The Spirited Back Nine ...

[Kman101]

To me, I feel like there is a larger Pixar ride planned, along with TSPL and whatever Star Wars stuff comes. TSPL is just planned to come first to help ease the pain of all the construction and closures the park has and will be seeing over the next few years.

And why aren't people seemingly understanding this?

And no, maybe TSPL and it's "rides" aren't exactly what the park needs. The fact is people want E-tickets. Folks, we have a park that desperately needs to be built out. No one seems to hate Bugs Land. Because it's Toy Story it's suddenly Chester and Hester's?

The park needs at least two solid D/E attractions (honestly, three), as well as several smaller attractions. Stop focusing on them being 'kiddy" rides. Don't most adults seem to love Mater's? How is RC Racer a kiddy ride? How is Parachute Drop where you go up in the air a kiddy ride? And those aren't even confirmed for us. I just don't get the outrage.

 

[Kman101]

Not to mention Paris's Pirates is in Adventureland.



Don't hold your breath.

I agree they're slow but do you have a timeframe?

 

[Next Big Thing]

And why aren't people seemingly understanding this?

And no, maybe TSPL and it's "rides" aren't exactly what the park needs. The fact is people want E-tickets. Folks, we have a park that desperately needs to be built out. No one seems to hate Bugs Land. Because it's Toy Story it's suddenly Chester and Hester's?

The park needs at least two solid D/E attractions (honestly, three), as well as several smaller attractions. Stop focusing on them being 'kiddy" rides. Don't most adults seem to love Mater's? How is RC Racer a kiddy ride? How is Parachute Drop where you go up in the air a kiddy ride? And those aren't even confirmed for us. I just don't get the outrage.

Agreed. It just seems to be complaining for the sake of complaining because "TDO doesn't know what they're doing" or something like that.

I agree, TDO has made a lot of mistakes over the years, but i'm also not even sure how much say they have on this project. I feel like it's likely coming from the top (Staggs).

As to your last point... We probably won't get Parachute drop or RC Racer... I believe the Maters ride will be replacing one of them in order to make the are more family oriented and also because of sight-line issues that would come from the parachute drop structure.

 

[CDavid]

BINGO! I see the exact same thing in both WDW and Disneyland. Two Custodial CM's walking together talking, maybe one will sweep up a napkin every so often. Or two or three of them just standing around in a corner leaning on their dustpans, talking about maybe sweeping up a napkin later in their shift.

And you have to think, they would be so much more effective if they shut up, split up, and looked at the ground and swept.

There appears to be a serious management problem with Custodial crews in all the parks. Obviously their general duties require them to be out in the park fairly unsupervised. So why not tag their brooms or ID cards with RFID chips and then monitor where they go and what other CM's they interact with during their shift? You could create a computer program that tracks their whereabouts and how much time they spent "Onstage" without hanging out with other Custodial CM's gossiping. I imagine it's also fairly easy for them to disappear "Backstage" or in little hidden spots and just chill out on their phone when they are supposed to be sweeping Adventureland.

RFID tracking of their whereabouts would solve that very quickly. And keep the parks much cleaner.

This Custodial CM problem doesn't apply to the Tokyo parks. In my multiple visits to Tokyo Disneyland and DisneySea, I have never once seen a Custodial CM not sweeping alone. And PERFECTLY uniformed in starched white, slim fitting uniforms. But always with a smile and ready to focus on a visitor if needed, then they go right back to scanning the ground and sweeping anything they can find. Alone. Somehow, management of lone CM's isn't a problem in Tokyo.

While there clearly is a problem with general custodial upkeep with the Orlando parks, to whatever extent blame lies with guests or with Disney, this isn't the solution. The same sort of thinking gave us the sadly mistaken Rapid Fill program to eliminate the issue of unpaid drink refills - spending millions to save pennies - instead of taking basic steps to actually solve the problem. Greater supervision probably is needed, but as CM's generally tend to be hard working, I'm more inclined to blame inadequate staffing coupled with a general decline in standards over the years (the level of cleanliness custodians were expected to maintain was greater in the past). Rather then monitoring with needless technology, you need the managers ultimately responsible out in the park keeping an eye on things, seeing what works and what is needed (electronically monitoring every step and action suggests you can't trust your employees, and people need to be held accountable).

Well I think the leadership problem goes beyond simply custodial…

There is a serious problem with declining standards, and a management culture in Walt Disney World which accepts a mediocre, half-hearted effort as acceptable for a world-class, premium priced resort.

As popular as this idea is, the "boring" park was more popular than the "non-boring" park.

Indeed. Yet we see people on this very board arguing about how boring and unpopular the original Epcot attractions were, and how the abandonment of Future World's theme and purpose was driven by guest demand and expectations. Perhaps people are trying to find a rational explanation for the failure to properly develop and maintain Epcot Center, but revisionist history persists despite a complete lack of evidence to support the assertion.

On the subject of EPCOT's revisionist history: my 4-5 year old self wasn't interested in EPCOT. I think I liked Kitchen Kabaret and Imagination. I slept through the American Adventure. Maybe the park played better for older kids, but I didn't get much from it at my kindergarten age. You'll never make me believe that 4-5 years old loved EPCOT Center, but I'm sure someone will tell me they loved it at the age of 24 months.

Clearly all age groups will not be equally enamored with any attraction or element of a theme park, but then all rides (and parks) aren't supposed to be aimed at the young child demographic (which is a big problem today). The legacy which Walt Disney World lives off in 2014 was built upon sedate "family" attractions which were appropriate for literally everyone. Even if Horizons wasn't a favorite of young kids or thrill freaks, both could at least enjoy something of the experience along with everyone else (and those who found absolutely nothing of value in such a ride where probably selling either the attraction, or themselves, short).

Reality and logic are two things that are totally scorned on a discussion board. Stop that... the next thing you know people will start to doubt their own opinions of what is happening.

I should point out that it is a fad that is country wide, not just about theme parks. Everyone knows how to do everything and are dead sure that they see glaring problems where none exist. Human nature I guess.

There is no shortage of very serious, legitimate problems right now either "country wide" or within The Walt Disney Company, whether people are looking for them or not.

After reading well over three hundred pages of Spirit posts and replies, one thing found is that some posters seem to take great offense if they think someone does not agree with their position on whatever. They are certainly entitled to feel as they do, but others should also be allowed to have an opinion or make an observation without essentially being told they belong elsewhere or that they are flat out wrong. That fits no definition of a "discussion" of which I am aware. If this observation makes me a thorn in someone's side, so be it.

That works both ways, however. If someone appears to have a very negative viewpoint on The Walt Disney Company, there usually is a legitimate, perfectly sound reason for it and such arguments should not be so easily dismissed.

 

[Kman101]

Agreed. It just seems to be complaining for the sake of complaining because "TDO doesn't know what they're doing" or something like that.

I agree, TDO has made a lot of mistakes over the years, but i'm also not even sure how much say they have on this project. I feel like it's likely coming from the top (Staggs).

As to your last point... We probably won't get Parachute drop or RC Racer... I believe the Maters ride will be replacing one of them in order to make the are more family oriented and also because of sight-line issues that would come from the parachute drop structure.

I agree it's probably coming from the top. That's not to say things won't get butchered, and knowing TDO, it likely has, even if it is near/at DCA levels.

I didn't think about sightlines but that's very true. I won't lose any sleep over Parachute or Slinky or even RC not coming. None of them are my cup of tea and I'd probably never ride them [not loving heights helps that ...]

And hey, I think TDO deserves the ire it gets a lot of the time and I know we all can't help but assume and guess what will happen but none of us really know the final details.

 

[Next Big Thing]

I agree it's probably coming from the top. That's not to say things won't get butchered, and knowing TDO, it likely has, even if it is near/at DCA levels.

I didn't think about sightlines but that's very true. I won't lose any sleep over Parachute or Slinky or even RC not coming. None of them are my cup of tea and I'd probably never ride them [not loving heights helps that ...]

And hey, I think TDO deserves the ire it gets a lot of the time and I know we all can't help but assume and guess what will happen but none of us really know the final details.

I think TDO deserves the flack they get as well, but I just think people need to sit back and sort of give this a chance.

This is sort of like getting out the pitchforks before we even have any official confirmation. The only ride I have a true problem with is the Slinky ride, I do truly hope that gets replaced. It has no business being in a Disney Park.

 

[PhotoDave219]

I think TDO deserves the flack they get as well, but I just think people need to sit back and sort of give this a chance.

This is sort of like getting out the pitchforks before we even have any official confirmation. The only ride I have a true problem with is the Slinky ride, I do truly hope that gets replaced. It has no business being in a Disney Park.

We don't even have rumors of exactly what they're going to do… There is no need to get righteously indignant yet.

What we do know? Something is coming. Most likely something pics are related in the back corner of the park. We know toys story is expanding Capacity. And we know it has absolutely nothing to do with the rumored Star Wars expansion.

Anything beyond that? Just truly a wild guess. Nothing is even Close to a solid rumor let alone in the ballpark of been confirmed.

What I worry about is something like a canary trap. Wherein, you throw out mis information, see where it appears, and then you know who's leaking your information.

 

[Next Big Thing]

We don't even have rumors of exactly what they're going to do… There is no need to get righteously indignant yet.

What we do know? Something is coming. Most likely something pics are related in the back corner of the park. We know toys story is expanding Capacity. And we know it has absolutely nothing to do with the rumored Star Wars expansion.

Anything beyond that? Just truly a wild guess. Nothing is even Close to a solid rumor let alone in the ballpark of been confirmed.

What I worry about is something like a canary trap. Wherein, you throw out mis information, see where it appears, and then you know who's leaking your information.

Exactly what I mean, this project still has a long way to go and a lot of components to it we don't know about.

 

[asianway]

We don't even have rumors of exactly what they're going to do… There is no need to get righteously indignant yet.

What we do know? Something is coming. Most likely something pics are related in the back corner of the park. We know toys story is expanding Capacity. And we know it has absolutely nothing to do with the rumored Star Wars expansion.

Anything beyond that? Just truly a wild guess. Nothing is even Close to a solid rumor let alone in the ballpark of been confirmed.

What I worry about is something like a canary trap. Wherein, you throw out mis information, see where it appears, and then you know who's leaking your information.

Dave I still adhere to the trap principle, but to be honest I don't think they're that smart.

And if they were, they've not exactly been stellar at protecting their proprietary information

 

[PhotoDave219]

Exactly what I mean, this project still has a long way to go and a lot of components to it we don't know about.

Exactly my point. We are completely putting the cart before the horse. We're getting caught up in details that I haven't even been decided yet. It's gonna be a crazy two or three years… I

 

[PhotoDave219]

Dave I still adhere to the trap principle, but to be honest I don't think they're that smart.

And if they were, they've not exactly been stellar at protecting their proprietary information

I get paranoid. Especially when I was told that some of the vice president's know exactly who the heck I am. Now why they haven't hired me… Probably because of posts off the word "shine box"

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

FWIW- Hong Kong doesn't have Pirates of the Caribbean.

 

[pmaljr]

Or they could establish and adhere to a stringent fire weather data program that keeps real time weather conditions to record temperature, wind speed and direction, relative humidity and other pertinent information. When weather conditions are not suitable for a fireworks show (or if conditions deteriorate during a show) they can stop the fireworks in the interest of guest safety.

Or not.

 

[DinoInstitute]

Insiders...Some people mentioned sightlines, and it got me thinking. If we are getting playland and its rides, when do you think height test balloons would go up, judging by the timeframe? That would help figure things out

 

[PhotoDave219]

Insiders...Some people mentioned sightlines, and it got me thinking. If we are getting playland and its rides, when do you think height test balloons would go up, judging by the timeframe? That would help figure things out

I have no idea

 

[mahnamahna101]

Laid out this way it is easy to see that there is plenty of money for at least 1 dark ride in addition to the Playland. Probably 2.

I wouldn't mind seeing an extended train ride as well.

Exactly... which is why I find it hard to believe 3 flat rides and RSR-lite is all Pixar will get with a $1.2-1.5 billion budget alloted for the entire park. Even if SWL gets $750 million and infrastructure/misc. get $250 million, there's still $500 million for Pixar.

This is like sports radio. Every caller thinks moving MILF to studios and retheming HISTKMSA will solve all the problems at WDW

It's not going to solve all of the problems. Who ever said that?

I just said that moving Laugh Floor to Studios and retheming HITSK to Bug's Life would provide a basis for mini-lands within Pixar Place. They also would be cheap additions that could be done fairly fast. More importantly, they would be small pieces that aid toward making DHS a more cohesive, well-rounded park.

Imagine Pixar Place with -

All of this (every aspect) would probably cost $800-900 million btw.

1. Toy Story Playland (TSMM, RC Racers - 4 tracks to increase capacity, Woody's Roundup, Slinky Dog, Pizza Planet)
2. A Bug's Land (Filk's Valley, Heimlich's Chew Chew Train; extended and better theming)
3. Monstropolis (Laugh Floor, Harryhausen's, Door Coaster)
4. Radiator Springs (Flo's, Cars dark ride)
5. Incredibles mini-land (E-ticket dark ride using Twister ride system and KUKA arms)

Ratatouille could even fit in there (Gusteau's and a clone of Ratatouille dark ride), but it might be smarter as an E-ticket for World Showcase. WALL-E makes more sense at Tomorrowland, Brave belongs in Fantasyland, Finding Nemo and Inside Out are fine at Epcot, Good Dinosaur might be what Dinoland needs to be revitalized, and Up wouldn't work thematically unless the Incredibles E-ticket is set on Syndrome's island.

Pixar Place should be DHS' equivalent of Fantasyland, essentially.

 

[danlb_2000]

Why bother looking at a construction site for something that won't open for another three years? Might as well watch paint dry or watch grass grow or discuss the thematic principled integrity of EPCOT Center.

Because some people find the process of building a ride/land just as interesting as the finished product.

 

[asianway]

Exactly... which is why I find it hard to believe 3 flat rides and RSR-lite is all Pixar will get with a $1.2-1.5 billion budget alloted for the entire park. Even if SWL gets $750 million and infrastructure/misc. get $250 million, there's still $500 million for Pixar.


It's not going to solve all of the problems. Who ever said that?

I just said that moving Laugh Floor to Studios and retheming HITSK to Bug's Life would provide a basis for mini-lands within Pixar Place. They also would be cheap additions that could be done fairly fast. More importantly, they would be small pieces that aid toward making DHS a more cohesive, well-rounded park.

Imagine Pixar Place with -

All of this (every aspect) would probably cost $800-900 million btw.

1. Toy Story Playland (TSMM, RC Racers - 4 tracks to increase capacity, Woody's Roundup, Slinky Dog, Pizza Planet)
2. A Bug's Land (Filk's Valley, Heimlich's Chew Chew Train; extended and better theming)
3. Monstropolis (Laugh Floor, Harryhausen's, Door Coaster)
4. Radiator Springs (Flo's, Cars dark ride)
5. Incredibles mini-land (E-ticket dark ride using Twister ride system and KUKA arms)

Ratatouille could even fit in there (Gusteau's and a clone of Ratatouille dark ride), but it might be smarter as an E-ticket for World Showcase. WALL-E makes more sense at Tomorrowland, Brave belongs in Fantasyland, Finding Nemo and Inside Out are fine at Epcot, Good Dinosaur might be what Dinoland needs to be revitalized, and Up wouldn't work thematically unless the Incredibles E-ticket is set on Syndrome's island.

Pixar Place should be DHS' equivalent of Fantasyland, essentially.

Only if you name the place Disney Rumor Mill Adventure

 

[PhotoDave219]

Because some people find the process of building a ride/land just as interesting as the finished product.

Indeed. However, there's one thing about being interested in the process & 100% speculation

 

[danlb_2000]

Indeed. However, there's one thing about being interested in the process & 100% speculation

Very little of the discussion about that new aerials has been 100% speculation.