The Spirited 8th Wonder (WDW's Future & You!)

[WDW1974]

Jt, even you can't gloss over this huge mess.

A motion cinema and a boat ride (if we're lucky) and a rebuilt mall won't help much.

Until WDIs outrageous overcharging is reigned in and we see some serious 10 figure investment in the parks there will be long term investment in everything BUT the parks.

Remember them? The theme parks?

Why is someone as smart as you wasting your time?

He can and he will. That is his schtick.

 

[WDW1974]

@WDW1974 I for one am glad the FC deal is almost dead. However to your point about taking a nap in the middle of the intersection, just be careful. A lot of CMs who live in Lake County actually use the roads that connect to Western Way via Flamingo Crossing because it's the only route that avoids Toll Roads or the heavily traveled US 27/US192 roads.

However that area is in fact still a major revenue stream from one entity: Orange County Sheriff's Dept. Because those roads are 35 mph and the traffic signal at FC/Western Way is a perpetual blinking red light, cops are station around FC at all hours hunting for speeders and stop sign "pausers".

Funny thing is: the one time i was stopped the cop actually told me they patrol the area because of the frequency of drag racing. I drive that route daily and my commute varies from all shifts and I have never seen anyone drag racing there. So I know that area is just being used by law enforcement for tickets.

Didn't mean to go too far off topic, but to bring it back around..wether the two Marriott Hotels are every built or if the area is ever sold off to other investors, I just hope they keep the roads open so I can get to work on time.

Thanks for the warning. I haven't been out there since last year. But everytime I take Western Way past CSR and the tree farm out to where TSFKaFC is, there is simply no one on the road once you get to the site. No one. Someone is (or was) maintaining the sidewalks and medians, mowing grass and the like ... but there has been absolutely nothing there. It looks like one of hundreds of real estate developments started in the 2007-08 era in FL that just died before anything beyond basic infrastructure went in.

 

[WDW1974]

I find it odd that 20 pages in and no one is really irate that Disney knew about Potter 2 coming (in some detail from what I gather) and they did nothing. Everyone is upset about a resort being converted to DVC? This complacency seems to be the problem. Everyone just accepts that TDO is going to do nothing. So let's complain about the loss of a resort. I think the bigger issue,adding nothing impressive to the parks, is just being accepted by everyone because that's what TDO always does. As long as this is the general attitude then I don't blame them for not responding to Potter. Why bother.

It all comes from the same management 'tude.

It may not seem like it on first glance, but all the news I placed in that post is connected by a common thread: a business mindset and model. (I guess you could say some 'tude too!)

 

[SpaceMountain77]

I have also been 'spoiled' by Disneyland over the last couple of years, and last year i realized it is now my Resort of choice as far as Disney Theme Parks right now stateside.
There is just something special and unique about it, and yes, it has 'heart' as you elegantly noted.

Since the late 70s i have visited and adored WDW. I used to visit yearly, sometimes twice or more times, particularly when i lived in Florida.
I am a serious EPCOT Center fan and loved that Park with a passion back in the day when i first experienced it in April of 1983. Blew my mind...and had a major impact on my life in a major way. The place was just so inspiring...the concepts being expressed then.
I still love EPCOT, but i have been saddened to see what has happened to the concept that once was and what we have ended up with to date.
The removal of much of the 'soul' of EPCOT has not helped much either, and the destruction of the Original 'Journey Into Imagination' Attraction will always be a wound within me that will never heal.
But i digress.....

I now adore Disneyland. I love the simplicity of the experience - reserve little, book nothing, just show up at the front gate and have fun.
That has become a rare occurrence now at WDW and i find the 'book everything in advance' aspect not really my cup of tea. Each there own, of course.

I still have a lot of affection for WDW, but it hurts to see what has become of the Property.
EPCOT will always be my 'home away from home' however.

Thank you, Figments Friend, for sharing this post. I share many of the same sentiments and consider myself one of Epcot's biggest fans. I may not be President or Vice President of the fan club, but do suspect that I hold the office of Secretary.

Of all the attractions and experiences offered at WDW, my favorite is at Epcot and it is neither Soarin' nor Test Track. My favorite WDW attraction is Living With the Land. I have been known to take several boat rides a day, I have experienced Behind the Seeds more than once and am successfully raising my own dragon fruit plant from Mickey's garden.

Of all the potential attractions at WDW, why Living With the Land? It constantly inspires me. For me, it quintessentially captures the power of creativity and promise of future technology.

Jim 8O

 

[WDW1974]

Sadly it is routine to a lot of us.

I knew roughly of Diagon three years ago. I was walked through Rip Ride Rockits path a year before construction began. I know some of what to expect 24-36 months from now, either planned, built or being built.

So you can bet TDO and TWDC know way more than me.

Hopefully that's not showing off. Just trying to demonstrate my point.

Show-off. The only true insider would be Mrs. Lee's favorite poster on this forum! (HINT: It may not be the choice some might think!)

 

[WDW1974]

I have no idea what you're talking about, but I love it!

That's perfectly fine. That one post was selfish ... it was for me and I won't feel sorry for it at all as I am sure the message has been received!

 

[kpilcher]

If we are calling Disney Springs just a shopping mall because it has shops and places to eat then why don't we call Main Street USA or about 90% of World Showcase a shopping mall?

OK. I'll especially call Main St. just a shopping mall. Once it had unique, themed-to-the-period attractions like the Magic Shop, Tobacco place, Penny Arcade, Cinema and Firehouse. It even had unique experiences like the silhouette cart and crystal blowing shop. It used to be my favorite land in all of Disney World. Those have been largely replaced with generic merchandise so that almost everything feels like one giant souvenir Emporium (whose window displays no longer change). Were it not for a handful of small attractions, the American Adventure, and a few museums World Showcase would be pretty much a mall too. Doesn't make me happy to say that.

 

[WDW1974]

So, why not make a stand? If MiceAge could do it from a "park quality" perspective in the 90's an 2000's then why not create a new platform keeping corporate Disney in check? Make it more public. More facts and less "searching for secret monorail pylons." (with all due respect)

It would not take any extra effort than what is already spent on these forum posts.

Why not?
@WDW1974
@PhotoDave219

Because it is a fulltime job with no pay and lots of OT and it won't work.

Trust me on this because if you only knew how many times I am asked/pushed about this or about becoming WDW's AL Lutz (to be fair, I know more about what is happening at other Disney parks and resorts and in other divisions than I do WDW!) by countless webmasters/sites.

There may be an answer in social media, but I haven't found it yet.

And I'll be honest, if Disney offered me a contract to consult tomorrow (for a fair wage), I'd take it and you'd not hear my voice again. No, I wouldn't sell out. I'd try and fix things from the inside. ... I just know how to get attention and how to place stories in the media. Disney absolutely takes me and things like this seriously, they just show the same arrogance, ignorance and avarice they do with moves like DVC or NGE ... they never actually face the real problems. Ever.

 

[DznyGrlSD]

There is just something special and unique about it, and yes, it has 'heart' as you elegantly noted.
I now adore Disneyland. I love the simplicity of the experience - reserve little, book nothing, just show up at the front gate and have fun.
That has become a rare occurrence now at WDW and i find the 'book everything in advance' aspect not really my cup of tea. Each there own, of course.

I still have a lot of affection for WDW, but it hurts to see what has become of the Property.

This! This this this this THIS!!!! I went to DL for the 1st time last May and now I know EXACTLY what you're talking about. How refreshing it was to not have to plan 180+10 days in advance and sweat the details. Yes, we planned in advance because we're WDW veterans, but next time we go (next year for the 60th??) we won't.

 

[WDW1974]

They're jorts, and they were never trendy. Misguided people (who also had mullets) just thought they were. j/k

I am not saying I want to sleep in a mosquito infested teepee, I am just saying it's a trendy thing right now. We actually have a Wigwam Village about an 1 1/2 from my house, and I would love to stay there once for fun except the reviews are pretty horrible. They do, however, sell unique Wigwam Village T-shirts and coffee mugs (hear that, TDO?).

I am sitting here wearing 'jorts' (and until this month had never heard that term before) and I certainly wasn't aware they weren't in. Oh well, I'll wear my Levi's jorts over some checkerboard pattern Ralph Lauren Polo shorts any day. Sincerely, The Hopelessly Out of Fashion Spirit!

 

[SpaceMountain77]

One note, I received a trip report linked from another site about a trip to the Grand Flo Villas. It seems (shockingly ) that many of them are seeing signs of extreme wear and tear in less than a year (yes, I'm a poet). Apparently, Disney used cheap materials and workmanship and ... you finish the post since you know where it is going.

As a DVC member, I do not completely buy into the materials and workmanship argument. First, the VGF decor is mainly white and light colored fabrics, which show wear more easily than darker colors.

Now, give me a minute to stand behind a wall because DVC members are going to begin to hurl rocks at me.

I believe the extreme wear and tear is largely due to how guests use the villas. Have you ever seen housekeeping remove trash from a 1- or 2-bedroom villa? Have you ever seen the luggage carts with Keurig Brewers, crock pots and toaster ovens? These villas are used like rental cars and I suspect only a small percentage show care for the villas. I suspect most assume high point costs and maintenance fees justify their extreme use.

(I am now covering my head)

 

[WDW1974]

You're kidding, right? That's just........... I really have no words for this. How could they be so clueless..........?

I know the answer, but have you ever met any of these people? Any Disney exec in the last 15 years?

It isn't hard to figure this out when you have.

 

[WDW1974]

At the risk of being repetitive....Oy.

... vey.

 

[Figments Friend]

Thank you, Figments Friend, for sharing this post. I share many of the same sentiments and consider myself one of Epcot's biggest fans. I may not be President or Vice President of the fan club, but do suspect that I hold the office of Secretary.

Of all the attractions and experiences offered at WDW, my favorite is at Epcot and it is neither Soarin' nor Test Track. My favorite WDW attraction is Living With the Land. I have been known to take several boat rides a day, I have experienced Behind the Seeds more than once and am successfully raising my own dragon fruit plant from Mickey's garden.

Of all the potential attractions at WDW, why Living With the Land? It constantly inspires me. For me, it quintessentially captures the power of creativity and promise of future technology.

Jim 8O

Fabness.
You have named the ONE Attraction still present at EPCOT that captures in many people's opinions the last shreds of 'what was' at EPCOT....'Living With The Land'.
It balances the 'edutainment' aspect rather well, although opinions of others will vary of course.

 

[Figments Friend]

This! This this this this THIS!!!! I went to DL for the 1st time last May and now I know EXACTLY what you're talking about. How refreshing it was to not have to plan 180+10 days in advance and sweat the details. Yes, we planned in advance because we're WDW veterans, but next time we go (next year for the 60th??) we won't.

Another 'converted one'.....YEEESSS!!

( pumps fist into the air )

 

[Funmeister]

Because it is a fulltime job with no pay and lots of OT and it won't work.

Trust me on this because if you only knew how many times I am asked/pushed about this or about becoming WDW's AL Lutz (to be fair, I know more about what is happening at other Disney parks and resorts and in other divisions than I do WDW!) by countless webmasters/sites.

There may be an answer in social media, but I haven't found it yet.

And I'll be honest, if Disney offered me a contract to consult tomorrow (for a fair wage), I'd take it and you'd not hear my voice again. No, I wouldn't sell out. I'd try and fix things from the inside. ... I just know how to get attention and how to place stories in the media. Disney absolutely takes me and things like this seriously, they just show the same arrogance, ignorance and avarice they do with moves like DVC or NGE ... they never actually face the real problems. Ever.

Fair enough.

 

[WDW1974]

But wasn't AL (MiceAge) successful in holding Disneyland accountable? (to a point?)

I don't want to go off too much on a tangent, but the times were different (social media didn't exist really ... and the 'net was new and Disney had no idea how to deal with the criticism) and the DL visitor makeup is different.

WDW fans never agree on anything. If you said WDW was located in O-Town, you'd have fanbois arguing that it is in Lake Buena Vista, another faction saying Bay Lake and another saying Reedy Creek and they'd get out their iPhones are start looking for crap to back up their assertions.

If I can get half of THIS site's community to agree with a viewpoint, then I am being hugely successful.

 

[SpaceMountain77]

Fabness.
You have named the ONE Attraction still present at EPCOT that captures in many people's opinions the last shreds of 'what was' at EPCOT....'Living With The Land'.
It balances the 'edutainment' aspect rather well, although opinions of others will vary of course.

Admittedly, I would much rather Listen to the Land, but am grateful to be Living With the Land

 

[WDWDad13]

What else new will Disney Springs offer, beside places to shop and eat? What will it give me that I couldn't get from Mall at Millenia?

Atmosphere that isn't a mall and unique shopping and dining venues for starters

 

[WDW1974]

Spirit, I don't typically speak up much in your threads, but I always read them so that I can "try" and understand what is going on at my once beloved WDW. When I read your initial posts last night, I had to step away to really give some thought as to why this DVC information was so upsetting to me. I mean, it's not like Disney hasn't done other things that upset me (making Fastpass ressies two months before I arrive, I am looking at you). But something about this just hit me right in the heart. Wilderness Lodge is our favorite resort. Ultimately, it isn't the DVC aspect that hurts here, it's the fact that because "regular" room inventory will now decrease, Disney will increase their already ridiculous rack room rates. Rates that I can't even consider without a discount, and even then, if I am being honest, it's way more than I should be spending. But I have always rationalized that the joy of going to Disney trumped the negatives. I have stayed at almost every resort on property except the Floridian and Yacht Club. Deluxe, moderate, value...there is something that I love about all of them. But with the implementation of the magic bands, the annual increase in ticket prices....blah, blah, blah...all the things that are discussed constantly, I am slowly seeing what you have been preaching. And in the "Spirit" of being honest, I haven't always bought in to what you were saying. But you finally got me with this thread. Which now means I have to seriously analyze how to spend my vacation dollars. Something I've never really worried about because WDW was always my pick.

Thank you for sharing your info and for giving us insight into some of the Corporate inner workings.

Thank you, Harvey.

You may not realize it, but your post may be the most important one on this thread yet. If I were following this at CP/TDO/Burbank, I'd be worried ... worried a lot. Because you are the type of guest they have owned in the past. And you and your feelings are becoming more and more mainstream. And Disney's response to you is akin to saying 'Go Have a MAGICal Night!' ... What a way to run the world's top theme park resort? What a way to live up to the Disney Legacy? What a classy bunch ... nah, just stopping here.