tirian
Well-Known Member
Most people do follow instructions at DTD and DCA’s BV Street. The majority follow instructions at WDW. They would follow instructions within DL’s gates too.
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Politics Theme Park Reopening Guidelines to be released 10/20/20
- Thread starter Stevek
- Start date
This thread contains political discussion related to the original thread topic
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
The issue is more the types advocating that people generally ignore the advice of public health experts and doctors as we have seen repeatedly in this thread.
tirian
Well-Known Member
I understand that, but in theory, Disney could “safely” operate DL as an extension of DTD or at severely reduced capacity for rich celebrities, since it already “safely” operates a shopping district (by making sure the virus could never be traced back to them).
The behind-the-scenes drama surrounding OC theme parks fascinates me.
I say this as someone who has followed health guidelines since the beginning. I’ve also amassed a large collection of Disney-themed face masks, and I guess I’ll make them into a quilt when this is all over.
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Deleted member 107043
I say this as someone who has followed health guidelines since the beginning. I’ve also amassed a large collection of Disney-themed face masks, and I guess I’ll make them into a quilt when this is all over.
I know the day will come, but right now it's weird for me to imagine being in a large public gathering maskless.
el_super
Well-Known Member
Eh that's debatable. How many people have gone to Downtown Disney to meet with friends or colleagues that they haven't seen in awhile? We don't really know.
People are still getting sick. Either the mitigation techniques being suggested are not enough, or people are just outright ignoring them. With the traffic over the holiday, I think it's safe to assume people ignored them to be with their families. People made a decision to be with their families rather than continue to control the virus. Tough call to make, to be sure, but it's done. Now, as an extension of that decision, Disneyland will have to be closed for longer.
They are estimating that hospital capacity in OC may run out before Christmas. Not a good time to have a theme park open.
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Deleted member 107043
truecoat
Well-Known Member
There are some nightmare scenarios out there of hospitals not having the ability to handle any trauma, heart attacks, pregnancies etc very soon. I think it was Arizona that is close to that right now.
SuddenStorm
Well-Known Member
I gave my estimate on when Disneyland would regain full capacity in the post you quoted- so of course I don't think Disneyland will never regain full capacity... 'like ever'.
In regards to the whole 'if people had just listened, this would all be over' attitude- by and large people do listen. And the virus still spreads. States that report higher then average mask use (like California)- still have the virus spreading at similar rates to those that don't. Because that's what viruses do. People have been saying that deflection since March when people did listen and hospitals across the country weren't overwhelmed like we were told to expect, and the goalposts moved for the first time.
There's not a chance Disneyland is open by March, let alone full capacity- and it has nothing to do with an 'inability to follow instructions'.
There is a part of me that thinks that folks has just decided that a) the death rate is low as a % of infections and b) a vaccine is coming so they are much more open to taking risks. When I see packed streets in Big Bear, it's pretty clear that many folks are willing to risk it more and more. I'm just gonna hunker down for a few more months and see how this vaccine works out.
When we took more significant precautions, the virus spread slowed significantly. When we opened things up, it spread and it's very clear that while some folks continued to take precautions, many folks chose not too...and yes, it's a virus which is why if everyone would have just continued to follow the guidelines, we would have managed better. Exactly what many predicted would happen, is happening...a monster outbreak to end the year and start 2021.
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el_super
Well-Known Member
I really hope it doesn't come to that. I get that people are suffering from COVID news burnout, but hopefully people will realize again the seriousness and react. I fear that it will take a state (like North Dakota) losing complete control of their health care capacity for it to have a significant impact on public perception.
Which is why I expect this stay at home order to tighten sooner than later. Other counties will likely have all outdoor dining shut down like LA county is now. I don't expect them to shut down all retail completely but do see additional restrictions coming.
el_super
Well-Known Member
What exactly is the goalpost that you are referring to here? The idea that the lockdowns prevented the spread of the virus and actually worked, or the idea that the hospitals would reach capacity?
It seems to me that you think the goalposts moved, only because you incorrectly believed that the first lockdown would be the end of it. That was incorrect, and came at a time when people were suggesting this would go into next year.
People complained that the lockdowns were too destructive to the economy and hurting people's health, and so the government compromised and relented. Now that we see that as a huge mistake, and hospitals are facing capacity issues, we are meant to blame the government for moving the goalposts? No.
The virus hasn't changed. The proven mitigation techniques haven't changed. The thing that has changed is the population's willingness to comply.
It has everything to do with people not following instructions. And the goalposts never moved.
el_super
Well-Known Member
And add in family pressure to that as well. I saw a lot of posts from friends online debating whether to visit family for Thanksgiving and how mixed reactions were when people declined to visit. It's really hard to say no to family.
Unless you are the one that usually hosts/cooks because in my case it was pretty easy to tell everyone to stay home and make their own dinner for once.
Oh boy, do I understand this one. Was a significant point of contention in our HH this Thanksgiving.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I've always been bad at math. Always. If it weren't for Google, I'd never even attempt to figure some of those percentages from the Science & Data that I've posted here.
But speaking of mocking, suddenly today there's a whole new rash of California politicians to mock when I issue my Official Statement of Clarification upon my return home from my Thanksgiving holiday.
In no particular order;
San Francisco Mayor London Breed has today admitted she also dined at a group indoor dinner party with 8 people at The French Laundry exactly one day after Governor Newsom did. She even sat in that same small private dining room with those fabulous Saarinen chairs.
It was important for Mayor Breed to break Covid safety rules by traveling to Napa for dinner at The French Laundry because the mayor needed to be there "to celebrate socialite Goretti Lo Lui's 60th birthday". Perfection!
S.F. Mayor London Breed had her own French Laundry party — the night after Gavin Newsom’s
Breed’s dinner at an opulent restaurant — amid a pandemic and an economic catastrophe...
www.sfchronicle.com
Los Angeles County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl was caught dining at an outdoor restaurant in Santa Monica literally a few hours after she voted to shut down all outdoor dining in LA County, during Tuesday’s L.A. County Board of Supervisors meeting, Kuehl referred to outside dining as “a most dangerous situation”. Ms. Kuehl's apology statement today is a HILARIOUS example of political flim-flam lies.
Style points to Supervisor Kuehl's spokesman for repeatedly using the phrase "al fresco" when explaining that Ms. Kuehl was dining outdoors. Because al fresco makes it seem healthier and cleaner. Right?
LA County Supervisor dines at restaurant hours after voting to ban outdoor dining
Protesters gathered outside the home of LA County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl on Tuesday after a FOX 11 report revealed hours after she voted to ban outdoor dining she dined outdoors herself.
Back up in the Bay Area, San Jose Mayor Sam Licardo has admitted today that he travelled to Sonoma County and had Thanksgiving dinner with a group of people from five (5) different households.
Mayor Licardo's apology statement today claims that no photos or information of the dinner will be released because it was "a private event".
After urging small Thanksgiving, San Jose mayor sorry for gathering that broke Covid rules
“I understand my obligation as a public official to provide exemplary compliance with the public health orders," Mayor Sam Liccardo said.
www.nbcnews.com
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Deleted member 107043
MoonRakerSCM
Well-Known Member
Man, it's so funny. I JUST made the deciding vote in a restaurant dining policy that will ruin thousands of people's lives and put them in financial ruin that they may never recover from... and even made the comment during my reasoning that outdoor dining is currently “a most dangerous situation.”
Afterward I proceeded to go and dine outdoors.
As I mentioned after Newsom's incident, if you still support these people and their ways, you are mentally ill. Lemme throw one of these out there for good measure-.
Afterward I proceeded to go and dine outdoors.
As I mentioned after Newsom's incident, if you still support these people and their ways, you are mentally ill. Lemme throw one of these out there for good measure-
.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Exactly what rule did she break?
The birthday party Mayor Breed attended was on November 7th, so the Mandatory Guidance for Gatherings issued on October 9th was in effect. She basically violated the Mandatory Guidance on all the same categories and rules that Governor Newsom and First Partner did the day before.
The birthday dinner for fabulously-named socialite Gorretti Lo Lui was held in the same small, indoor dining room that Governor Newsom was in. So the following categories of the Mandatory Directive on Gatherings were violated by Mayor Breed and those in attendance, cut and pasted from the State Covid directive website;
- Gatherings that include more than 3 households are prohibited. This includes everyone present, including hosts and guests.
- To qualify as an outdoor gathering, the gathering must be held entirely outside, except that attendees may go inside to use restrooms as long as the restrooms are frequently sanitized.
- At all gatherings, everyone must stay at least 6 feet away from other people (except people in their own household) at all times. (Bolding on this bullet point is from the website, not me. )
- Seating must provide at least 6 feet of distance in all directions—front-to-back and side-to-side between different households.
- A gathering is considered an outdoor gathering only if it is held at a facility that allows the free flow of outdoor air through the entire space, as specified in the California Department of Public Health’s mandatory guidance on Use of Temporary Structures for Outdoor Business Operations.
- Gatherings should be two hours or less. (This isn't Applebee's. The 9 Course dinners at The French Laundry famously stretch for 3 hours or more.)
- People who are singing, shouting, chanting, cheering, or exercising are strongly encouraged to maintain physical distancing beyond 6 feet to further reduce risk. People who are singing or chanting are strongly encouraged to do so quietly at or below the volume of a normal speaking voice. (This is only included because it was specifically a birthday party, and I assume the guests sand Happy Birthday to Mrs. Long.)
In this now infamous photo below, just replace Governor Newsom with Mayor Breed, and replace the President of the California Medical Association sitting to Newsom's right with socialite Gorretti Lui Long, and you've got another fun night at The French Laundry!
Another California politician caught dining at French Laundry
San Francisco’s mayor is the latest to fall prey to the siren song of the famed Napa Valley eatery, flouting coronavirus guidelines
www.theguardian.com
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MarvelCharacterNerd
Well-Known Member
Was Powell's affected by the riots? I hadn't heard that. How terribly sad. That's always been on my bucket list to visit!Thank you, friend, I did have a nice Thanksgiving. I spent it with several generations of family from a collection of West Coast states, and ate waaaaay too much. And then on Friday we went up to Portland to a couple of malls in the western suburbs of Portlandia where life is still normal.
I would have normally gone into downtown Portland to shop at the fabulous Powell's and a few favorite furnishing stores downtown, but that entire central city is a boarded up wasteland now. It's so sad what downtown Portland has become in just 5 short months, entirely destroyed and smashed and abandoned.
At least the suburbs are still normal up here, as they are in OC as well.
I hope your holiday weekend was fun! I have half a mind to take a detour to Santa Clara County on my way home this week, if only to roll down the window blasting The Supremes and yelling "QUARANTINE!" at random freeway drivers.
My #HappyThanksGavin was a quiet night with just my household but good food and good streaming TV. And then over the holiday weekend I over-splurged for my Disney collection since I'd gone nowhere and spent nothing (other than groceries) for the past nine months. So I made up for it. lol But at least I can hope that that money spent will help another family (who was selling their collection to make some money). I am seeing/hearing about a lot of people selling their collections to make ends meet right now, including some laid off cast members.
And now I'll go back to being the financially responsible shut-in I've been the past nine months since I last went to Disneyland vs. being the irresponsible online spendthrift this weekend holiday shopping for meeeeeeeeeeee.