The Spirited Sixth Sense ...

[John]

Don't know that you missed anything. I've just sorta observed that pin mania isn't close to what it was a decade ago and thinking that the OCD hobby is dying way down.

And my opinion is....what came first the chicken or the egg?
Did Disney stop offering interesting unique pins and lowering the demand? Or did the interest drop and Disney decided that it wasn't interested in investing money in giving us unique merch to purchase?

 

[WDW1974]

Wow, their cheapness actually is a benefit this time! A 2nd BLT

Oh yeah, what most Disney fanbois refuse to get through their heads is the fact that WDW Co. operates largely as a real estate/timeshare and hotel operation with theme parks as ancillary businesses. It has been this way since the dawn of the 21st century and this group just doesn't want to see or acknowledge the factual basis of it.

You can be a UNI hater if you choose, but there is NO denying they are in the theme park business in O-Town, first and foremost.

 

[John]

Don't forget the loan shark interest rates

Exactly, but why does it take 5-10 years to hit the sweet spot? Interest on what $1000....is you can go to WDW a grand is a drop in the bucket. I am missing something here?

 

[asianway]

Exactly, but why does it take 5-10 years to hit the sweet spot? Interest on what $1000....is you can go to WDW a grand is a drop in the bucket. I am missing something here?

On a ten year loan the rates can make you approach the same amount of interest paid as the principal.

Then ongoing dues.

And the fact they are hoping you will upgrade from a studio to a 1BR or 2BR doubling or tripling the amount of points you would need to stay in a room Comparable to a deluxe.

 

[WDW1974]

I find it bizarre and a little weird how some fanbois only consider something Disney if it came during Walt's time or comes out under the Disney banner. Sorry, but Muppets to Marvel, Pixar to Lucas are all Disney now and you just have to put your big boy panties on and deal with it. Believe me, I am not a big fan of Marvel.

Glad we agree on something.

But I think that many people feel the way I do - that it's bizarre and weird that Disney is buying up already-fully-developed stuff like Star Wars and Muppets, when the real, original Disney magic was derived from in-company creativity and innovation. Of course, I realize that that Disney is dead - or, as one of the legendary Nine Old Men put it, "Walt's dead. You missed it." That's why the yeti stays broken, and why WDW is trying to play catch-up with Universal by nabbing the rights to a perceived fan-boy fave like "Avatar" (is there any doubt Iger thought that was a "checkmate" move?) instead of raiding its own vault for ideas for new attractions or coming up with completely original ones. I think Iger thinks Disney's not relevant, and he has little faith in its artisans and no patience with risk and development. And that's why he buys stuff. It's paying off in terms of revenue and stock price - things Iger can understand - but that's come at a terrible price in my view.

Yes, but we don't agree on your underlying hatred of the Muppets (and dislike? of all the other properties) ... Disney has plenty of IP that folks care about (they don't care about Oswald!) and they refuse to utilize it versus putting Captain America on the Disney MAGIC and soon at DL. That is a legit complaint, although one that isn't worth your energy because that is Bob Iger's Disney. But hating on the Muppets and/or trying to convince anyone that there is a giant untapped market that is interested in an obscure character from the 1920s is sorta absurd.

Disney has also used its IP when it makes enough. Look at the PotC franchise ... and watch what happens with Frozen. I guess a film has to make close to a billion dollars before Disney thinks it is worth doing something with.

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

Yes, but we don't agree on your underlying hatred of the Muppets (and dislike? of all the other properties) ... Disney has plenty of IP that folks care about (they don't care about Oswald!) and they refuse to utilize it versus putting Captain America on the Disney MAGIC and soon at DL. That is a legit complaint, although one that isn't worth your energy because that is Bob Iger's Disney. But hating on the Muppets and/or trying to convince anyone that there is a giant untapped market that is interested in an obscure character from the 1920s is sorta absurd.

Disney has also used its IP when it makes enough. Look at the PotC franchise ... and watch what happens with Frozen. I guess a film has to make close to a billion dollars before Disney thinks it is worth doing something with.

So... What IS going to happen with Frozen? any theme park plans in future?

 

[John]

On a ten year loan the rates can make you approach the same amount of interest paid as the principal.

Then ongoing dues.

And the fact they are hoping you will upgrade from a studio to a 1BR or 2BR doubling or tripling the amount of points you would need to stay in a room Comparable to a deluxe.

It has to be me....I must not be making myself clear and I apologize. But a ten year loan on what? On points? I am sorry if I am being thick headed ( pun intended).

 

[flynnibus]

So, now we're gonna debate DVC value? ... Interesting. Anecdotal evidence mixed with Disney offering HUGE discounts ($245 off a WDW PAP ... $130 off a bi-coastal Premiere ... even $70 off a DL Deluxe) would seem to support the growing mound of evidence that DVCers who don't sell or default are staying away from WDW theme parks. Disney doesn't want 'owners' who use their DVC units as vacation bases to enjoy all the great things to see and do in Central Florida that Dr. Blondie will never be blogging about. Be real.

Certainly it's signs that they aren't getting the conversions they want. But this is an easy discount to offer because you pretty easily estimate a max cost of the promo and don't have to worry much about the promo canabalizing other potential buyers.

Which side of the equation is the significant mass? For every disenchanted DVC owner we see here, how many dozens are buying in bliss. For every people here that knows it's better to rent your points than cruise on them, how many whales do you see on DCL proud that they paid their cruise with their 'free points'?

And speaking of being real, I can't understand all the hate over the (obviously) very poor negotiations that went down between Disney and a trash can when a zoo in a modern, western country slaughtered a healthy two-year-old giraffe, hacked him up in front of children and then fed him to its lions and actually attempts to defend such a process. Grotesque.

Meh... being way overhyped IMO. The zoo assumed (mistakenly) that people would be interested in the opportunity for the medical exercise. Obviously some people can't handle the truth and they should have just done it in the back like it's always done and just not opened the opportunity.

BTW, my kids have gone and seen a horse autopsied as well as part of a educational experience. A horse that was put down, and the students given the opportunity to learn in ways they otherwise would not have. Same thing here... I think the issue is again Scandinavians being very blunt and direct... which others can't seem to stomach when the topic doesn't conform to their ideals.

 

[WDW1974]

Is anyone else seeing the fully rolled out ad describing FP+ as a test as a forum banner ad from 5 minutes ago, It just boggles the imagination that this is still considered a TEST.

View attachment 45902

Yes, I have seen that ad. All I can think of (as someone who recently just showed up at DLP and walked onto the Tea Cups!) is what type of OCD, retentive planning fool actually thinks that this is something good?

As for using the word 'TEST', that's a horrible word to use when guests who are spending thousands of dollars have no choice but to take part. Only Disney could use its guests as guinea pigs and advertise it as something good.

Mickey sure has a big pair, no wonder Minnie is always smiling!

 

[asianway]

It has to be me....I must not be making myself clear and I apologize. But a ten year loan on what? On points? I am sorry if I am being thick headed ( pun intended).

If a point is $150 and you buy 160 points, your initial buy in is $24,000 financed over 5-10 years at rates they come up with off your credit score. Like 10-12% iirc

 

[WDW1974]

Because there are still plenty buying into it being a test and telling people it is still just a test. A great way to not have to deliver on a service you have sold.

BINGO!!!

We have a winner.

 

[GoofGoof]

It has to be me....I must not be making myself clear and I apologize. But a ten year loan on what? On points? I am sorry if I am being thick headed ( pun intended).

If you buy 200 points at $150 a point you need to pay $30,000 on day 1. If you take a 10 year loan on that at double digit interest rates you pay a ton of interest. Probably enough to negate any money you save.

 

[John]

If a point is $150 and you buy 160 points, your initial buy in is $24,000 financed over 5-10 years at rates they come up with off your credit score. Like 10-12% iirc

Ahhhhhhhh now I see, you know what my next question is right? Then I will get off the topic. The OP is on duty. Is there a minimum you have to buy?

 

[WDW1974]

Do you have any idea about what kind of plans they have for the rumored Star Wars mini land?

At this point, after all the drama that talking about possibilities (even likely events) brings, I'd rather not state anything on that subject just yet. Suffice to say, there are many things happening behind the scenes on that front and Star Wars will have a much greater presence at Disney parks around the globe.

 

[flynnibus]

Exactly, but why does it take 5-10 years to hit the sweet spot? Interest on what $1000....is you can go to WDW a grand is a drop in the bucket. I am missing something here?

Real rough numbers to just illustrate the point...

You pay a front loaded costs for your # of points + the fees associated with the purchase. Pick a round number... 20k.

On top of that you pay annual dues based on the location and # of points. Pick a round number.. $2k/year

Your break-even is looked at based on when does 'how much you saved by staying as DVC' offset that initial 20k purchase cost.

Again, stupid round numbers to illustrate the point.. If the comparable WDW resort you were to stay in (if you were not DVC) was costing you $3k per trip.. and you visited every year... if your dues were only 2k.. you are saving 1k per trip by being a DVC member. So in this completely random number exercise.. the break even would have been after 20 years.

There are lots of things you can throw into the 'DVC is saving me..' category beyond just room vs dues costs.. but it illustrates the point. And with real numbers.. you see most people hitting break even in under 10 years if they don't have expensive financing.

 

[GoofGoof]

Ahhhhhhhh now I see, you know what my next question is right? Then I will get off the topic. The OP is on duty. Is there a minimum you have to buy?

They say 160 but you can buy less if you ask nicely. If you want a week each year in a studio you are going to need north of 100 points.

 

[WDW1974]

Any news for us out here in Cali? Subs really going away as some peeps on the interweb claim?

If that has been 100% decided, then I haven't heard yet. I strongly believe they will not return.

 

[flynnibus]

Ahhhhhhhh now I see, you know what my next question is right? Then I will get off the topic. The OP is on duty. Is there a minimum you have to buy?

There is a minimum viable amount.. and minium contracts they sell. The specifics vary.. but for frame of reference, depending on the era, etc.. think 100-160 points.

 

[asianway]

Ahhhhhhhh now I see, you know what my next question is right? Then I will get off the topic. The OP is on duty. Is there a minimum you have to buy?

From Dvc it's like 150-160. Resale is cheaper and you can buy in at 25.

 

[KYWDW]

If you buy 200 points at $150 a point you need to pay $30,000 on day 1. If you take a 10 year loan on that at double digit interest rates you pay a ton of interest. Probably enough to negate any money you save.

Which is why I have never understood the reasoning behind getting a loan for DVC points. All cost benefits are gone but honestly if you have the money to drop you really aren't all that worried about the savings. You know they are there but it isn't the main reason you buy the time share. Which leads me to Disney having a stale product and all these DVC people (my self included) leave disney property instead of visiting the stale parks.