace Splash Mountain before. If they have, wouldn't we have heard about it on this very site? Pretty sure that Tangled idea was fan-made, too. We knew about the Guardians of the Galaxy rides, Mickey's Runaway Railway, and TRON before they announced those rides. I never saw any plans for a Splash Mountain retheme get leaked before they announced it. Unless Disney used Chambers to turn people against Splash Mountain so there wouldn't be complaints about them changing it, I highly doubt that Chambers isn't at least partly to blame for what's going on. And if he isn't, why did his idea get so much press? And why are sites and podcasts interviewing him over the idea? I'll stop pointing out Chambers playing a part in this when you and others on here stop

2. You can not claim to love an attraction and then argue that it should be removed. By continually pulling the "Song of the South is racist, that means the ride is racist too" card, you are saying that the ride is bad and that Disney is doing something heroic by removing it. Saying you still love the ride after going on and on about how it should be rethemed is incredibly hypocritical.

3. Did you seriously compare Song of the South to The Ring?

And no, Disney is not doing this because they care about anyone actually being offended by Splash Mountain. Either they're doing this because people demanded it, to sell more Tiana merchandise, because they're tired of people bringing up that Song of the South exist and want to hide from it, or a combination of all three.

Speaking of being tired, I am tired of hearing the exact same excuse spewed out by you people over and over again. Yes, Song of the South is racist. I don't think that the Brers being in Splash Mountain is enough to make it racist too. If the ride included characters from the film's live action segments, slaves, or even the Tar Baby, I'd agree that those should be taken out. But it doesn't.

 

[el_super]

I’m not a fan of canceling history so Disney should most definitely stand behind this movie. We can’t change history by ignoring it.

You can't change history, but there's nothing to be gained by standing by the film.

 

[AEfx]

The ride and the movie aren’t separate things to the public.

I would heartily disagree with that.

The film all but vanished from public consciousness because most people alive have never seen it, unless they sought out bootlegs as a rabid fan or academic.

Splash Mountain as a classic Disney attraction transcended the roots of its inspiration to become its own thing. To the general public, "Zip a Dee Doo Dah" was identified with a ride, not a movie that almost no one has ever seen, just like "Yo Ho Yo Ho" is identified with Pirates or "Grim Grinning Ghosts" is identified with the Haunted Mansion.

The ride was constructed and loved by generations of kids as it's own "unique" attraction, who never even knew a movie existed.

I've made my peace with the proposed changes, I'm not going to argue about that - but this idea that 99% of people who ever rode it had any idea it had anything to do with a movie that hasn't been shown publicly in their lifetimes is a real stretch.

 

[el_super]

Again, I am not defending Song of the South. I am not saying that the film is not racist. I'm not saying that the film should be supported more so that the characters become more popular. I just don't think it should matter what the attraction's source material is like so long as the attraction itself is not racist.

The funny thing is, I bet most of you went on Splash Mountain at least once and liked it before this mess got started.

Yeah... I like the attraction and I've been a fan since it opened.

I am in full support of changing it.

Times change and expectations change. What was acceptable in 1989, isn't acceptable now. You can go with it, or become the grumpy old man yelling at kids "BACK IN MY DAY."

 

[Brer Panther]

The bit about the controversy reappearing after that CM wrote that post is false.

Really? Were people talking about Song of the South that much before the "retheme Splash Mountain" demand started up? I didn't see anyone talking about it online before then. Even if Chambers' idea didn't start it back up, it definitely started up around that time.

Yeah... I like the attraction and I've been a fan since it opened.

I am in full support of changing it.

I'm just gonna say this again - you can not claim to love an attraction and then argue that it should be removed. By continually pulling the "Song of the South is racist, that means the ride is racist too" card, you are saying that the ride is bad and that Disney is doing something heroic by removing it. Saying you still love the ride after going on and on about how it should be rethemed is incredibly hypocritical.

And yes, what was acceptable in 1989 can be different than what was acceptable in 2020. However, I fail to see how a cartoon rabbit is suddenly unacceptable when it wasn't in 1989. We knew the Tar Baby wasn't acceptable in 1989, didn't take us until 2020 to figure THAT OUT.

 

[Sharon&Susan]

Really? Were people talking about Song of the South that much before the "retheme Splash Mountain" demand started up? I didn't see anyone talking about it online before then.

In the Imagineering Story, Song of the South was mentioned as problematic and everyone knows Iger's stance on SOTS whenever that was mentioned at a shareholder's meeting.

 

[Kate F]

I guarantee once the new toy syndrome has passed, there will be people saying they want the original back. They don’t know what they’ve got till it’s gone.

 

[Brer Panther]

In the Imagineering Story, Song of the South was mentioned as problematic and everyone knows Iger's stance on SOTS whenever that was mentioned at a shareholder's meeting.

That's true. But I don't think it should matter how problematic the movie is so long as the ride itself isn't problematic.

 

[el_super]

I'm just gonna say this again - you can not claim to love an attraction and then argue that it should be removed. By continually pulling the "Song of the South is racist, that means the ride is racist too" card, you are saying that the ride is bad and that Disney is doing something heroic by removing it. Saying you still love the ride after going on and on about how it should be rethemed is incredibly hypocritical.

This is .... childish. If you grow up loving PB&J as a kid, are you then a hypocrite if you don't eat it every night as an adult?

I do love Splash Mountain and I do think Disney is doing the right thing to remove it. Does that make me a racist? Maybe? A little? I realize that there is no such thing as a perfect view of the world and I certainly don't represent one so yeah, I get that my thoughts and feelings don't fit into perfect yes/no or black/white boxes. I think change is a good thing and am certainly not selfish enough to think that my enjoyment of an attraction is worth whatever pain it is causing others.

And yes, what was acceptable in 1989 can be different than what was acceptable in 2020. However, I fail to see how a cartoon rabbit is suddenly unacceptable when it wasn't in 1989. We knew the Tar Baby wasn't acceptable in 1989, didn't take us until 2020 to figure THAT OUT.

For the 100th time: it isn't the content of the ride that is racist, it is the appropriation and exploitation of the stories for financial gain that is racist.

 

[Kate F]

Funny how people say no one cares about the characters and that they’re unmerchandisable considering their plushes and Funko Pops sold out in 2018-19.

 

[CaptinEO]

This is .... childish. If you grow up loving PB&J as a kid, are you then a hypocrite if you don't eat it every night as an adult?

I do love Splash Mountain and I do think Disney is doing the right thing to remove it. Does that make me a racist? Maybe? A little? I realize that there is no such thing as a perfect view of the world and I certainly don't represent one so yeah, I get that my thoughts and feelings don't fit into perfect yes/no or black/white boxes. I think change is a good thing and am certainly not selfish enough to think that my enjoyment of an attraction is worth whatever pain it is causing others.



For the 100th time: it isn't the content of the ride that is racist, it is the appropriation and exploitation of the stories for financial gain that is racist.

I agree, it's not a one or the other type scenario. I can fully admit I love Splash but also realize that the source material has stereotypes.

 

[Brer Panther]

For the 100th time: it isn't the content of the ride that is racist, it is the appropriation and exploitation of the stories for financial gain that is racist.

I don't recall Disney ever claiming to have created the Brers, and by that logic, Alice in Wonderland should close because Disney is exploiting Lewis Carroll's story for financial gain. And I've never seen "they're exploiting the stories for financial gain" used as a justification for the attraction being racist before. Until now, it's just been "Song of the South and Splash Mountain are one in the same".

 

[EagleScout610]

Funny how people say no one cares about the characters and that they’re unmerchandisable considering their plushes and Funko Pops sold out in 2018-19.

We never said that. We're saying that they're being ushered out due to their association with Song of the South. I'm sure many people have them on their favorites list.

 

[CaptinEO]

I don't recall Disney ever claiming to have created the Brers, and by that logic, Alice in Wonderland should close because Disney is exploiting Lewis Carroll's story for financial gain. And I've never seen "they're exploiting the stories for financial gain" used as a justification for the attraction being racist before. Until now, it's just been "Song of the South and Splash Mountain are one in the same".

Yep the source material of these were dramatically altered way beyond the original intent.

 

[EagleScout610]

Really? Were people talking about Song of the South that much before the "retheme Splash Mountain" demand started up? I didn't see anyone talking about it online before then. Even if Chambers' idea didn't start it back up, it definitely started up around that time.

Dude think about what was happening at that time. Everything regarding race was under scrutiny. Businesses, movies, Disney... It should've been a surprise to nobody that Disney would take this opportunity to smite Song