D
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
Politics Theme Park Reopening Guidelines to be released 10/20/20
- Thread starter Stevek
- Start date
This thread contains political discussion related to the original thread topic
TP2000
Well-Known Member
"Nice" to see the Flamingo Theater directly across from my old office complex is still getting it's intended usage
Was that what was there previously? I knew there were a few of these establishments along that stretch of Ball Road, but I have to admit I wasn't keeping track of their names or themes. This Satin place looked to be newly remodeled, and doing gangbuster business with people parking in overflow lots and a crowd around the front doors.
Disneyland is still closed.
Yeah... that's just silly. It's a good burger, very clean restaurant with good service. But it's not worth that.
I can't think of anything that is worth that really, especially after age 50.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I'm listening to KFI on their app. Apparently Governor Newsom had a press conference from his home today. He pre-announced an announcement of a full Stay At Home order for most of California coming later this week.
Also, apparently Santa Clara County has a new 14 day quarantine mandate that took effect today where if you travel to Santa Clara County from more than 150 miles away you are expected to quarantine yourself for 14 days.
So what did the KFI reporter do? He went to San Jose International Airport today and interviewed arriving travelers arriving from hundreds to thousands of miles away, from different states and different countries and continents. There was no signage or information at the airport about any Santa Clara County quarantine, and no airline is making announcements or communicating in any way to arriving passengers that they must quarantine after they leave baggage claim. Understandably, passengers in the terminal had no idea a quarantine existed when the reporter asked them about it and no one interviewed said they had any intention of complying.
A spokesman for San Jose's airport said they were not informed in advance of the quarantine mandate by the county, and they are now working on creating a "signage package" for arriving passengers.
The hits just keep coming for California, don't they?!?
Also, apparently Santa Clara County has a new 14 day quarantine mandate that took effect today where if you travel to Santa Clara County from more than 150 miles away you are expected to quarantine yourself for 14 days.
So what did the KFI reporter do? He went to San Jose International Airport today and interviewed arriving travelers arriving from hundreds to thousands of miles away, from different states and different countries and continents. There was no signage or information at the airport about any Santa Clara County quarantine, and no airline is making announcements or communicating in any way to arriving passengers that they must quarantine after they leave baggage claim. Understandably, passengers in the terminal had no idea a quarantine existed when the reporter asked them about it and no one interviewed said they had any intention of complying.
A spokesman for San Jose's airport said they were not informed in advance of the quarantine mandate by the county, and they are now working on creating a "signage package" for arriving passengers.
The hits just keep coming for California, don't they?!?
Last edited:
TP2000
Well-Known Member
And DLP has extended its closure until February.
Europe is a real mess right now. France is woefully behind the USA on testing, and France has a higher fatality rate than the US. So you would think mass testing would be a priority for them, but apparently not.
But some of France's neighboring countries, especially the UK that sends a lot of tourists to Disneyland Paris, are even worse off. The UK, Spain, Italy, Belgium all have higher death rates the the USA does, and testing is spotty in most countries except the UK. Denmark and the UK are the only European nations that have a higher testing rate than the USA.
Covid Tests Completed as Percent of Total National Population - 11/29/20
Denmark = 121% (7 Million tests)
United Kingdom = 65% (43 Million tests)
United States = 59% (194 Million tests)
Belgium = 51% (6 Million tests)
Spain = 49% (23 Million tests)
Norway = 42% (2 Million tests)
Italy = 36% (22 Million tests)
Germany = 33% (27 Million tests)
Switzerland = 32% (3 Million tests)
France = 30% (20 Million tests)
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per 1M Population | RealClearPolitics
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per Population | RealClearPolitics
TP2000
Well-Known Member
It's not just the SoCal radio stations poking fun of Santa Clara's surprise quarantine. The Bay Area stations are now heading to San Jose's airport and discovering the same thing that KFI did; no posted notices, no signage, no information, no knowledge, and no plans to comply from arriving travelers. 
abc7news.com
"Nobody told me anything," said passenger Najee Russell, "You have to get the word out for something to happen. I doubt anybody is going to quarantine for two weeks. We just got off Thanksgiving that's probably a week off work. Who wants to take two more weeks off work?" he said.
COVID-19 restrictions: Mandatory 2-week quarantine now in effect for travelers arriving to Santa Clara County
The mandatory order went into effect 12:01 a.m. Monday morning and covers any travelers returning from a trip 150 miles outside of Santa Clara County's borders or father.
abc7news.com
"Nobody told me anything," said passenger Najee Russell, "You have to get the word out for something to happen. I doubt anybody is going to quarantine for two weeks. We just got off Thanksgiving that's probably a week off work. Who wants to take two more weeks off work?" he said.
SuddenStorm
Well-Known Member
I say they open the park up to people who have already had the virus. For those who've had to face the horrors of covid and might have lifelong ailments from the ordeal, the least they deserve is some Disney Magic!
It'd solve a few problems. Limited capacity since most of the public would be blocked out, and since the guests would all have antibodies it wouldn't become a 'covid super spreader'.
It'd solve a few problems. Limited capacity since most of the public would be blocked out, and since the guests would all have antibodies it wouldn't become a 'covid super spreader'.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Sorry to say its now becoming obvious that its possible to get COVID multiple times. I personally know someone who got it back in May recovered and got it again last week (positive test both times), and she was being careful both times. Its affected her bad too, luckily she hasn't had the worse outcome yet, but is preparing for that possibility this time. She is just over 50, so is on the borderline of when things get bad. Which is why she is preparing herself, especially now that her breathing is starting to get labored. This is serious stuff man.
Getting sick only provides a short immunity, from a couple weeks to at most a couple months. The vaccine is providing a longer immunity, but even that is likely to require getting the vaccine yearly.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
That would seem to be a very good idea, if perhaps only as a "first phase" of some sort of 2021 reopening.
Testing in this country is sky-high, and per capita among the highest in the world now. It would be nice if antibody testing could be similarly widespread.
I'm still wondering about that weird cold I had last February, and then the past 8 months of nothing but best-I've-felt-in-years stellar health. I would not be at all surprised to learn I have Covid antibodies and last February's cold that made me feel blah for a week was it.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Does your 50 year old friend have serious health problems? Emphysema, diabetes, obesity, heart disease, etc? It's those long-term health problems that cause the serious issues with Covid patients, just as those long-term health problems cause issues for Flu and Pneumonia patients. A bad case of the Flu can knock your respiratory system around for a year or two afterwards, due to lung damage and scarring that can occur in bad Flu. It's why doctors have to take the Flu so seriously with older folks; it can take an older or sickly person years for their respiratory tract to really recover from a bad Flu, if a full recovery even takes place.
At Thanksgiving my brilliant younger relatives pulled up the CDC stats on Covid's current survivability rate in the USA. And it's a rate that is dropping even further, but this was what the CDC had by September;
USA Covid Survival Rates by Age Group
Age 0-19 = 99.997%
Age 20 - 49 = 99.98%
Age 50 - 69 = 99.5%
Age 70 - 105 = 94.6%
So if your friend who is in her early 50's is in good health, it's almost guaranteed she will survive. Even if she has long-term health problems she's dealing with, her survival rate is 99.5%. That's good news!
CDC Releases Updated COVID-19 Fatality Rate Data
The US Center for Disease Control (CDC) has released an update to their research on the fatality rate associated with COVID-19. The CDC first posted this data on May 20, 2020, with the understanding that the parameter values would be updated and augmented over time. This update, dated September...
tallahasseereports.com
Disney Irish
Premium Member
No she doesn't have serious health problems.Does your 50 year old friend have serious health problems? Emphysema, diabetes, obesity, heart disease, etc? It's those long-term health problems that cause the serious issues with Covid patients, just as those long-term health problems cause issues for Flu and Pneumonia patients. A bad case of the Flu can knock your respiratory system around for a year or two afterwards, due to lung damage and scarring that can occur in bad Flu. It's why doctors have to take the Flu so seriously with older folks; it can take an older or sickly person years for their respiratory tract to really recover from a bad Flu, if a full recovery even takes place.
At Thanksgiving my brilliant younger relatives pulled up the CDC stats on Covid's current survivability rate in the USA. And it's a rate that is dropping even further, but this was what the CDC had by September;
USA Covid Survival Rates by Age Group
Age 0-19 = 99.997%
Age 20 - 49 = 99.98%
Age 50 - 69 = 99.5%
Age 70 - 105 = 94.6%
So if your friend who is 50 is in good health, it's almost guaranteed she will survive. Even if she has long-term health problems she's dealing with, her survival rate is 99.5%. That's good news!
CDC Releases Updated COVID-19 Fatality Rate Data
The US Center for Disease Control (CDC) has released an update to their research on the fatality rate associated with COVID-19. The CDC first posted this data on May 20, 2020, with the understanding that the parameter values would be updated and augmented over time. This update, dated September...
Do your statistics that you love to post say anything about a second infection? What are the mortality rates for that? Please oh great medical wizard that knows all please tell me what the statistics are for that?
SoCalMort
Well-Known Member
...The hits just keep coming for California, don't they?!?
Can't argue with that...
California coronavirus cases: Tracking the outbreak
The latest maps and charts on the spread of COVID-19 in California, including cases, deaths, closures and restrictions.
www.latimes.com
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Well, I don't know how the CDC is tracking that. I would assume a person who gets infected with Covid a second time and is tested positively as such would be tracked the exact same way they were when they got it the first time, don't you? I can't imagine why the CDC would do otherwise?
If you get Covid and die, you'd be tracked as having died from Covid. Regardless of if it was your first infection or your second or your third.
But it's good news if she has no long-term health problems to deal with in addition to Covid. It's those "co-morbidities" that really cause the problems with Covid patients that lead to death. (Co-morbidity is one of those words we never knew we needed in our vocabulary until 2020 came along!
)USA Covid Survival Rates by Age Group
Age 0-19 = 99.997%
Age 20 - 49 = 99.98%
Age 50 - 69 = 99.5%
Age 70 - 105 = 94.6%
Similarly, you can only be counted as dying once by the CDC. So the 275,000 deaths in the USA "with Covid", as the medical term is used, is approximately 0.08% of the United States population. Since the majority of US Covid deaths are over the age of 80, and the average lifespan of an American is currently 78, that leads me to believe the CDC's survival rates above are quite accurate and deaths are only being tracked once.
Last edited:
SuddenStorm
Well-Known Member
Second infections from Covid are extremely rare, going off a few articles I found in a quick Google search. Not impossible and should be considered, but again, not the norm.
Wouldn't a Disneyland full of guests with some antibodies and immunity be safer then guests who've never had exposure to the virus?
Wouldn't a Disneyland full of guests with some antibodies and immunity be safer then guests who've never had exposure to the virus?
D
Deleted member 107043
Europe is a real mess right now. France is woefully behind the USA on testing, and France has a higher fatality rate than the US. So you would think mass testing would be a priority for them, but apparently not.
But some of France's neighboring countries, especially the UK that sends a lot of tourists to Disneyland Paris, are even worse off. The UK, Spain, Italy, Belgium all have higher death rates the the USA does, and testing is spotty in most countries except the UK. Denmark and the UK are the only European nations that have a higher testing rate than the USA.
Covid Tests Completed as Percent of Total National Population - 11/29/20
Denmark = 121% (7 Million tests)
United Kingdom = 65% (43 Million tests)
United States = 59% (194 Million tests)
Belgium = 51% (6 Million tests)
Spain = 49% (23 Million tests)
Norway = 42% (2 Million tests)
Italy = 36% (22 Million tests)
Germany = 33% (27 Million tests)
Switzerland = 32% (3 Million tests)
France = 30% (20 Million tests)
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per 1M Population | RealClearPolitics
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per Population | RealClearPoliticswww.realclearpolitics.com
Yep it's a real mess. My god, just look at how their cases are trending down after spiking earlier this month. It's almost like, dare I say it, they've each managed to get things under control.
Meanwhile, in the US.....
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Given that this virus is only coming up on a year old in the human population there isn't enough data to say definitively that its "rare". Right now because there is still a small percentage comparatively of the human population that has been infected by the virus it might be "rare". But over time its likely to become less rare as more people get it multiple times, especially those in the ER and other health care facilities.
Right now its becoming likely that the COVID19 vaccine is going to require us to get a yearly vaccination. In fact Novavax is already working on a COVID19/Flu vaccine combo to be given out yearly which they are hoping to get FDA approval early next year.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
I would say they aren't tracking it yet, but will likely be soon. The mortality rates of a second infection of COVID19 might just be worse, only time will tell. But I wouldn't be so glib about it if I were you. Those numbers you like to throw around are someones family or friend who couldn't care less about your statistics. Or how about you ask those front-line doctors or nurses if they care about your statistics when they are seeing someone die in the ICU.Well, I don't know how the CDC is tracking that. I would assume a person who gets infected with Covid a second time and is tested positively as such would be tracked the exact same way they were when they got it the first time, don't you? I can't imagine why the CDC would do otherwise?
If you get Covid and die, you'd be tracked as having died from Covid. Regardless of if it was your first infection or your second or your third.
But it's good news if she has no long-term health problems to deal with in addition to Covid. It's those "co-morbidities" that really cause the problems with Covid patients that lead to death. (Co-morbidity is one of those words we never knew we needed in our vocabulary until 2020 came along!
USA Covid Survival Rates by Age Group
Age 0-19 = 99.997%
Age 20 - 49 = 99.98%
Age 50 - 69 = 99.5%
Age 70 - 105 = 94.6%
Similarly, you can only be counted as dying once by the CDC. So the 275,000 deaths in the USA "with Covid", as the medical term is used, is approximately 0.08% of the United States population. Since the majority of US Covid deaths are over the age of 80, and the average lifespan of an American is currently 78, that leads me to believe the CDC's survival rates above are quite accurate and deaths are only being tracked once.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I would think so. Especially since the majority of Disneyland's customers are under age 50.
Here's that photo I loved to use earlier this year talking about what a cesspool of germs and bacteria and human disease the average Saturday afternoon at Disneyland has been for the past few decades. I don't see a whole lot of old fogeys in this crowd, do you?
Honestly, Disneyland is mostly a young person's hangout; teens, twentysomethings, and young families with small children. You get a few occasional grandparents, or some tenured fans like some of us here, but it wouldn't surprise me to learn the average age of a Disneyland visitor is about 30 years old.
Covid deaths in Orange County actually skew a bit older than the already quite old national average, owing to OC's population being healthier overall than the USA norms. There have been 1,577 deaths from Covid in OC this year, which is a total of 0.04% of the OC population of 3.2 Million, or roughly half the USA death percentage of 0.08% of the US population of 327 Million.
One third of the OC deaths were in people over age 85, well past the median age of death of 78. Over half, 55%, of OC's deaths were in people over age 75.
Orange County Covid Death Demographics 11/29/2020
Age 85 & Up = 520 Deaths or 33% of OC Deaths, 0.01% of OC Population
Age 75 to 84 = 343 Deaths or 22% of OC Deaths, 0.01% of OC Population
Age 65 to 74 = 309 Deaths or 20% of OC Deaths, 0.009% of OC Population
Age 55 to 64 = 219 Deaths or 14% of OC Deaths, 0.006% of OC Population
Age 45 to 54 = 120 Deaths or 7% of OC Deaths, 0.003% of OC Population
Age 35 to 44 = 40 Deaths or 2% of OC Deaths, 0.001% of OC Population
Age 25 to 34 = 21 Deaths or 1% of OC Deaths, 0.0006% of OC Population
Age 18 to 24 = 4 Deaths or 0.2% of OC Deaths, 0.0001% of OC Population
Age 0 to 17 = 1 Death or 0.06% of OC Deaths, 0.00001% of OC Population
Last edited:
TP2000
Well-Known Member
They spiked earlier in the fall than the USA did, by about four to five weeks, and I would expect the USA's numbers to fall similarly after our current spike. That's what these things do, spike and surge or whatever word the TV news wants to use, before they fall again.
But the point remains, the testing capacity and abilities in many European nations are not as strong or as widely available as the USA. And what's unfortunate about that is many of the European nations have higher death rates per capita than the USA does, so wider testing would have benefited them this fall.
Or at least that's what everyone has been saying for the past 8 months, that testing was key to helping people.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I'm not glib, I think it's good news for your friend in her 50's. It's just the science and data proving she'll survive.
But for tracking purposes, a death is a death. I don't think the CDC would double-count or heavily weight a death of someone who got Covid a second or third time. Once you die with Covid, you die. And the CDC then adds your death to the tracking information and data.
Currently that USA death toll from Covid is 275,000 this year, or about 0.08% of the US population. With an average age of death from Covid of about 80 years old.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
As for death, it comes to us all. I've had two friends die this year; not from Covid, just from old age, although one had Alzheimer's. One was in their late 80's, and one was 91 years old.
Also, a neighbor a few houses down also died this past spring, so that makes three people I've known who died this year. He didn't die from Covid, he'd had several strokes in recent years and died suddenly overnight in his home.
Approximately 3 Million Americans die every year, or about 8,000 deaths per day, for many various reasons. Death is a part of life. It is sad for those who lose a loved one, but we must all then go on. We can not be in a constant state of sorrowful mourning for the thousands of Americans dying every day year after year, nor for the hundreds of thousands of humans who die on this planet every day.
If you tried to be in mourning for every American death every day you would quickly go insane.