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The Miscellaneous Thought Thread
- Thread starter mickEblu
- Start date
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Except she didn't die on a public street. She died, yes tragically, on a service road on private property. So your insistence to keep bringing up the rules and laws of public streets that don't apply in this incident is the part that isn't relevant.
The how and why they are allowed to operate such carts on their own private property I'm sure will be answered during this investigation.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Isn't just my opinion -
Seat belts are key, but on private property the law is different
They are best worn all the time, but there is some void in where will be enforced.
www.ocregister.com
SuddenStorm
Well-Known Member
Isn't just my opinion -
Seat belts are key, but on private property the law is different
They are best worn all the time, but there is some void in where will be enforced.
Um, actually- Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is perspective, not the truth. - Marcus Aurelius
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Hence why I didn't say its a fact, but rather its not only me that has this opinion, ie its the opinion of others. But its fairly clear here that private property doesn't have the same rules as on public streets. So while its "advisable" it appears its not "enforceable" in terms of requiring safety restraints on the cart.
Now with that being said, as I've alluded to many times here, CA/OSHA will determine what was enforceable or not at the time of the incident. So we'll know for sure soon enough.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
It’s amazing how the concept of different rules applying to different places is some completely foreign concept.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Why? Cal/OSHA has found Disney liable in the past.
donaldtoo
Well-Known Member
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Did you just drop in to this thread on this page? Have you not been reading the previous posts here?
I've been very vocal that there must be a weird loophole for Disney to not have to put seat belts into their company vehicles when they are being driven on Disney's private roads (or sometimes across Disneyland Drive when waterslides are closed, etc.).
The problem is that while the laws of California may stop at the Disney property line, the law of physics does not stop there.
Thus, when a private company has a fleet of private vehicles that are not equipped with seat belts, it's only a matter of time before an employee is injured or killed in an accident that could have been prevented with seat belts.
This is going to be an ongoing story in the media as it rolls along. It's not going away, I can guarantee that.
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
I'm sure they'll try, at least with the Cal OSHA investigation.
But the inevitable court case from the Lear family probably won't be so easy to accept that explanation.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
We've been talking a lot this spring about Disney's various recent disasters and missteps; Fantasmic! without a dragon, Pixar Fest and whatever the heck that's supposed to be, firing a bunch of entertainers because they unionized, and now the HR crap basket unfolding in Florida with Tiana's Bayou Adventure...
But I just saw this photo and it reminded me that everything wasn't always perfect in the past. This photo was taken in June, 1960 at the press event for the grand opening of Nature's Wonderland in Frontierland. This is what Mickey Mouse still looked like a full five years after Disneyland opened and Walt had made a ton of money.
It's not at all creepy, is it? Notice the work boots. And there's a pig doing the same thing a few tables down. Just odd.
But I just saw this photo and it reminded me that everything wasn't always perfect in the past. This photo was taken in June, 1960 at the press event for the grand opening of Nature's Wonderland in Frontierland. This is what Mickey Mouse still looked like a full five years after Disneyland opened and Walt had made a ton of money.
It's not at all creepy, is it? Notice the work boots. And there's a pig doing the same thing a few tables down. Just odd.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
This seems really dumb on the part of the unions. But leave it to the 2020's unions to yell "unfair!" to the media.
Do you think CM's should wear buttons that say "Disney Workers Rising" with a Mickey fist thrust in the air on their uniforms?
I don't think they should do this. It's tacky and impolite.
Plus, there's also the other issue this raises.... So you're just a worker? Not a Cast Member in a show?
Do you think CM's should wear buttons that say "Disney Workers Rising" with a Mickey fist thrust in the air on their uniforms?
I don't think they should do this. It's tacky and impolite.
Plus, there's also the other issue this raises.... So you're just a worker? Not a Cast Member in a show?
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Its sad she lost her life, but how that makes Disney liable is not dependent on law of physics but the laws of the land.Did you just drop in to this thread on this page? Have you not been reading the previous posts here?
I've been very vocal that there must be a weird loophole for Disney to not have to put seat belts into their company vehicles when they are being driven on Disney's private roads (or sometimes across Disneyland Drive when waterslides are closed, etc.).
The problem is that while the laws of California may stop at the Disney property line, the law of physics does not stop there.
Thus, when a private company has a fleet of private vehicles that are not equipped with seat belts, it's only a matter of time before an employee is injured or killed in an accident that could have been prevented with seat belts.
This is going to be an ongoing story in the media as it rolls along. It's not going away, I can guarantee that.
So laws of physics aside, we can say that while Disney could have had carts with seat belts (provided they don't) in this incident, and maybe they should have, they may not be required based on the letter of the law concerning private property. And its that letter of the law, no matter what we feel Disney should have/could have done, that will determine liability and fault here.
And if such lawsuit happens against Disney it'll likely just quietly go away with a no-fault settlement.
Worst thing that will likely happen to Disney is they end up replacing their cart fleet with ones with seat belts, or I should say rent new ones with seat belts, and repave the service roads with new signs cautioning to slow down.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Or, it’s not a loophole but a difference between private and public. There are even places in California where you are able to drive road illegal cars at speeds well in excess of speed limits.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
We call those race tracks, or drag strips, and there are several big ones in SoCal.
But if Disneyland was operating a drag racer on its backstage roads, that would create the same problem for them that operating an LSV without seat belts on its backstage roads has done. It's a vehicle unsafe and unfit to use on public roads, and so using it on private roads doesn't magically make it safer.
The law of physics still applies on Disneyland property.
This car is entirely legal on private raceways in California. That does not make it suitable for use as employee transportation at Disneyland. And if Disneyland did use it as employee transportation and a CM was killed riding it, they'd be sued.
Here's an update from OCR on the entertainment reductions:
"Disney California Adventure has canceled two shows and cut back performances on two more as atmosphere entertainment continues to shrink at the Anaheim theme park heading into the busy Fourth of July weekend during the peak of summer.
Disney California Adventure is trimming schedules in July for the Warriors of Wakanda in Avengers Campus and the Citizens of Buena Vista Street along the park’s main entrance promenade.
Disney California Adventure will soon adjust performance schedules on select entertainment offerings, according to Disneyland officials.
Disney California Adventure continually evaluates entertainment offerings and makes adjustments, according to Disneyland officials.
Warriors of Wakanda: The Disciplines of the Dora Milaje features the Black Panther’s bodyguards offering strength and skill training sessions to visitors in the Marvel themed land.
The Citizens of Buena Vista Street include a police officer, bike messenger and the mayor dressed in period costumes who interact with visitors and bring the entry promenade’s 1920s Los Angeles theme to life.
Both Warriors of Wakanda and Citizens of Buena Vista Street performed daily in June and will cut back performances by 20% or more during July — one of the busiest vacation months of the year.
Citizens of Buena Vista Street will not be offered on Thursdays and Fridays during most of July while Warriors of Wakanda will not be offered on select Mondays, Thursdays, Fridays and Sundays throughout the month. The Disneyland entertainment calendar only extended to July 24 as of press time."
Disneyland cuts back on entertainment during peak summer season
Disney California Adventure trims schedules in July for Warriors of Wakanda and Citizens of Buena Vista Street.
www.ocregister.com
CastAStone
5th gate? Just build a new resort Bob.
90% of the “cuts” have been added back to the calendar.
Dr Strange is still going away.
A couple things appear to have been cut to 5 days a week.
CastAStone
5th gate? Just build a new resort Bob.
@DCBaker beat me to it! Again!