The Miscellaneous Thought Thread

[mickEblu]

I live in California but I don't know why Californians are offended when the state is criticized or people point out facts (not saying people on this board, I mean everywhere). I say people should acknowledge the issues of where they live in order to hopefully work towards solving those issues.

Housing is expensive, crime has been out of control, and utility prices have doubled in the past year or two.

To anyone whether they stay or leave I wish them the best. It's not a personal attack on me if someone leaves the state I live in, I've considered moving out of state as well.

And if you live in California shouldn't you want people to leave due to overcrowding and traffic?

Yup. I’m looking to move soon and rent for something decent in a decent area in my neck of the woods is $4000 ++++ (I’d like to emphasize the +) for a 3 bedroom/ 1200 square foot house built in the 50s. No California pride here when it comes to cost of living/ housing crisis. I weighed everything out and looks like I’ll just have to deal with it until I’m ready to buy in another state. I came to the conclusion that everything we are losing by leaving California isn’t worth it unless I’m buying a property somewhere else.

Unless of course things change here.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Well, luckily Utah is the land of milk and honey, where everything is swe...oh dear:

As the Great Salt Lake Dries Up, Utah Faces an ‘Environmental Nuclear Bomb’ (Published 2022)

Climate change and rapid population growth are shrinking the lake, creating a bowl of toxic dust that could poison the air around Salt Lake City.

www.nytimes.com

Literally every state has its own issues going on, California included. But folks love to focus on the Golden State, even if they’ve never visited or have never lived here.

How about looking at others states with people coming and going? But I guess that’s not as much fun.

 

[Parteecia]

And if you live in California shouldn't you want people to leave due to overcrowding and traffic?

That's my take on it.

As for water shortages? We don't have any water restrictions here. And the downtown area in this little city has several decorative water fountains and water play areas in the parks. So whatever water restrictions may have existed in the past, currently don't exist.

It could be that they're in de Nile.

 

[TP2000]

How about looking at others states with people coming and going? But I guess that’s not as much fun.

I think it's a lot of fun, actually! The beauty of America, and the brilliance of our Founding Fathers, is that we have individual states that can all compete against each other for residents and investment. Trying out various forms of government influence, or lack thereof in some cases, to attract the best people and the best investments.

The population of the United States continues to grow every year. And most states are seeing healthy increases in population, while some states see stagnant growth, but a small handful of states like California are seeing year-over-year population declines. Which is notable because the California decline has come rather suddenly and without warning, defying all the "experts" who never saw it coming, after 180 years of constant population increases.

California's population decline began in 2019, sped up in 2020, and continues now into 2023.

And that will directly impact state budgets for California, which are used to promote tourism and build infrastructure that supports the tourism industry. The Anaheim Resort District was developed in the 1990's with that type of government investment thanks to a wealthy and growing state. With the loss of hundreds of thousands of taxpaying residents per year, California is facing tens of Billions of dollars in budget shortfalls this year and in the next few years. That's gonna leave a mark!

State Population Change In One Year, From 2020 to 2021:
New York State: -1.8%
Illinois: -1.1%
California: -0.8%
Georgia: +0.8%
Florida: +1.1%
Texas: +1.3%
South Carolina: +1.4%
Arizona: +1.7%
Utah: +2.0%

Population

 

[TP2000]

Well, luckily Utah is the land of milk and honey, where everything is swe...oh dear:

As the Great Salt Lake Dries Up, Utah Faces an ‘Environmental Nuclear Bomb’ (Published 2022)

Climate change and rapid population growth are shrinking the lake, creating a bowl of toxic dust that could poison the air around Salt Lake City.

www.nytimes.com

Ah, yes, a Doom N' Gloom article quoting "experts" about what they think "could" happen in the future.

That article is from 2022, when the "experts" were all predicting the Southwest drought would continue into 2023. It didn't, even though just a few months ago weather "experts" were predicting another dry winter.

The Great Salt Lake averages a depth of only 14 feet. Shallower than some swimming pools with diving platforms. In the deepest corner of the lake, it's only 33 feet deep. By comparison, Lake Michigan is 922 feet deep, and Lake Chelan in Washington is 1,400 feet deep. Thus, the very shallow Great Salt Lake is highly susceptible to annual changes in rain/snow fall and temperatures.

The snowpack this winter in Utah is way above average already for the entire season, and it's only mid February. The runoff feeds the Great Salt Lake in the spring and will raise the water level a couple of feet more in May and June.

Rainy days in Utah are raising water levels at Great Salt Lake

The Utah Division of Water Resources is sharing good news about the impacts all the rain is having on the Great Salt Lake, whose water levels reached a historic low last year.

www.abc4.com

What a Difference a Year Makes | Satellite Images a Year Apart Show Difference in Utah's Snowpack - SnowBrains

What a difference a year makes! These satellite images of Utah taken a year apart show the impact of the record-breaking snowfall this winter compared to last year. Related: Top 9 Deepest Snowpacks in North America Right Now Utah’s snowpack is currently between 127-210% of normal, or about 170%...

snowbrains.com

 

[TP2000]

Back to Disneyland, I'm sure the rainy winter this year has helped the local flora and fauna around Orange County too!

I'd lived there for several decades, and you could always tell when the hills were healthy and green after a rainy winter or two. Versus the drought years of the mid 90's and the mid 2010's when even in March the hills were brown and dead looking. The street trees and commercial landscaping in Disneyland and around the Resort District also show stress and dry, limp growth in those drought years, even though they are irrigated and cared for by professionals.

That new Rivers of America area bordering Star Wars Land was planted right as the last drought set in around 2018. That landscaping and trees struggled a bit those first two years because of it, even though Disneyland was likely watering them like crazy. I imagine those recently planted trees are loving all the natural groundwater they're getting this winter!

There's nothing quite so refreshing to the Southwest's native flora and fauna as an unusually wet winter! All the sprinklers and paid gardeners in the world can't match what Mother Nature can dish out when she wants to!

 

[Parteecia]

That article is from 2022, when the "experts" were all predicting the Southwest drought would continue into 2023. It didn't, even though just a few months ago weather "experts" were predicting another dry winter.

This one is from this month. Changes to those fountains may be coming.


..."Earlier this week, a bipartisan group of state lawmakers unveiled bills ranging from expanding turf-reduction programs in cities, to providing more incentives to farmers to divert less water from rivers that feed the lake. Some pledged to spend upwards of a half billion dollars to save the lake.

"Even though the Great Salt Lake has risen a foot so far, we know that one wet winter is not going to wipe out two decades of very, very, very dry climate here in Utah," said Brad Wilson, the Republican House Speaker."...

But you are right. We can predict but we don't know. Personally I think California will be just fine. We've gone through boom and bust before but there's something about the geography and climate that bring people back every time.

 

[TP2000]

This one is from this month.


..."Even though the Great Salt Lake has risen a foot so far, we know that one wet winter is not going to wipe out two decades of very, very, very dry climate here in Utah," said Brad Wilson, the Republican House Speaker."...

Sorry my dear, I no longer automatically believe "experts" about what they think "could" happen.

And I stopped listening to politicians trying to scare up money for themselves several decades ago.

Something in my gut tells me that the Great Salt Lake will still be there next year, and next decade, and 100 years from now.

 

[mickEblu]

Back to Disneyland, I'm sure the rainy winter this year has helped the local flora and fauna around Orange County too!

I'd lived there for several decades, and you could always tell when the hills were healthy and green after a rainy winter or two. Versus the drought years of the mid 90's and the mid 2010's when even in March the hills were brown and dead looking. The street trees and commercial landscaping in Disneyland and around the Resort District also show stress and dry, limp growth in those drought years, even though they are irrigated and cared for by professionals.

That new Rivers of America area bordering Star Wars Land was planted right as the last drought set in around 2018. They struggled a bit those first two years because of it, even though Disneyland was likely watering them like crazy. I imagine those recently planted trees are loving all the natural groundwater they're getting this winter!

There's nothing quite so refreshing to the Southwest's native flora and fauna as an unusually wet winter! All the sprinklers and paid gardeners in the world can't match what Mother Nature can dish out when she wants to!

All the dry brown hills around Southern California have been nice and green since early January. So nice to see after the last few very dry years. We hadn’t had a good rainy season since winter 2018 if I recall correctly.

 

[Parteecia]

Ah, yes, a Doom N' Gloom article quoting "experts" about what they think "could" happen in the future.

That article is from 2022, when the "experts" were all predicting the Southwest drought would continue into 2023. It didn't, even though just a few months ago weather "experts" were predicting another dry winter.

The Great Salt Lake averages a depth of only 14 feet. Shallower than some swimming pools with diving platforms. In the deepest corner of the lake, it's only 33 feet deep. By comparison, Lake Michigan is 922 feet deep, and Lake Chelan in Washington is 1,400 feet deep. Thus, the very shallow Great Salt Lake is highly susceptible to annual changes in rain/snow fall and temperatures.

The snowpack this winter in Utah is way above average already for the entire season, and it's only mid February. The runoff feeds the Great Salt Lake in the spring and will raise the water level a couple of feet more in May and June.

Rainy days in Utah are raising water levels at Great Salt Lake

The Utah Division of Water Resources is sharing good news about the impacts all the rain is having on the Great Salt Lake, whose water levels reached a historic low last year.

www.abc4.com

What a Difference a Year Makes | Satellite Images a Year Apart Show Difference in Utah's Snowpack - SnowBrains

What a difference a year makes! These satellite images of Utah taken a year apart show the impact of the record-breaking snowfall this winter compared to last year. Related: Top 9 Deepest Snowpacks in North America Right Now Utah’s snowpack is currently between 127-210% of normal, or about 170%...

snowbrains.com

I know you're retired but perhaps you'd be willing to sacrifice for your new state?

"A bill that will be introduced in the Utah State Legislature will task one person with overseeing efforts to save the Great Salt Lake.

"The position, currently titled the "Great Salt Lake Commissioner," will coordinate with government agencies, environmental, tribal and industry groups and come up with a master plan for the future of the lake.

"It puts one person and one agency in charge of the Great Salt Lake to manage it," said House Majority Leader Mike Schultz, R-Hooper, in an interview with FOX 13 News."...

Utah legislature eyes changing approach to saving Great Salt Lake

A bill that will be introduced in the Utah State Legislature will task one person with overseeing efforts to save the Great Salt Lake.

www.fox13now.com

Ok, I should stop now.

ETA much much later because that is how slow my brain works now and I doubt anyone will read it but it will make me feel better, is that you may think the state of your state is fine but your state doesn't.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I think it's a lot of fun, actually! The beauty of America, and the brilliance of our Founding Fathers, is that we have individual states that can all compete against each other for residents and investment. Trying out various forms of government influence, or lack thereof in some cases, to attract the best people and the best investments.

The population of the United States continues to grow every year. And most states are seeing healthy increases in population, while some states see stagnant growth, but a small handful of states like California are seeing year-over-year population declines. Which is notable because the California decline has come rather suddenly and without warning, defying all the "experts" who never saw it coming, after 180 years of constant population increases.

California's population decline began in 2019, sped up in 2020, and continues now into 2023.

And that will directly impact state budgets for California, which are used to promote tourism and build infrastructure that supports the tourism industry. The Anaheim Resort District was developed in the 1990's with that type of government investment thanks to a wealthy and growing state. With the loss of hundreds of thousands of taxpaying residents per year, California is facing tens of Billions of dollars in budget shortfalls this year and in the next few years. That's gonna leave a mark!

State Population Change In One Year, From 2020 to 2021:
New York State: -1.8%
Illinois: -1.1%
California: -0.8%
Georgia: +0.8%
Florida: +1.1%
Texas: +1.3%
South Carolina: +1.4%
Arizona: +1.7%
Utah: +2.0%

Population

Fantastic! Get into New York and Illinois then! Or maybe worry about Utah, since you live there now?

 

[Phroobar]

We were suppose to be out of oil by the year 2000 according to 1980's experts.

https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/50-years-of-failed-doomsday-eco-pocalyptic-predictions-the-so-called-experts-are-0-50/

 

[PiratesMansion]

Ah, yes, a Doom N' Gloom article quoting "experts" about what they think "could" happen in the future.

That article is from 2022, when the "experts" were all predicting the Southwest drought would continue into 2023. It didn't, even though just a few months ago weather "experts" were predicting another dry winter.

The Great Salt Lake averages a depth of only 14 feet. Shallower than some swimming pools with diving platforms. In the deepest corner of the lake, it's only 33 feet deep. By comparison, Lake Michigan is 922 feet deep, and Lake Chelan in Washington is 1,400 feet deep. Thus, the very shallow Great Salt Lake is highly susceptible to annual changes in rain/snow fall and temperatures.

The snowpack this winter in Utah is way above average already for the entire season, and it's only mid February. The runoff feeds the Great Salt Lake in the spring and will raise the water level a couple of feet more in May and June.

Rainy days in Utah are raising water levels at Great Salt Lake

The Utah Division of Water Resources is sharing good news about the impacts all the rain is having on the Great Salt Lake, whose water levels reached a historic low last year.

www.abc4.com

What a Difference a Year Makes | Satellite Images a Year Apart Show Difference in Utah's Snowpack - SnowBrains

What a difference a year makes! These satellite images of Utah taken a year apart show the impact of the record-breaking snowfall this winter compared to last year. Related: Top 9 Deepest Snowpacks in North America Right Now Utah’s snowpack is currently between 127-210% of normal, or about 170%...

snowbrains.com

By all means dismiss it out of hand in a totally shocking move that absolutely does not fit with your usual history at all, but if I'm wrong, I won't have to live with the consequences of it. Not so true for you if you're the one who turns out to be wrong and is planning on staying in Utah, particularly if you are living in that long narrow strip near SLC (and by extension the lake itself) that is home to most Utahns.

 

[TP2000]

We were suppose to be out of oil by the year 2000 according to 1980's experts.

https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/50-years-of-failed-doomsday-eco-pocalyptic-predictions-the-so-called-experts-are-0-50/

Remember the Peak Oil craze of the 2000's? We'd run out of oil by 2030. Instead, human ingenuity and American Capitalism found new ways to get more oil out of the ground in places no one even knew oil existed before. It's called Fracking, and it's worked wonders for oil and natural gas in North America since 2010.

Also remember the "experts" of the 1970's who said that by the 1990's we'd all starve to death, and freeze to death, and run out of minerals, and generally have a series of really bad days.

Experts! Scientists! Expert scientists! Be afraid! Experts said so!

Earth Day 2022: Past predictions of an imminent environmental catastrophe have all been false

Paul Guppy breaks down the false claims and predictions made by climate alarmists for the past few decades.

www.washingtonpolicy.org

 

[TP2000]

Fantastic! Get into New York and Illinois then! Or maybe worry about Utah, since you live there now?

There's no reason for me to worry about Utah, it's growing in population and doing quite well with its tax base.

New York and Illinois are even worse off than California. Those are many of the folks moving to Florida and Texas, because their states are collapsing socio-economically.

 

[PiratesMansion]

Proud Illinois resident!

 

[TP2000]

Proud Illinois resident!

What's the local sentiment there on the declining population? Are people worried? What's it doing to city/state budgets?

Neighboring Wisconsin and Indiana have gained population recently, so it's not all just people tired of shoveling snow moving to Florida.

Illinois population shrinks for 9th year, Census says

(WTVO) — Illinois’ population shrunk for the 9th year in a row from 2021 to 2022, according to new estimates from the U.S. Census Bureau. The report said that the Land of Lincoln lost more th…

www.mystateline.com

 

[Rich T]

I’ve been in Florida for nearly a year. The politics are nuts, the humidity can be beyond belief, it’s still weird to never see mountains on the horizon… but I do count my next door neighbor here as a plus (pic from 2 days ago).

 

[TP2000]

All the dry brown hills around Southern California have been nice and green since early January. So nice to see after the last few very dry years. We hadn’t had a good rainy season since winter 2018 if I recall correctly.

What's so great about the Internet is that when "experts" make bold claims about the future, you can go back and still find them a few months later when the "experts" are proven wrong. Just ask poor Paul Ehrlich.

Even NOAA still has their winter outlook up for 2022-23 that they released in October. It couldn't have been more wrong if it tried when it comes to nearly everything west of the Rockies. Especially their drought prediction through January, so wrong it's comical.

This 33 second YouTube video NOAA released 3 months ago is perfection from the "experts".



Expert Prediction For Southwest USA Winter 2023 = Warmer Than Normal, Drier Than Normal, Drought Continues
Actual Weather For Southwest USA Winter 2023 = Colder Than Normal, Wetter Than Normal, Record High Mountain Snowpack

Winter 2022-23 Outlook

 

[TP2000]

I’ve been in Florida for nearly a year. The politics are nuts, the humidity can be beyond belief, it’s still weird to never see mountains on the horizon… but I do count my next door neighbor here as a plus (pic from 2 days ago).
View attachment 699124

I don't think those types of sightings would ever stop being alarming, even if I'd been born and raised there!

Still, what a magnificent looking beast. Truly impressive animals!