Surge Pricing Holding Up (Semi) Annual Increase ...

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
If the park is at a 10, I have no problem with Disney discouraging walk-ups by raising the price for a single day ticket. It makes it a better experience for those who have planned a longer trip.
How about management and the BoD making substantial long term investments in expanding capacity and the quality of the offerings at the parks not called the Magic Kingdom? Iger and Radulo have put WDW in a ten year hole and projects like Avatar and SWL and TSL are just beginning to fill that hole in.
 

indyumd

Well-Known Member
How about management and the BoD making substantial long term investments in expanding capacity and the quality of the offerings at the parks not called the Magic Kingdom?

Isn't that what they are doing?

I'm still not against surge pricing walk-ups. I realize that is probably sacrilegious to the 40 year WDW vets, but the parks are so crowded that I really don't have a problem making walk-ups pay more during Spring Break than in mid January.
 

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
The accidents at Disneyland's Columbia and Big Thunder Railroad that were, through a "chain of dominoes" were the result of an environment of cost-cutting at Disneyland.

The Columbia was the result of a untrained manager (because attraction leads had been eliminated) trying to tie up the ship, that was coming in too fast, operated by a CM not following SOP, with the wrong type of line installed on a ship that had rotting in the area of the cleat that failed due to lack of maintenance. A guest was hit by the cleat and died.

The Big Thunder incident was the result of a maintenance worker improperly securing a fastener, and not following preventative maintenance checks. Attraction personal noticed something was wrong and tagged the train for inspection, but it was allowed to operate. The train partially derailed and the front passenger car impacted the engine.
There was also a child whose restraint on Roger Rabbit wasn't checked at dispatch who fell out of the car and suffered permanent brain damage.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/01/post-4.html
 

John

Well-Known Member
It doesn't take the Marx brothers. Innovation and revolution is simply not predictable or provable. Well, it's predictable that something "new" will come along, but not what it will be, nor how the audience will respond. I like to use Sears as an example, because they were such a powerful brand and retail leader. But they did not view Walmart as a threat. And they decided to abandon their mail-order business in 1993, a mere 1 YEAR before Amazon.com would be founded and become the undisputed king of the mail-order business, although it looks radically different from the catalogs of old. Coke researched the heck out of New Coke, and their customers still rejected it. That wasn't because they were stupid. Look at the outrage over the alleged statement by executives at the first vendor meeting about the inclusion of female characters in TFA product. They brought data to say don't do it, and the marketplace reacted differently. That hurt Disney and its brand. As Parentof4 said, sometimes it is more art than science. And if you fail to include the possibility that art knows better, you will continue to be blindsided. Yes, do all the data mining, but remain mindful that at some point you might have to said, "this does or doesn't feel right regardless of what the numbers say today."

Absolutely correct....the road to the top is littered with such companies.....ever hear of a company named Kodak? They did all the R&D on the product that eventually killed them off. I am sure they did all the data mining ect. I have to believe that somewhere along the way that they went with a "gut" feeling on the decision ( or did they? ) not to go forward with digital and payed dearly. They misread the market, misread the customer. After more then a hundred years building the brand, with one fell swoop they ran off the road.
 

bhg469

Well-Known Member
I picked a bad thread to read before going to bed..

It's really just sad at what this place has become. I'd be all for a ticket book type system but only if the front gate was a reasonable price, which is most definitely is not. I for one would pay to enter the parks and not ride anything at DAK.. I really hope this backfires but it wont. People will go, regardless of the cost and they will only over extend their credit to do so.
 

Unplugged

Well-Known Member
Maybe it's just my personality. I'll take science over art any day. If I want someone to make a decision that impacts business on such a drastic level, I want it done with all the facts possible, not on a gut feeling.

Well, I get your point, having an engineering and analytics background myself. However, Disney is an art company; animation, movies, TV, music, themed parks, it's all art. People come for the art of Disney. There are many things in Disney that require a gut feeling to make even fairly wise decisions on, which have extremely huge long term impacts. Disney is a brand all about characters. How great a movie, animation, or character's potential value is, cannot be completely or correctly determined through any exact science or analytic s.These types of successes drive the Disney brand over the long term and turn million dollar wins into billion dollar wins. As was stated about Frozen, it was in the dumps with serious issues 17 months prior to release. There is no analysis (from a factual or mathematical point) that could have told the creating team what to correct to make it a billion dollar success. It all was a gut feeling on what worked and what didn't. What made characters lovable or even memorable.

So, while I get and respect your intent, I'm sure you would agree that there is actually a balance between art & analytics that make Disney a success. When that balance gets out of whack by either an artist refuses to consider costs, or by an analyst who can't see the art past the number, then the model fails. (Your opinions are welcome on this. I'm finding it quite interesting, assuming I have time to keep following.)
 

sshindel

The Epcot Manifesto
You say the executives get promoted because of results, but Bob Chapek has no experience in Parks and Resorts. The last wunderkind to make the leap from Consumer Products to Parks and Resorts (for the same sort of reasons) was Paul Pressler.
I say in my experience. I don't know Bob Chapek from Bob the Builder. I don't follow the leadership at TDWC and what they have done in their career, mostly because aside from very broad strokes, we do not know what they have actually done in their career, so I have nothing to base the judgement on.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Good. Raise prices more. The parks are too crowded. They should raise them and raise them until they feel some resistance from the market.

Really? See, I keep hearing about the crowds breathlessly overwhelming WDW and I don't see it. And my friends who work at WDW are not seeing it either. Now, I don't visit during the two weeks around Christmas or Easter, but pretty much any other time of year ... in other words, not Tuesdays in September. I don't see these mythic crowds.

What you see is one park that has become overcrowded a large chunk (but by no means all the time) of the time. And three others that often 'feel' crowded because of the removal of these little distractions ... what are they called? Oh yeah ... attractions. Plus seasonal events at EPCOT that now run almost three quarters of the year and clog up the walkways with booths and pop up bars.

There is fan community mantra that is being held up that "no one goes to WDW anymore because it's so busy" and that just isn't reality. Put attractions back in the two parks that have very few, add them to the park that opened without enough and keep adding to the MK (without subtracting) and you've solved the perceived crowd problem. Oh, one that is also exponentially worse when huge queues aren't utilised as designed (think Space Mountain, Splash Mountain, Pirates etc) because you've added a system to make reservations while sitting on your sofa at home.

What WDW is doing is continuing something that Iger and Staggs and Kalogridis should be pummelled for: constantly cutting that olive from the salad in hopes of some crazy 'on paper' savings that can never be proven. It doesn't take a rocket scientist or even a high school diploma to figure out if you go from two Fantasmic showings during busy periods to one that you are making the park-going experience much more unpleasant and much less of a value to Guests.

Any of you talk to Soup & Salad Sandra about the Sentinel's PR work for WDW? She does better work than Dr. Blondie and she doesn't even throw cupcake parties!
 

BrianV

Well-Known Member
As the old saying goes, "no one goes there anymore, it's too crowded!"

Until people stop coming in record numbers every year, wdw would be silly NOT to raise prices as much as possible every year. There is a breaking point, but where that is is uncertain. If and when Star Wars land ever opens, they will see a huge spike in attendance. (Not sure there will be a spike from avatar land though I can't wait to see it.)

Don't get me wrong, I would like for prices to stay low. But a limited supply and high demand product tends to have a high price.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
And why do I have a note that says "Don't bother with your thread, it's become people making excuses for Disney as usual"?

Have the last 15 years not taught anyone anything?

This just isn't the WDW of 1971-2000. It is some bastardized version that most of the bloggers/lifestylers/podcasters somehow think is the same or better when it is a vastly lower quality, higher cost experience.

And just wait for the surge pricing ... you ain't seen nothing yet. But hey, the MK is getting a new stage show for the first time in a decade (won't point out that in Tokyo they get multiple new shows annually).
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Then can someone explain why the parks are busier than ever and more expensive than ever? Just curious.

Stupidity. People who like the Walmarted version of Disney. BRAND addicts who treat WDW with religious zealotry. People who came when it was better and have a hard time with the fact that it has fallen so much. DVCers. All sorts ...
 

BrianV

Well-Known Member
And why do I have a note that says "Don't bother with your thread, it's become people making excuses for Disney as usual"?

Have the last 15 years not taught anyone anything?

This just isn't the WDW of 1971-2000. It is some bastardized version that most of the bloggers/lifestylers/podcasters somehow think is the same or better when it is a vastly lower quality, higher cost experience.

And just wait for the surge pricing ... you ain't seen nothing yet. But hey, the MK is getting a new stage show for the first time in a decade (won't point out that in Tokyo they get multiple new shows annually).

What do you want us to say?!? I think people agree. But attendance estimates tend to show higher numbers year after year. Maybe I'm mistaken or maybe those are manipulated.

We go far less often these days and our last three trips to orlando have been exclusively to universal and we stayed on site there. But there seem to be enough people making up for our loss...we agree and we have voted with our wallets.
 

Brad Bishop

Well-Known Member
I could see them making you pay an up-charge for M&Gs. They've already done that with their MNSSHP deal (which is a kind of up-charge in and of itself).

You want your little princess to meet an actual
There are smaller parks, like Silver Dollar City, that are very nice and reasonably priced, plus are located in some beautiful parts of the country. Worth looking into.

Dollywood (Pigeon Forge, TN) and Busch Gardens Williamsburg are also very nice.
 

seascape

Well-Known Member
So we don't even know what the percentage increase is and we have 9 pages of complaints in a few hours. Yet Universal raises its 2 pay park to park ticket 13% and only a couple of complaints. Come on. Both these companies charge to much but people keep going. If you want value for your money go to the regional parks with a season ticket. You can buy both Six Flags and Cedar Fair season passes with meals for less than Disney's season pass. So what if you enjoy WDW go and stop complaining. If you think its too high a price then complain once and for all and stop going.

If you decide to pay then pay and stop complaining. The money you or I pay is our money to do with as we please. Its our money and not anyone elses until we give it to them. If you own a DVC and don't want to go anymore then you should sell it on the resale market and buy another offsite timeshare on EBay. You can then stay off site at a bigger timeshare and pay less in fees than DVC charges. You will even make a few thousand dollars.
 

Brad Bishop

Well-Known Member
Absolutely correct....the road to the top is littered with such companies.....ever hear of a company named Kodak? They did all the R&D on the product that eventually killed them off. I am sure they did all the data mining ect. I have to believe that somewhere along the way that they went with a "gut" feeling on the decision ( or did they? ) not to go forward with digital and payed dearly. They misread the market, misread the customer. After more then a hundred years building the brand, with one fell swoop they ran off the road.

From what I remember reading about Kodak: Yes, they did all of the research on digital cameras but some bean counter saw how much money they'd be losing by eliminating the selling of rolls of film, the processing, the prints, etc. (imagine all of the expensive equipment that they sell to do all of the back-end printing). I think the idea was that it'd be absolutely foolish to cannibalize that huge section of the company so the "smart" move was to let the digital side languish.
 

SYRIK2000

Well-Known Member
I'm surprised they haven't added an upcharge for FastPasses.

Maybe even a Platinum Level admission, They can charge $200-$400 a day and allow you to use the fastpass lane for all rides. Think how much they could make with that. Plenty of of people would spend the money to avoid the line.
 

ParentsOf4

Well-Known Member
So we don't even know what the percentage increase is and we have 9 pages of complaints in a few hours. Yet Universal raises its 2 pay park to park ticket 13% and only a couple of complaints.
I guess it means we care a heck of a lot more about what happens at WDW than we do about what happens at Universal; shocking for a WDW fansite. :rolleyes:
If you decide to pay then pay and stop complaining.
Right, because in a market based economy, paying customers have absolutely no right to express their opinions about products or services they are actually paying for. :facepalm:
 

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