Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Ep 8). SPOILERS. Plot points revealed and discussed.

[MisterPenguin]

I think this pretty much sums it up.



The highlights, or low lights, from Mark Hamill himself...
"It doesn't matter if it's good as long as it makes money."
“He’s not my Luke Skywalker...”
"I said to him, Rian, the Jedis don't give up."
"I disagree with virtually everything you decided about my character."
"I said to Rian, I'm so surprised how you see Luke."
"It's only a movie. And if you think your're going to go into the movie and recapture your childhood you're setting yourself up for disappointment."
"I saw TFA the first time at the first screening he (George Lucas) was at. When I saw him I gave him a hug and whispered in his ear, 'It will never be the same.'"

Everything he said was right.

1. Mark is 100% wrong on his take of how the Jedi don't hide or give up. His character dealt with Obi Wan and Yoda who were in hiding.

2. Mark is really just an actor. Not the first time an actor disagreed with what their character was doing, but, he's just an actor.

 

[fractal]

1. Mark is 100% wrong on his take of how the Jedi don't hide or give up. His character dealt with Obi Wan and Yoda who were in hiding.

2. Mark is really just an actor. Not the first time an actor disagreed with what their character was doing, but, he's just an actor.

When Leia asked Kenobi to help he didn't hesitate. Yoda also never gave up. Yes he went into hiding after the war was lost, but never gave up and was an invaluable part of bringing down the Empire.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

Obi-Wan was in hiding for 20 years! Yoda was in hiding until the time of ESB, and never did anything more direct than train Luke for a while. Luke's story is much like Obi-Wan's... went into hiding for a long time, and gave their lives in one last heroic act. Luke gave the time for the rebels to get away. Obi-Wan gave time/distraction for the Falcon to get away; Obi-Wan didn't blow up the Death Star single-handedly with the Jedi mind trick.

 

[tk924]

Obi-Wan and Yoda went into hiding for very different reasons than Luke. They were not giving up, just waiting for the right moment to get Luke in the game.

 

[bclane]

Obi-Wan and Yoda went into hiding for very different reasons than Luke. They were not giving up, just waiting for the right moment to get Luke in the game.

Luke had a rough life. His mother died soon after he was was born. He finds out his father is Darth Vader. His aunt and uncle where barbecue’d. He made out with his sister. He has to go try and kill hos own Dad. His father cuts off his hand. Years after setting his daddy on fire, he tries to start a Jedi school only to push his sister and best friends son to the Dark side in the processs (in his mind) who then burns down his school and kills a bunch of his padawan learners. He of course blames himself for a lot of this and fears the dark side taking hold of him. I’d run away from all of it too if I was him.

 

[fractal]

Luke had a rough life. His mother died soon after he was was born. He finds out his father is Darth Vader. His aunt and uncle where barbecue’d. He made out with his sister. He has to go try and kill hos own Dad. His father cuts off his hand. Years after setting his daddy on fire, he tries to start a Jedi school only to push his sister and best friends son to the Dark side in the processs (in his mind) who then burns down his school and kills a bunch of his padawan learners. He of course blames himself for a lot of this and fears the dark side taking hold of him. I’d run away from all of it too if I was him.

yeah, and let your nephew slaughter billions of people. Luke was easily the most optimistic character in the entire sage. He risked his life to save a Princess, then the rebel base. Then he risked his life to save his friends (against Yoda and Kenobi's advise) and take on Vader while being clearly outmatched. He risked his life again to save his friends, redeem his Father (Luke was the only one to see the good in Vader) by facing Vader and The Emperor! He then basically threw down he lightsaber in front of the most evil and powerful person in the galaxy, having that much faith that the good in Vader would save him.

Then Rian Johnson crappps all over that and turns Luke into a complete coward loser that gives up instantly on Ben and actually decides to murder him, in cold blood, in his sleep! Give me a flukin break.

 

[bclane]

yeah, and let your nephew slaughter billions of people. Luke was easily the most optimistic character in the entire sage. He risked his life to save a Princess, then the rebel base. Then he risked his life to save his friends (against Yoda and Kenobi's advise) and take on Vader while being clearly outmatched. He risked his life again to save his friends, redeem his Father (Luke was the only one to see the good in Vader) by facing Vader and The Emperor! He then basically threw down he lightsaber in front of the most evil and powerful person in the galaxy, having that much faith that the good in Vader would save him.

Then Rian Johnson crappps all over that and turns Luke into a complete coward loser that gives up instantly on Ben and actually decides to murder him, in cold blood, in his sleep! Give me a flukin break.

Imo, Luke has always been impulsive. He only considered killing Ben for a moment and then saw the error of his ways and was horrified. Seeing this darkness within him is part of the reason he went into exhile. Real hero’s are flawed. In the end, he basically became the most powerful Jedi that has ever lived and the hero the galaxy needed. And I don’t think Luke’s story is finished. No one ever really dies in that galaxy far far away...

 

[smile]

2. Mark is really just an actor. Not the first time an actor disagreed with what their character was doing, but, he's just an actor.

i'm of the opinion nobody, sans maybe george, knew luke better than mark...
i mean, he was him - a contemporary icon who actually impacted mark's life more than anyone else.

if nothing else, i certainly would have given his opinion some weight -
and he's a little wonky, granted, but he's far from some dumb actor.

especially considering rian had carte blanche to write whatever, not having some outline to follow... he actually had carrie write bits of script, c'mon now

 

[Cosmic Commando]

Then Rian Johnson crappps all over that and turns Luke into a complete coward loser that gives up instantly on Ben and actually decides to murder him, in cold blood, in his sleep! Give me a flukin break.

I think part of the blame has to go to JJ there. What good reason would the eternal optimist Luke, the one who flew to Bespin with Yoda and Obi-Wan telling him he would ruin everything, have to exile himself like that? If Luke grabbed the lightsaber and was real gung ho about training Rey and re-joining the fight, it would have been totally contrary to the setup that Rian was handed.

 

[bclane]

I think part of the blame has to go to JJ there. What good reason would the eternal optimist Luke, the one who flew to Bespin with Yoda and Obi-Wan telling him he would ruin everything, have to exile himself like that? If Luke grabbed the lightsaber and was real gung ho about training Rey and re-joining the fight, it would have been totally contrary to the setup that Rian was handed.

There were many choices that Rian made that can be quite jarring to a lot of people. Mark himself was completely against the way the Luke character was written at first but then later saw how well it fits the story and has since praised both RJ and The Last Jedi. This next part might sound odd, but I’ve always compared Star Wars and Star Wars heroes to the Bible and Biblical heroes. Within its pages we often find the heroes doing things that seem completely out of character. For example, Abraham is known for his great faith and is even called the Father of the Faithful, and yet he displayed an utter lack of faith on more than one occasion. David is the “man after God’s own heart” whom God compares to a virgin because he is so pure, and yet at one point was an adulterous murderer. It’s a repeated theme in the Bible. Heroes sometimes do very unheroic things. I think that Rian provides us with fantastic example of a true hero who is also a very flawed person, who has incredible high points and just as incredible low points, but ultimately earns every bit of his reputation as someone who is worthy of our admiration and love.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

There were many choices that Rian made that can be quite jarring to a lot of people. Mark himself was completely against the way the Luke character was written at first but then later saw how well it fits the story and has since praised both RJ and The Last Jedi. This next part might sound odd, but I’ve always compared Star Wars and Star Wars heroes to the Bible and Biblical heroes. Within its pages we often find the heroes doing things that seem completely out of character. For example, Abraham is known for his great faith and is even called the Father of the Faithful, and yet he displayed an utter lack of faith on more than one occasion. David is the “man after God’s own heart” whom God compares to a virgin because he is so pure, and yet at one point was an adulterous murderer. It’s a repeated theme in the Bible. Heroes sometimes do very unheroic things. I think that Rian provides us with fantastic example of a true hero who is also a very flawed person, who has incredible high points and just as incredible low points, but ultimately earns every bit of his reputation as someone who is worthy of our admiration and love.

I should have said "blame" instead of blame. I am a little disappointed we didn't actually get to see Luke wield a lightsaber one last time, I do like what we got on screen. But my point was that if you don't like what happened to Luke, JJ is really to blame for setting it up the way he did. Unless you can come up with a better reason that Luke would be hiding on that island and completely out of contact while a new "Sith" order is rising and eventually killing billions of people.

For me, the important part is that he came around at the end. People are focusing on all of the things Luke said in the middle of the movie as if that's the "truth"; that was the bummed-out, shamed version of his character! After his pep talk with Yoda, he faces down the First Order with a laser sword, just like he said he wouldn't do in the beginning! He says he won't be the last Jedi!

 

[bclane]

I should have said "blame" instead of blame. I am a little disappointed we didn't actually get to see Luke wield a lightsaber one last time, I do like what we got on screen. But my point was that if you don't like what happened to Luke, JJ is really to blame for setting it up the way he did. Unless you can come up with a better reason that Luke would be hiding on that island and completely out of contact while a new "Sith" order is rising and eventually killing billions of people.

For me, the important part is that he came around at the end. People are focusing on all of the things Luke said in the middle of the movie as if that's the "truth"; that was the bummed-out, shamed version of his character! After his pep talk with Yoda, he faces down the First Order with a laser sword, just like he said he wouldn't do in the beginning! He says he won't be the last Jedi!

Yeah I agree. My hope was that he would Force crush the First Order heavy machinery and then have an epic old school laser sword battle with Kylo Ren. We didn’t get that...but I still love what was put on screen.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Pitch meetings...

 

[fractal]

So reading the recent comments, are we to believe that the trilogy is just being made up as we go? JJ comes up with something then next guy up just takes it from there with his own story? So there’s no real overriding story?

They should have taken their queue from Marvel and used existing EU stories instead of just winging it. As I sit here watching TFA it becomes clear that there never was a broad blueprint for the trilogy. More like “Let’s make some cool looking Star Wars movies!”

 

[fractal]

Just realizing that Rian Johnson not only cr*pped all over Luke, but also Poe. Poe goes from brave soldier, talented pilot that leads the resitance and destroys Starkiller base and saves millions of lives to “fly boy” that screws everything up.

I wonder how many kids threw away their black X-wing after watching TLJ?

 

[smile]

kk stated the aren't really rolling with character arcs, and are more coming from a place of where they do what they want to do or say and figure how the characters come into that way...
as if we couldn't just merely watch tlj and notice, but i digress.

More like “Let’s make some cool looking Star Wars movies!”

have a very hard time thinking that's not the case - gl never made em that way, and i can feel it.
suppose i could view it as the bubble-gum pop it was always claimed to be, but i never quite saw it as such.

 

[MisterPenguin]

TLJ is now at $1,308.2 million. That's a 63.3% drop off from TFA.

That just nudges past AotC (Ep 2)'s drop off from TPM (Ep 1) which was 63.2%.

Needs $33 million more to pass Deathly Hallows 2 for number 8 spot of B.O. of all time worldwide.

TLJ is at the number 6 spot domestically of all time and needs $16 million more to jump to 5.

 

[fractal]

They're giving away The Last Jedi toys.

 

[tk924]

They're giving away The Last Jedi toys.

I wouldn't take any TLJ toy even if it was free.



Oh, and here's the Star Wars 9 Crawl That Fixes Every Last Jedi Problem



.

 

[tk924]

And here's another SW actor who's questioning their role in TLJ. Or in this case, lack thereof.

Gwendoline Christie fears for Phasma's future

... I really want to see this character explored.

Yes, Gwendoline. So do the rest of us.

I'm actually very invested in the character now.

So were we.

It has opened up a chain of stories and events in my mind about who Phasma is.

Yep, same here. Guess we'll never know.