The Living Seas of Old Epcot

SleepingMonk

Well-Known Member
Let's use a bit of comparative analysis.

"SEC filings from the company estimate the combined cost...Wizarding World at.. $200 million..."


So the entire of PotterLand for $200 million or a single Mermaid ride for $100 million.

Who got the most value for their dollar?
 

Spike-in-Berlin

Well-Known Member
Let's use a bit of comparative analysis.

"SEC filings from the company estimate the combined cost...Wizarding World at.. $200 million..."


So the entire of PotterLand for $200 million or a single Mermaid ride for $100 million.

Who got the most value for their dollar?

WWoHP was only 200 millions? That must have been a damn real good ROI so far.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
Well EE was supposed to cost 100 million so if both are true TLM is a joke!
Which should make you question the validity of both of those estimates. But, there is something else to consider. The price of construction materials in the last 10 years have risen dramatically. Many have doubled in price. Looking at those numbers it is quite conceivable that what would have cost 50 million to build in 2001 now costs more than 100 million.

http://www.bls.gov/ro3/ppiconcrete.htm
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
Let's use a bit of comparative analysis.

"SEC filings from the company estimate the combined cost...Wizarding World at.. $200 million..."


So the entire of PotterLand for $200 million or a single Mermaid ride for $100 million.

Who got the most value for their dollar?
Why don't we also compare the taste of a dole whip the the processor speed of a 386/40?

A comparative analysis between a number made up by the press and Disney fans and an SEC filing is considerably less useless that a horoscope.
 

Prototype82

Well-Known Member
The Seas With Nemo and Friends is an irrelevant joke. The Living Seas was a flawless themed formula for an attraction. It brought you into its story, brought you into the future, enlightened guests, and made you feel like you were really off to the ocean floor to make discoveries. It's tragic. That pre-show gave me goosebumps. Imagine a world where we have spent less time than on the surface of the moon... An overhaul could have enhanced it tremendously with state of the art effects, new aquarium features, etc. But instead we got clam-mobiles. Gee, how inspiring.
 

Prototype82

Well-Known Member
I know Original Living Seas was much quieter and something I miss dearly. Having Nemo and Friends blasted into my ears while trapped in a shell car is somewhat toturous. BTW is that restarant where you eat in the aquarium still there or did that go with the old Living Seas?
That's why you enter through that back door and skip the ride.
 

SeaBase86

Member
The Seas With Nemo and Friends is an irrelevant joke. The Living Seas was a flawless themed formula for an attraction. It brought you into its story, brought you into the future, enlightened guests, and made you feel like you were really off to the ocean floor to make discoveries. It's tragic. That pre-show gave me goosebumps. Imagine a world where we have spent less time than on the surface of the moon... An overhaul could have enhanced it tremendously with state of the art effects, new aquarium features, etc. But instead we got clam-mobiles. Gee, how inspiring.

Agreed fully!!
 

SeaBase86

Member
I would say that both sides have quite good arguments.

The old Living Seas ride began with an impressive movie and the hydrolators were a cool idea, they created a feeling of things to come that was quite disappointed. Let's face it, Living Seas fans, the ride after the hydrolators was LAME. You rode in a seacab through a sterile tunnel without any theming whatsoever, for several minutes and the only thing you could see was the aquarium. Nothing happened, no effects etc. It was quite boring and added nothing to the experience you would later have anyways when you watched the aquarium from the observation deck.
I understand that Disney had to change that because despite the beautiful music it had it was by far the most uninteresting ride (after the hydrolators) FW had to offer in those days.

But those who critisize that Nemo doesn't fit into a FW-theming are quite right too. Nemo has nothing to do with the topic of Future World and let's face it Nemo and Friends fans, the ride looks quite cheap. It was a later change and it shows. Several effects are very basic (The jellyfishes) and the entire ride is charming but doesn't tell you anything about the seas.

Could it have been different. I say yes. They could have transformed the ride into a much more interesting experience without tacking on a movie character.
They could have changed the ride into a ride through the different environments of the sea, from the abyssic depths of the deep sea trenches where some of the most bizarre animals in the world live to the coral reefs.
The Anglerfish scene in the Nemo ride shows what could have been done, after the hydrolators you would have entered an area that makes you believe that you are really in deep seas, in the region of eternal darkness and where you finally boarded the seacabs that know looked like minusubs, designed to withstand the enormous pressure of the deep. An entire section could have been filled with confrontations with terryfying yet realistic monsters of the deep. You could have done a kind of scientific 20.000 LutS-journey before you finally entered the Seabase Alpha part of the building.

Well I'm just saying I wouldn't expect a tunnel to be themed immensely. Especially one that was taking you to an undersea scientific research center. What could they have done better then in your opinion. (not bashing btw just curious).
 

Choodles

New Member
The Seas With Nemo and Friends is an irrelevant joke. The Living Seas was a flawless themed formula for an attraction. It brought you into its story, brought you into the future, enlightened guests, and made you feel like you were really off to the ocean floor to make discoveries. It's tragic. That pre-show gave me goosebumps. Imagine a world where we have spent less time than on the surface of the moon... An overhaul could have enhanced it tremendously with state of the art effects, new aquarium features, etc. But instead we got clam-mobiles. Gee, how inspiring.

Oh I like you Sir!:king:
 

Spike-in-Berlin

Well-Known Member
Well I'm just saying I wouldn't expect a tunnel to be themed immensely. Especially one that was taking you to an undersea scientific research center. What could they have done better then in your opinion. (not bashing btw just curious).

I already mentioned it, make the ride to Seabase Alpha a real adventure, including a lot of effects and different sets but not a movie but scientific basis. Especially the deep sea section would have offered tremendous possibilities.
 

Tim Lohr

Well-Known Member
I already mentioned it, make the ride to Seabase Alpha a real adventure, including a lot of effects and different sets but not a movie but scientific basis. Especially the deep sea section would have offered tremendous possibilities.

Oh ok, I think I finally understand what you guys are talking about, it's the tone or the mood, of the Nemo show that feels wrong to you

I feel the same way about the Universe of Energy, not that I have anything against Ellen, but the original show had these very dramatic "documentary" style films at the beginning and end, when they changed it, they turned it into a "sit-com" type format.

Although the information in both shows is basically the same, the change in the presentation from "documentary" to "sit-com" was a little too drastic for me personally, is that what you're saying about the Living Seas?
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
The Seas With Nemo and Friends is an irrelevant joke. The Living Seas was a flawless themed formula for an attraction. It brought you into its story, brought you into the future, enlightened guests, and made you feel like you were really off to the ocean floor to make discoveries. It's tragic. That pre-show gave me goosebumps. Imagine a world where we have spent less time than on the surface of the moon... An overhaul could have enhanced it tremendously with state of the art effects, new aquarium features, etc. But instead we got clam-mobiles. Gee, how inspiring.
All true and all lost on the average mindless guest looking for the next roller coaster.
 

Krack

Active Member
610077642_8ff189bb6a.jpg


Anything built (or changed, or altered, or created) for this park should aspire to this dedication.
 

thelookingglass

Well-Known Member
The Seas With Nemo and Friends is an irrelevant joke. The Living Seas was a flawless themed formula for an attraction.
If it was flawless, then it wouldn't have failed as an attraction.

I know what you mean, it had a cohesive theme and a creative element with Seabase Alpha. But I think you guys are looking at the ride through rose-colored glasses a bit. After all, what was the actual ride? A very short trip through the aquarium which you could see better by walking around Seabase anyway.
 

Krack

Active Member
If it was flawless, then it wouldn't have failed as an attraction.

I know what you mean, it had a cohesive theme and a creative element with Seabase Alpha. But I think you guys are looking at the ride through rose-colored glasses a bit. After all, what was the actual ride? A very short trip through the aquarium which you could see better by walking around Seabase anyway.

I love how every building in EPCOT Center "failed as an attraction" (World of Motion, Horizons, pre-Ellen UoE, the Living Seas, Cronkite Spaceship Earth, Cranium Command, Body Wars, Kitchen Kabaret, El Rio del Tiempo), yet EPCOT Center had the #2 or #3 largest attendance (after MK and Disneyland) of any theme park in America for decades. It was the world's most attended "failed" theme park. :animwink:
 

Spike-in-Berlin

Well-Known Member
If it was flawless, then it wouldn't have failed as an attraction.

I know what you mean, it had a cohesive theme and a creative element with Seabase Alpha. But I think you guys are looking at the ride through rose-colored glasses a bit. After all, what was the actual ride? A very short trip through the aquarium which you could see better by walking around Seabase anyway.

That's the point! A quite good queue (at 80ies standards however), a very good pre-show and then came what? I have it on video, the section of the ride was cut to a few seconds by me because really nothing happened.
Obviously it wasn't flawless.
 

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