The Miscellaneous Thought Thread

[Consumer]

I'm surprised there's not much buzz around Loki season 2. It's on par with season 1 and clearly remains the best Marvel show on Disney+. Honestly, I get so swept up in the story I forget it's part of the MCU.

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

To an extent, yes. But the negativity here has been going strong for years. That “miserable hive of b@stards” label that was put on us years ago was warranted. We all bonded over our collective disappointment with the parks (and was still faithfully going ). We joked many times about being miserable. I’m more happy now than from a few years ago, simply because I’ve changed my outlook regarding the parks.

What did it was the reveal of folks’ colors over time as political drama polluted the country, thanks to you-know-who. We started getting to know one another outside of being Disneyland fans and it wasn’t very pretty. That’s when the vibe started to shifting. Then the pandemic came and it took an absolute nose dive.

The forum hasn’t been the same since.

I'd say both parties have contributed to the country's division, although I will easily admit our last few presidents and wanna be's- one in particular- have downgraded the dignity of the role as well as fostered greater division.

I think we're still a pretty friendly group of people that enjoy each other and attempt to at least understand and respect each other. If we disagree, it seems we generally do it well.

If I lived in CA, I'd certainly like to meet you all!

 

[PiratesMansion]

While there are a lot of legitimate arguments to be made about DL's decline over the years (all while raising prices to the moon and back), familiarity does breed contempt, and that's part of the equation as well.

That happened to me with the park that has been closest to me for most of my life-Six Flags Great America. For well over ten years, I went to this park again and again and again-and during a couple of years, I was at the place once a week every summer. It was there for me when I first really got into parks and roller coasters, and it was (and to an extent still is) fairly functional for a Six Flags park. And it's also Chicago's only real park, with the next closest park being about three hours away. It was that or nothing.

For a long time, I loved it. But if you go to any park that much, eventually you're going to intimately know each and every flaw of that operation, and it will start to wear on you. Perhaps you'll get to the point, as I did, where all you see is the flaws, and that's the point where you need to take a break. I haven't been back to SFGAm since my last move, and honestly, give a specific ride or two, I don't miss it at all. Even before I moved, I got to the point where I could only stand to be there for a few hours before I would have the urge to leave and do something else.

I love Disneyland, still think it's one of (if not the) best parks in North America, and even with its flaws, it is still more competently run than most parks in this country that I've been to, even now. But there's no doubt in my mind that if I shelled out on one of the top passes and went all the time for several years, I'd be over it too.

 

[TP2000]

It’s tough. Just from even a practical standpoint it’s hard thing to replace. My daughter has asked me to go almost every day the last two months. My son boos me when I say let’s go to Knotts. My wife side eyes me for not renewing. I ended up at Chuck E Cheese last weekend for God Sake! Haha

Tell them that there are upper-middle class children in Seattle who only get to go to Disneyland every two or three years, and only in between family trips to Maui or Whistler or Cabo San Lucas. That should quiet them down and really make them think. Then remind your wife that it builds character.

Sometimes I think I missed by calling by not being a parent. I would have been good.

 

[mickEblu]

Tell them that there are upper-middle class children in Seattle who only get to go to Disneyland every two or three years, and only in between family trips to Maui or Whistler or Cabo San Lucas. That should quiet them down and really make them think. Then remind your wife that it builds character.

Sometimes I think I missed by calling by not being a parent. I would have been good.

Well the Martinis might help keep you sane but I dunno TP, you sound like too much of a bachelor. I could only imagine 30 or 40 year old TP.

 

[Rich T]

I love Disneyland, still think it's one of (if not the) best parks in North America, and even with its flaws, it is still more competently run than most parks in this country that I've been to, even now.

I agree. But it used to be so much better than what recent leadership has transformed it into. It used to be a bargain that most people could easily afford. It used to give guests far, far more than their money’s worth. It used to offer more diverse live entertainment daily. It used to dream about the future, romanticize about the past, and present science more entertainingly than anywhere else on Earth. It used to have *four* amazing, world-famous animatronic stage productions. It didn’t used to upcharge right and left. Every guest used to be treated equally without a pay-to-win system for skipping lines.

And it used to be a showcase for original ideas that were not tied to existing IPs.

It’s still the best single park in the U.S. (and far more fun IMO than any of the WDW parks), but it has its own history to compare itself to, and that’s a very high bar indeed. It’s the difference between a park that was created by people who wanted to give guests the best possible experience and a park run by a giant corporation that wants to make as much money as possible. There is a balance between the two, and I—and I’m sure many others—personally think that the balance is currently off (and has been for quite a while) and the experience is suffering—and not just for frequent visitors.

 

[PiratesMansion]

I agree. But it used to be so much better than what recent leadership has transformed it into. It used to be a bargain that most people could easily afford. It used to give guests far, far more than their money’s worth. It used to offer more diverse live entertainment daily. it used to dream about the future, romanticize about the past, and present science more entertainingly than anywhere else on Earth. It used to have *four* amazing, world-famous animatronic stage productions. It didn’t used to upcharge right and left. Every guest used to be treated equally without a pay-to-win system for skipping lines.

And it used to be a showcase for original ideas that were not tied to existing IPs.

It’s still the best single park in the U.S. (and far more fun IMO than any of the WDW parks), but it has its own history toAnd compare itself to, and that’s a very high bar indeed. It’s the difference between a park that was created by people who wanted to give guests the best possible experience and a park run by a giant corporation that wants to make as much money as possible. There is a balance between the two, and I—and I’m sure many others—personally think that the balance is currently off (and has been for quite a while) and the experience is suffering—and not just for frequent visitors.

And I can't disagree with any of that. Just the notion that the park is irredeemably ruined and terrible now compared to how things used to be. There's still a lot of things about the place that still work.

And sad to say, as much as Disneyland is a shell of what it used to be, that's arguably true of 90% of parks in this country right now. Maybe Universal is functioning better in some ways (and is certainly easier to experience), but I can't think of anyone/anything else that is, really.

 

[Rich T]

And I can't disagree with any of that. Just the notion that the park is irredeemably ruined and terrible now compared to how things used to be. There's still a lot of things about the place that still work.

And sad to say, as much as Disneyland is a shell of what it used to be, that's arguably true of 90% of parks in this country right now. Maybe Universal is functioning better in some ways (and is certainly easier to experience), but I can't think of anyone/anything else that is, really.

I do think everything that’s wrong with DL and WDW can be fixed. And, certainly, the competition isn’t perfect.

Universal Orlando currently gets huge bonus points from me for being easier to experience and having affordable high-quality resorts on property like Cabana Bay and Sapphire Falls.

I’m excited to try every single one of the rumored attractions coming to Epic Universe. What the actual experience of getting *onto* those attractions will be like… remains to be seen. I choose optimism for now.

 

[TP2000]

In related news, a couple weeks ago I was talking to friends who took their grandchildren to Sea World this past summer.

They said it had gone waaaaay downhill. The park was dirty and looked dingy. There were almost no employees in sight, and it felt abandoned in spots. The few employees they did have were all about 18 years old and ranged from mildly disinterested to blatantly surly. There were no park maps available, and any question about showtimes or directions or offerings was met with the curt reply "It's on the App". It was also... dirty. (I know I already said that, but this was coming from longtime San Diego residents who remember how clean and lovely Sea World always was.)

Something tells me the glory days of SoCal theme parks are behind us now. Not that it can't improve again, but this is not a good time to be at a SoCal theme park.

 

[PiratesMansion]

In related news, a couple weeks ago I was talking to friends who took their grandchildren to Sea World this past summer.

They said it had gone waaaaay downhill. The park was dirty and looked dingy. There were almost no employees in sight, and it felt abandoned in spots. The few employees they did have were all about 18 years old and ranged from mildly disinterested to blatantly surly. There were no park maps available, and any question about showtimes or directions or offerings was met with the curt reply "It's on the App". It was also... dirty. (I know I already said that, but this was coming from longtime San Diego residents who remember how clean and lovely Sea World always was.)

Something tells me the glory days of SoCal theme parks are behind us now. Not that it can't improve again, but this is not a good time to be at a SoCal theme park.

This is what I'm talking about. People who think DL alone has fallen often haven't spent any time at other parks, where things are almost always worse. And I actually like SWSD a lot, and consider it to be my favorite of the SeaWorld parks.

SeaWorld has spent much of the past decade or so struggling, chomping through CEOs like candy bars (reportedly due to some hostile, unreasonable board members), and has pretty much resorted to just building coasters at this point, which they are basically opening annually at their parks now. Unfortunately, the attention to detail and care that used to mark the SeaWorld (and Busch Gardens) parks is entirely lacking in newer additions-the ugliest area of SWSD is the part around Emperor, the park's newest ride, where no landscaping work was done and the station wasn't even given a roof. Animal exhibit additions or refurbs are few and far between. The shows are in an awkward phase where it feels like they're almost apologizing for still doing them. I remember when I went to the park in Texas last year, the only show that had energy or was entertaining to anyone over the age of 10 was the fireworks/stunt show that closed the park, where not one animal was in sight. When I was last in Orlando, there were NO brochures for SeaWorld-even Busch Gardens in Tampa (owned by the same company) had brochures on the racks next to Disney, Universal, Fun Spot, Legoland, etc. Not one for SeaWorld.

In every SeaWorld-owned park, areas of the parks sit abandoned. Most of the interesting food variety that once existed is now gone, and there's an additional % surcharge on every meal purchase that can't be avoided-and they've often used print that's intentionally almost impossible to read or notice while doing so. You can't open the website to any SeaWorld park without getting a pop-up purporting to offer you a deal. When I decided I wanted to cancel the SW pass I bought in 2022, there was NO place to cancel the pass online-you had to call. They're building some great coasters, but it's hard to feel much enthusiasm for them when their parks have declined so much from what they once were-and I say that as someone who missed the alleged glory days of the parks when they were owned by AB.

Among the big park chains, basically everyone but Disney has abandoned park maps at this point. Six Flags parks I went to last year still had maps, but they were nowhere to be found at SFDK-or anywhere else-this summmer. I can read a paper map pretty easily, but I cannot for the life of me use apps to orient myself. It's really frustrating.

I do think it's too soon to definitively say the glory days are gone. USH is certainly trying to push the envelope with Mario Kart, F&TF, etc. Disney is still capable of putting out a masterpiece when they want to, and nothing that has changed for the worse is completely irreversible. Knott's has done a lot of restorative work over the last decade and is only a full returning of entertainment (and an ops overhaul) away from being in great shape. There ARE good things happening-just not at SeaWorld.

 

[SuddenStorm]

I'm surprised there's not much buzz around Loki season 2. It's on par with season 1 and clearly remains the best Marvel show on Disney+. Honestly, I get so swept up in the story I forget it's part of the MCU.

I need to check this out. After how awful Ahsoka was I wasn't in a hurry to watch more Disney plus stuff.

 

[TP2000]

There ARE good things happening-just not at SeaWorld.

That would be a hysterical tagline for the billboards, wouldn't it?!?

My AI Bing generator can't quite get the exact phrasing down, so I had to do a sloppy edit, but I like the looks of it...

 

[mickEblu]

I need to check this out. After how awful Ahsoka was I wasn't in a hurry to watch more Disney plus stuff.

Really? I thought it was getting really good reviews. Particularly the last episode ? I watched the first 10 minutes of the first episode and fell asleep but was going to try to give it a chance.

 

[mickEblu]

The Once Upon a Studio short and Wondrous Journeys are two of the best things to come from Disney in a long time. Both have a lot of heart.

 

[mickEblu]

One more new reason Halloween is my least favorite time at Disneyland. They now have the park decorated for Christmas and Halloween for nearly half of the Halloween season.

 

[Rich T]

This is what I'm talking about. People who think DL alone has fallen often haven't spent any time at other parks, where things are almost always worse. And I actually like SWSD a lot, and consider it to be my favorite of the SeaWorld parks.

SeaWorld has spent much of the past decade or so struggling, chomping through CEOs like candy bars (reportedly due to some hostile, unreasonable board members), and has pretty much resorted to just building coasters at this point, which they are basically opening annually at their parks now. Unfortunately, the attention to detail and care that used to mark the SeaWorld (and Busch Gardens) parks is entirely lacking in newer additions-the ugliest area of SWSD is the part around Emperor, the park's newest ride, where no landscaping work was done and the station wasn't even given a roof. Animal exhibit additions or refurbs are few and far between. The shows are in an awkward phase where it feels like they're almost apologizing for still doing them. I remember when I went to the park in Texas last year, the only show that had energy or was entertaining to anyone over the age of 10 was the fireworks/stunt show that closed the park, where not one animal was in sight. When I was last in Orlando, there were NO brochures for SeaWorld-even Busch Gardens in Tampa (owned by the same company) had brochures on the racks next to Disney, Universal, Fun Spot, Legoland, etc. Not one for SeaWorld.

In every SeaWorld-owned park, areas of the parks sit abandoned. Most of the interesting food variety that once existed is now gone, and there's an additional % surcharge on every meal purchase that can't be avoided-and they've often used print that's intentionally almost impossible to read or notice while doing so. You can't open the website to any SeaWorld park without getting a pop-up purporting to offer you a deal. When I decided I wanted to cancel the SW pass I bought in 2022, there was NO place to cancel the pass online-you had to call. They're building some great coasters, but it's hard to feel much enthusiasm for them when their parks have declined so much from what they once were-and I say that as someone who missed the alleged glory days of the parks when they were owned by AB.

Among the big park chains, basically everyone but Disney has abandoned park maps at this point. Six Flags parks I went to last year still had maps, but they were nowhere to be found at SFDK-or anywhere else-this summmer. I can read a paper map pretty easily, but I cannot for the life of me use apps to orient myself. It's really frustrating.

I do think it's too soon to definitively say the glory days are gone. USH is certainly trying to push the envelope with Mario Kart, F&TF, etc. Disney is still capable of putting out a masterpiece when they want to, and nothing that has changed for the worse is completely irreversible. Knott's has done a lot of restorative work over the last decade and is only a full returning of entertainment (and an ops overhaul) away from being in great shape. There ARE good things happening-just not at SeaWorld.

None of this lets Disney parks off the hook for being a shadow of their former excellence and class (IMO). They need to look to their own past for their standard, not at Six Socks.

SeaWorld Orlando needs improvement, but it’s still a pleasant, pretty, stress-free visit and it has Mako, which is one of the best rides on Earth. And looking at this year’s new offerings, I think Pipeline is more fun than Tron (Though Dollywood’s Big Bear Mountain is more fun than both combined).

There are some good things happening at SeaWorld; the new Penguin dark ride/family coaster looks like a good fit for the Orlando park.

Universal Orlando still has paper maps aplenty in many languages. I’m actually surprised WDW hasn’t banned maps; we can’t have soda straws, apparently, but maps and buy-our-festival-food pamphlets? Take as many as you want!

 

[PiratesMansion]

None of this lets Disney parks off the hook for being a shadow of their former excellence and class (IMO). They need to look to their own past for their standard, not at Six Socks.

SeaWorld Orlando needs improvement, but it’s still a pleasant, pretty, stress-free visit and it has Mako, which is one of the best rides on Earth. And looking at this year’s new offerings, I think Pipeline is more fun than Tron (Though Dollywood’s Big Bear Mountain is more fun than both combined).

There are some good things happening at SeaWorld; the new Penguin dark ride/family coaster looks like a good fit for the Orlando park.

Universal Orlando still has paper maps aplenty in many languages. I’m actually surprised WDW hasn’t banned maps; we can’t have soda straws, apparently, but maps and buy-our-festival-food pamphlets? Take as many as you want!

Never said it did, just pointing out, again, that there are a whole lot of places that are worse experiences than they were five years ago and aren't up to their former standards, Disney included, and I would absolutely include SWO in that category too. IMO they (and the SeaWorld parks more generally) have a branding problem that they haven't really tried to solve other than to throw in as many coasters as possible and hope that people don't notice, which is a very Six Flags thing to do. More should be written about how SeaWorld has basically abandoned much of what it used to stand for and isn't as materially different from somewhere like Six Flags Discovery Kingdom as it should be, or as it used to be.

Glad to hear that Universal Orlando still offers paper maps.

 

[CaptinEO]

On another note, I think it’s kind of interesting that on POTC after the first drop you go from the full uppity POTC theme song to the more eerie, mood setting atmospheric music after the second drop in mere seconds. It works, it’s just a pretty drastic change in tone in a very short amount of time. After the first drop the POTC song kind of functions like ZADD on Splash. We survived, we made it. It also throws a bone to the little kids saying don’t worry it gets better.

I’d love to know if this has always been the case.

The atmospheric cave music was added in the 2006 refurb.

Before this change it was a pirates life for me playing after the first and second drop.

 

[Rich T]

The atmospheric cave music was added in the 2006 refurb. Before this change it was the same music as the later part (pirate sleeping/headboard area) playing after the first drop.

I enjoy both versions of the cavern music, but if they ever get rid of the movie overlay and steer it more toward “classic” POC (as part of some possible future promotion where they truly celebrate their history), I hope the “Scare Me” track is restored in that section. Those original compositions are as much a part of POC for me as the original voices and the ride’s unique hits-you-the-moment-you-enter smell.

 

[Rich T]

Never said it did, just pointing out, again, that there are a whole lot of places that are worse experiences than they were five years ago and aren't up to their former standards, Disney included, and I would absolutely include SWO in that category too. IMO they (and the SeaWorld parks more generally) have a branding problem that they haven't really tried to solve other than to throw in as many coasters as possible and hope that people don't notice, which is a very Six Flags thing to do. More should be written about how SeaWorld has basically abandoned much of what it used to stand for and isn't as materially different from somewhere like Six Flags Discovery Kingdom as it should be, or as it used to be.

Glad to hear that Universal Orlando still offers paper maps.

I actually think it’s a good idea for SeaWorld to move away from animal performances and turn their brand into a sea-themed ride park with a focus on conservation. I think they just need to commit to it fully and do it better. The Florida park has a good foundation, and is building its reputation as the best coaster park in Orlando. Now they need to fill out the experience with some well-themed family flat rides and more food options.

But, on that note, I really hope the park survives the arrival of Epic Universe.

This is a stretch, but how cool would it be if Universal bought the Orlando park, rebranded and remodeled it as Universal Amazing Oceans and debuted it with a fantastic update of the Jaws ride?