71jason
Well-Known Member
Per a conversation last night, AK has been "dead" this Summer. Lots of 19k at best days.
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
The Spirited Seventh Heaven ...
- Thread starter WDW1974
- Start date
Per a conversation last night, AK has been "dead" this Summer. Lots of 19k at best days.
71jason
Well-Known Member
It may be the original, but Amura (Sand Lake Road) and Kobe (closest is on Palm Parkway) are better.
asianway
Well-Known Member
I still question how ROL and avatar will move the needle. The park just has a stigma attached
GLaDOS
Well-Known Member
It's still doing better than DHS...
71jason
Well-Known Member
To be honest, on Saturday EPCOT was busier than my last visit but still far from crowded. This does seem a resort-wide thing this Summer.
GLaDOS
Well-Known Member
It'll be interesting to see the reports on the summer.
doctornick
Well-Known Member
It does? The general sense I get from people is "not enough to do" much more than "not any good". You definitely get some "it's just a zoo" complaints as well. All that can only be helped by having more rides and a big night time show.
I still think that a few more C-tickets and/or some sort of day time event to replace the parade (like a "parade" of floats on the water) would make a significant difference.
Last edited:
Lee
Adventurer
I lost that...debate.
Though I will be looking for a grill attachment for our stove.
You have to pick your battles. Theming my office like the Jungle Cruise queue took priority.
MotherOfBirds
Well-Known Member
Last summer, I took my niece and nephew (7 and 9) to the parks and we made the mistake of taking them to DAK first. They were bored to tears until we went to MK the next day. Something's gotta give, AK. Or someone.
disneyflush
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I have yet to meet an Avatar fan willing to travel to, spend money on, or dedicate a vaction to Avatar. Actually, I have yet to meet an Avatar fan (I'm sure there are some out there, I just haven't encountered them yet). Plenty of people enjoyed the movie for what it was or what it is but as it gets closer to being built I just wonder who is super excited for this particular IP over just being excited that AK will be getting more things to do. Maybe the difference isn't that big a deal when looking at the big picture (trying not to directly compare to Potter 2 down the road and the fervent of those fans NEEDING to experience it as soon as possible). In any event, I root for AK and I hope this expansion is part of the solution moving forward.
flynnibus
Premium Member
Yeah, I'm sure there are plenty of people he had to walk away from after he got busted cheating on his girl
PhotoDave219
Well-Known Member
No, Stigma is on Orange Avenue above the Publick House. My friend Rhia teaches pole fitness there.
michmousefan
Well-Known Member
I'll second that opinion; Yosemite is without peer. Take some time, do some hiking and exploring away from the masses and you'll like it even more.
I'm toying with the idea of spending a few days there (specifically, to hike Half Dome) after the D23 Expo next August. That way, great or just good expo, I can guarantee I'll still have a superb Cali trip.
Rteetz
Well-Known Member
Yes I agree we were there Saturday as well it was busy but not crowded only thing we didn't do was soarin. Sunday we went to MK and that was much busier than Epcot but nothing crazy. Just getting back from Ak today and it was busy but again not crowded. Off to see DTD tonight...
the.dreamfinder
Well-Known Member
Even though this Comic-Con was devoid of important Star Wars news,
I think it is high time that we got back to discussing Star Wars in Abu Dhabi. Before I get started, I want to note that while I personally do not like the use of production tax credits. I do not plan on challenging them within this post. There is a debate to be had when it comes to them but I want to spend time addressing other issues that Disney/Lucasfilm shooting in Abu Dhabi presents.
When discussing Disney/Lucasfilm's decision to shoot portions of Star Wars Episode VII in Abu Dhabi, the decision must be placed in context with the other locations Disney's tentpoles (Marvel films included) shoot at. Over the past ten years, production of big budget Hollywood tent poles has moved from California to other states and countries. Walt Disney Studio's Chairman Alan Horn has played a big role in this trend during his tenure at Warner Brothers, but we'll get to him later. Disney’s favorite location to shoot its live action films is the United Kingdom; Pinewood and Pinewood Shepperton to be specific. TWDS currently has a long term leasing arrangement with them for 17 soundstages. (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-5m-major-victory-British-film-industry.html) Naturally, their decision was assisted by a £5 Million tax incentive from the United Kingdom plus the 20% tax rebate, after the first million pounds spent which get a 25% rebate, they will receive for every film they shoot in the UK. So no matter how hard California tries, a large chunk of Disney's live action film production will take place in the UK.
TWDS is still willing to take money from other states/nations despite these sweetheart deals. Marvel Studios is quite adept at leveraging states against each other to get the best deal, a recurring theme. Actually, the first X-Men, directed by he who shall not be named, was the first Hollywood film to use film production incentives by shooting in Toronto. When the notoriously frugal Marvel began producing its own films, the studio's business strategy to their initial financier Morgan Stanley relied heavily on production incentives; Iron Man 1 & 2 and Cap 1, primarily shot in California, are the exceptions. Unlike TWDS, Marvel likes to keep its options open by not committing itself to any state, we're talking about the films so their Netflix shows don't apply here because TV requires a longer term commitment, so they have the flexibility to shoot The Avengers in Ohio, Iron Man 3 in North Carolina and ... wait Ohio just increased its tax credit... Cap 2 in Ohio. So the trend, which is the industry norm for runaway productions, is to use states with comprable facilites against each other so state governments have to increase subsidies. But there is another method the studios use to get film production subsidies.
Enter Alan Horn. During his tenure at Warner Brothers, he played a key role in how they get film production subsidies. As you may know, all of the Harry Potter films were shot in the United Kingdom, partially at the request of JK Rowling, but also because of the British film industry's talent pool. When it became clear that the Harry Potter franchise would be seen through to the end of the books, Warner Brothers and British Film interests lobbied for hard for a film subsidy. The argument went, as you can read here (34 & 35 http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200910/ldselect/ldcomuni/37/3705.htm), "we, foreign productions, make up 68 percent of all film production dollars spent in the United Kingdom. Therefore we would like support from the state to keep investing those production dollars in the UK.” It worked and those subsidies successfully not only kept Harry Potter in the UK, we will get back to the boy who lived later, but Warner Brothers expanded its UK backlot to accommodate more production. Warner's backlot expansion also mirrors the recently approved expansion of Pinewood's Shepperton Studio where Episode VII and Age of Ultron are currently filming.
Alan oversaw another big franchise which received generous tax credits; Peter Jackson’s Lord of the Ring’s Trilogy. Peter Jackson, a kiwi, made a strong argument to New Line that New Zealand could provide the backdrop necessary to recreate Middle Earth. Warners pushed New Zealand hard for government support of the trilogy with $150 million in subsidies. In the years after the success of Jackson’s films, New Zealand saw a 40 percent surge in visitors thanks to a phenomenon known as “Tolkien Tourism” with tours of the sets and landscapes from the films. (The films and subsequent subsidies also helped establish New Zealand in the VFX industry with Jackson’s Weta Digital (Non-LotR credits include the recent Planet of the Apes films, The Avengers and the upcoming Avatar films). Warner Brothers used these developments to demand more money from New Zealand to keep production of the Hobbit there as has Cameron and Fox for the Avatar sequels (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/24/b...-hollywood-put-on-its-map.html?pagewanted=all).
Despite the drama between Warner Brothers and New Zealand, Abu Dhabi couldn't be happier to throw money at Disney/Lucasfilm. Both Abu Dhabi and its sister emirate Dubai have tried very hard to lure film production and have failed. by the Abu Dhabi and Dubai film commissions own count only a handful of Hollywood productions have been shot there. Films shot in both emirates include and are limited to “Syrianna”(2005) starring George Clooney, produced by Warner Brothers, and “The Kingdom” (2007) starring Jamie Foxx. In recent years, Abu Dhabi has attracted “The Bourne Legacy” and “Deliver Us From Evil” and Dubai was able to score none other than Brad Bird’s “Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol”; which prominently features a sequence shot outside the Burj Khalifa and Tom Cruise trying to outrun a sandstorm. Abu Dhabi, which has also dipped its toes in the film financing arena with none other than Alan Horn’s WB in the late 00’s. knows that no one wants to shoot there. For the Abu Dhabi film commission, Episode VII represents a coup for an aggressive push to try to get the Emirate more Hollywood film productions.(http://variety.com/2014/biz/news/abu-dhabi-boosts-hollywood-connections-1201219369/) As you may know, the original plan was for Episode VII to shoot desert sequences in Tunisia. When Lucasfilm and Disney started to get concerned about violence in Tunisia’s neighbor Libya spilling over, Abu Dhabi swooped in before anyone else and offered the film their recently increased 30% tax rebate; currently Abu Dhabi’s is among the highest film production subsidies (Vancouver bests them at 35%). While Morocco may be a more suitable alternative to Tunisia, also closer to the production's home base in the UK, how could they turn down free money?
Now that I have established enough context, let’s talk about Abu Dhabi and the United Arab Emirates' dark side. Abu Dhabi may project an image as a modern cosmopolitan, but it is ultimately a city built on slave labor with one of the harshest justice systems in the world. Abu Dhabi’s exploitation of migrant works has been well documented. If you would like to read more, I have included some articles
Let’s not forget that being gay is a crime where punishments include imprisonment, gay conversion therapy, or, if you’re lucky, deportation. More
When considering which countries Disney shoots its high profile tentpoles in, shouldn’t they consider how their hosts treat their others. For a company that refused many calls by Abu Dhabi and Dubai to build a theme park out of concerns for their BRAND, why is it now appropriate to take their film subsidies for one of their highest profile projects. In taking these subsidies, they are allowing a country with a LOT of baggage the opportunity to be associated with the Star Wars BRAND. Disney/Lucasfilm is letting their brand be tarnished by association with Abu Dhabi to make them look better. Change you really be a “Force for Change” when you take money from a country built on slavery?
The long term impact of Disney/Lucasfilm’s choice to shoot in Abu Dhabi is hard to tell at this point, but the legacy of the franchises Alan oversaw at Warner Brothers and legacy of Star Wars offers a precedent. As Tolkien Tourism has brought hundreds of thousands of LotR fans to a country they likely would have never visited, the physical sets have taken on a special role as a rite of passage for fans. Warner Brothers and local entrepreneurs have been keen to this trend by working to keep the Hobbit village, a highlight of any visit to Middle Earth, in top condition. With Harry Potter, they took this even further with a special tour at their UK backlot which features special recreations of the sets, original exterior and interior sets, props, and a gift shop (naturally). The abandonment of the Tatooine sets from the original “Star Wars” in Tunisia has been well documented. But thanks to fan interest, you can now take tours of the original trilogy sets as part of vacation packages to Tunisia. (http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/18/travel/star-wars-visit-taooine-sahara/) To think that Abu Dhabi does not want a permanent Star Wars presence along the lines of the WB Harry Potter Tour or the Tolkien Tourism to attract fans to visit would be foolish. Abu Dhabi very badly wants to be a tourist destination and by having the remains of one of the biggest franchises of all time it knows fans will shell out.
Which brings us back to Comic Con. Fans absolutely love these franchises, they are a big part of their identities. They love to watch these films, play the games, read the comics, and have the opportunity to meet other fans at a venue like Comic Con. They spend lots of money on rare items and sit in lines for hours to get a glimpse of their favorite stars and see brand new footage first. These are the folks who may one day make the pilgrimage to visit the sets from Episode VII. Does Lucasfilm want its fans, through evangelization of their visits, to make a repressive country look good?
Hopefully that broke the ice on this very important topic.
I think it is high time that we got back to discussing Star Wars in Abu Dhabi. Before I get started, I want to note that while I personally do not like the use of production tax credits. I do not plan on challenging them within this post. There is a debate to be had when it comes to them but I want to spend time addressing other issues that Disney/Lucasfilm shooting in Abu Dhabi presents.
When discussing Disney/Lucasfilm's decision to shoot portions of Star Wars Episode VII in Abu Dhabi, the decision must be placed in context with the other locations Disney's tentpoles (Marvel films included) shoot at. Over the past ten years, production of big budget Hollywood tent poles has moved from California to other states and countries. Walt Disney Studio's Chairman Alan Horn has played a big role in this trend during his tenure at Warner Brothers, but we'll get to him later. Disney’s favorite location to shoot its live action films is the United Kingdom; Pinewood and Pinewood Shepperton to be specific. TWDS currently has a long term leasing arrangement with them for 17 soundstages. (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-5m-major-victory-British-film-industry.html) Naturally, their decision was assisted by a £5 Million tax incentive from the United Kingdom plus the 20% tax rebate, after the first million pounds spent which get a 25% rebate, they will receive for every film they shoot in the UK. So no matter how hard California tries, a large chunk of Disney's live action film production will take place in the UK.
TWDS is still willing to take money from other states/nations despite these sweetheart deals. Marvel Studios is quite adept at leveraging states against each other to get the best deal, a recurring theme. Actually, the first X-Men, directed by he who shall not be named, was the first Hollywood film to use film production incentives by shooting in Toronto. When the notoriously frugal Marvel began producing its own films, the studio's business strategy to their initial financier Morgan Stanley relied heavily on production incentives; Iron Man 1 & 2 and Cap 1, primarily shot in California, are the exceptions. Unlike TWDS, Marvel likes to keep its options open by not committing itself to any state, we're talking about the films so their Netflix shows don't apply here because TV requires a longer term commitment, so they have the flexibility to shoot The Avengers in Ohio, Iron Man 3 in North Carolina and ... wait Ohio just increased its tax credit... Cap 2 in Ohio. So the trend, which is the industry norm for runaway productions, is to use states with comprable facilites against each other so state governments have to increase subsidies. But there is another method the studios use to get film production subsidies.
Enter Alan Horn. During his tenure at Warner Brothers, he played a key role in how they get film production subsidies. As you may know, all of the Harry Potter films were shot in the United Kingdom, partially at the request of JK Rowling, but also because of the British film industry's talent pool. When it became clear that the Harry Potter franchise would be seen through to the end of the books, Warner Brothers and British Film interests lobbied for hard for a film subsidy. The argument went, as you can read here (34 & 35 http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200910/ldselect/ldcomuni/37/3705.htm), "we, foreign productions, make up 68 percent of all film production dollars spent in the United Kingdom. Therefore we would like support from the state to keep investing those production dollars in the UK.” It worked and those subsidies successfully not only kept Harry Potter in the UK, we will get back to the boy who lived later, but Warner Brothers expanded its UK backlot to accommodate more production. Warner's backlot expansion also mirrors the recently approved expansion of Pinewood's Shepperton Studio where Episode VII and Age of Ultron are currently filming.
Alan oversaw another big franchise which received generous tax credits; Peter Jackson’s Lord of the Ring’s Trilogy. Peter Jackson, a kiwi, made a strong argument to New Line that New Zealand could provide the backdrop necessary to recreate Middle Earth. Warners pushed New Zealand hard for government support of the trilogy with $150 million in subsidies. In the years after the success of Jackson’s films, New Zealand saw a 40 percent surge in visitors thanks to a phenomenon known as “Tolkien Tourism” with tours of the sets and landscapes from the films. (The films and subsequent subsidies also helped establish New Zealand in the VFX industry with Jackson’s Weta Digital (Non-LotR credits include the recent Planet of the Apes films, The Avengers and the upcoming Avatar films). Warner Brothers used these developments to demand more money from New Zealand to keep production of the Hobbit there as has Cameron and Fox for the Avatar sequels (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/24/b...-hollywood-put-on-its-map.html?pagewanted=all).
Despite the drama between Warner Brothers and New Zealand, Abu Dhabi couldn't be happier to throw money at Disney/Lucasfilm. Both Abu Dhabi and its sister emirate Dubai have tried very hard to lure film production and have failed. by the Abu Dhabi and Dubai film commissions own count only a handful of Hollywood productions have been shot there. Films shot in both emirates include and are limited to “Syrianna”(2005) starring George Clooney, produced by Warner Brothers, and “The Kingdom” (2007) starring Jamie Foxx. In recent years, Abu Dhabi has attracted “The Bourne Legacy” and “Deliver Us From Evil” and Dubai was able to score none other than Brad Bird’s “Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol”; which prominently features a sequence shot outside the Burj Khalifa and Tom Cruise trying to outrun a sandstorm. Abu Dhabi, which has also dipped its toes in the film financing arena with none other than Alan Horn’s WB in the late 00’s. knows that no one wants to shoot there. For the Abu Dhabi film commission, Episode VII represents a coup for an aggressive push to try to get the Emirate more Hollywood film productions.(http://variety.com/2014/biz/news/abu-dhabi-boosts-hollywood-connections-1201219369/) As you may know, the original plan was for Episode VII to shoot desert sequences in Tunisia. When Lucasfilm and Disney started to get concerned about violence in Tunisia’s neighbor Libya spilling over, Abu Dhabi swooped in before anyone else and offered the film their recently increased 30% tax rebate; currently Abu Dhabi’s is among the highest film production subsidies (Vancouver bests them at 35%). While Morocco may be a more suitable alternative to Tunisia, also closer to the production's home base in the UK, how could they turn down free money?
Now that I have established enough context, let’s talk about Abu Dhabi and the United Arab Emirates' dark side. Abu Dhabi may project an image as a modern cosmopolitan, but it is ultimately a city built on slave labor with one of the harshest justice systems in the world. Abu Dhabi’s exploitation of migrant works has been well documented. If you would like to read more, I have included some articles
(http://www.hrw.org/world-report/2014/country-chapters/united-arab-emirates?page=1) (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/7985361.stm) (http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/may/27/dubai-migrant-worker-deaths)
(http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/06/world/middleeast/06dubai.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&)
(http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/06/world/middleeast/06dubai.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&)
The long term impact of Disney/Lucasfilm’s choice to shoot in Abu Dhabi is hard to tell at this point, but the legacy of the franchises Alan oversaw at Warner Brothers and legacy of Star Wars offers a precedent. As Tolkien Tourism has brought hundreds of thousands of LotR fans to a country they likely would have never visited, the physical sets have taken on a special role as a rite of passage for fans. Warner Brothers and local entrepreneurs have been keen to this trend by working to keep the Hobbit village, a highlight of any visit to Middle Earth, in top condition. With Harry Potter, they took this even further with a special tour at their UK backlot which features special recreations of the sets, original exterior and interior sets, props, and a gift shop (naturally). The abandonment of the Tatooine sets from the original “Star Wars” in Tunisia has been well documented. But thanks to fan interest, you can now take tours of the original trilogy sets as part of vacation packages to Tunisia. (http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/18/travel/star-wars-visit-taooine-sahara/) To think that Abu Dhabi does not want a permanent Star Wars presence along the lines of the WB Harry Potter Tour or the Tolkien Tourism to attract fans to visit would be foolish. Abu Dhabi very badly wants to be a tourist destination and by having the remains of one of the biggest franchises of all time it knows fans will shell out.
Which brings us back to Comic Con. Fans absolutely love these franchises, they are a big part of their identities. They love to watch these films, play the games, read the comics, and have the opportunity to meet other fans at a venue like Comic Con. They spend lots of money on rare items and sit in lines for hours to get a glimpse of their favorite stars and see brand new footage first. These are the folks who may one day make the pilgrimage to visit the sets from Episode VII. Does Lucasfilm want its fans, through evangelization of their visits, to make a repressive country look good?
Hopefully that broke the ice on this very important topic.
Last edited:
asianway
Well-Known Member
But this could never happen at Disney:
http://touch.orlandosentinel.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-80929439/
http://touch.orlandosentinel.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-80929439/
Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
Agree, there were some images where they noticed how a o version of Wonder Woman looked way better than the DC "official" version.
Why they didn't used a strong woman instead of a girl that reminds everyone of Megan Fox's zero acting skills?.
Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
The bad buzz is actually not for Affleck lately imho.
Its because they are planning in portraying Cavil's superman as a dirtbag of the likes of DC's "Injustice Gods among us" version superman or Superman Prime's type evilness.
Cap2 is as good as Avengers Imho.. it blew my mind
doctornick
Well-Known Member
I don't get the need to make every superhero costume into some dark drab nothingness. It makes sense for Batman (especially Nolan's Batman) given the character, but couldn't they have retained the classic color schemes for Superman or Wonder Women and just toned it down? With Man of Steel, I felt the costume contributed to the overall cheerless tone of the movie, which didn't fit with Superman.
I'm sorry, but I look at that outfit and I don't see Wonder Women. I think the references to Xena are spot on.