fractal
Well-Known Member
I honestly think Rian Johnson forgot about Phasma - then concocted the Finn/Rose adventure to get her in the movie, then killed her off so he wouldn't have to bother with her again.
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Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Ep 8). SPOILERS. Plot points revealed and discussed.
- Thread starter MisterPenguin
- Start date
I honestly think Rian Johnson forgot about Phasma - then concocted the Finn/Rose adventure to get her in the movie, then killed her off so he wouldn't have to bother with her again.
Wendy Pleakley
Well-Known Member
There had to have been a bit of a plan in terms of how the trilogy would play out. After Carrie Fisher died they talked about a planned confrontation between her and Kylo Ren. It sounds like there was at minimum an idea of how their story might play out.
It seems odd that Rian has nothing to do with the next film's story. Why not have him and JJ sit down and discuss where they both see the story going? JJ made a film that was fun and crowd pleasing, but played it a bit too safe. Rian made a film that shook things up in a lot of ways, but didn't have the same broad appeal. Put those two together and craft something that combines the strengths of both.
It seems odd that Rian has nothing to do with the next film's story. Why not have him and JJ sit down and discuss where they both see the story going? JJ made a film that was fun and crowd pleasing, but played it a bit too safe. Rian made a film that shook things up in a lot of ways, but didn't have the same broad appeal. Put those two together and craft something that combines the strengths of both.
Wendy Pleakley
Well-Known Member
Captain Phasma feels like a case of fans getting obsessed with a character that was never necessarily meant to be more than what she was, and getting upset over their self-generated expectations not being met.
I like the character and actress, and I would have been happy to see the character do more, but I don't think it's required or necessary. Having memorable characters that play a very small role helps the Star Wars universe feel more expansive.
Similar to Boba Fett. A minor character who was deemed "cool" by the fanbase, and resulted in the Fett family become way more important than was necessary in Attack of the Clones. Revisionist history that felt like pandering.
I like the character and actress, and I would have been happy to see the character do more, but I don't think it's required or necessary. Having memorable characters that play a very small role helps the Star Wars universe feel more expansive.
Similar to Boba Fett. A minor character who was deemed "cool" by the fanbase, and resulted in the Fett family become way more important than was necessary in Attack of the Clones. Revisionist history that felt like pandering.
doctornick
Well-Known Member
As Jumanji wins another weekend at the box office, it makes me wonder: how much of TLJ's "weak legs" is more the result of a strong breakout competitor in Jumanji taking away potential viewers? Nobody expected Jumanji to perform the way it has done and it seemed to pick up steam and hype right around when TLJ was having significant drops.
I don't recall either TFA or Rogue One having such well performing competition at the box office. Admittedly, there could be a chicken and an egg effect -- maybe Jumanji has performed well because of the mixed reception for TLJ -- but the path Jumanji took at the box office was quite atypical and more like a hit that benefited by great word of mouth which suggests to me that audiences just liked it and recommended it to friends to see.
I don't recall either TFA or Rogue One having such well performing competition at the box office. Admittedly, there could be a chicken and an egg effect -- maybe Jumanji has performed well because of the mixed reception for TLJ -- but the path Jumanji took at the box office was quite atypical and more like a hit that benefited by great word of mouth which suggests to me that audiences just liked it and recommended it to friends to see.
Wendy Pleakley
Well-Known Member
I think it had a big impact. Competition for The Force Awakens was minimal, and the biggest family friendly movie release around that time was an Alvin and the Chipmunks movie, which was not a big hit.
The Last Jedi, which I liked, did feel a bit long and exhausting. I can see how younger audience members in particular didn't have an appetite for repeat viewings. I imagine in 2015 many families saw the Force Awakens more than once. It was a "safe" movie with broad appeal, and what else was there to see? In contrast, I imagine more people felt that once was enough for TLJ and that choice was made easier by having an alternate choice with broad appeal.
"Weak legs" is only in comparison to TFA. It was number one for 2017, number six domestically of all time, number 9 worldwide of all time.
There were quite a few people here on these forums who didn't like TLJ and were counting their schadenfreude before it hatched when the initial B.O. numbers weren't that astounding because of how Christmas fell this year. But, a month and a half later, it is still setting records. It had legs. Now all they have is to point to the China numbers and ignore the rest of the world.
erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
In my opinion I think the fan reaction was totally warranted. I believe she was ment to be more but Rian decided to throw out what JJ was doing. You don't put her front and center of ALL the marketing if you have no plans for her. Its the same thing with Reys parents. It was a big deal because they made it be one. All you had to do was give her a last name and all the speculation goes away. Instead you are all secretive then decide, well it doesn't matter, they're no body, then wonder why people had a problem. The same can be said for Snoke as well.
Wendy Pleakley
Well-Known Member
What was JJ doing with Phasma that was discarded? The character only came about because they had a cool costume idea that was rejected for Kylo Ren. She appears onscreen for a few minutes in TFA. She wasn't important or significant.
Don't blame the filmmakers for the marketing department over-hyping her, and don't be surprised when a movie's marketing plays something up to be bigger than it is, in order to sell more tickets.
At the risk of rehashing the Snoke/Rey issue, the importance of their respective backstories was fueled and over-hyped by excessive speculation from the beginning.
"Who are you?"
"I'm no one."
"OMG she must be the illegitimate love child of Obi-Wan and Mon Mothma, her significant backstory is going to be the greatest reveal in the history of Star Wars!"
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21stamps
Well-Known Member
erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
And don't blame the fans then either. I'm sure lucas film had to approve the marketing and any idiot could have known what fans would do when you "play things up to sell more tickets". Look, its plain and simple, lots of things were played up in the marketing and were shrouded in mystery, so you can't blame the fans for being upset for it all being just thow away. As for Rey, JJ himself said they left her last name off to hide her identify because they didn't want us to know. Thats not anyones fault but the film makers. I loved TFA and really liked last jedi but I get why people had problems with how things were handled.
fractal
Well-Known Member
Equity analysts overall disappointed with TLJ ticket sales and very glum on toy sales.
https://www.investors.com/news/disn...hadow-espn-subscribers/?src=A00220&yptr=yahoo
https://www.investors.com/news/as-star-wars-cools-will-black-panther-reinvigorate-disney/
Disney's last mega-hit, "Star Wars: The Last Jedi," has raked in $1.31 billion at the global box office since its mid-December release, making it the ninth highest-grossing movie of all time, according to Box Office Mojo.
But its total haul is looking to fall short of some analyst hopes — the movie had a lackluster premiere in China, where the Lucasfilm anthology is not as well known, and winter hit "Jumanji" wound up overtaking "Last Jedi" domestically at the start of the year. Sales of "Star Wars" toys have also disappointed, says Bloomberg.
https://www.investors.com/news/disn...hadow-espn-subscribers/?src=A00220&yptr=yahoo
https://www.investors.com/news/as-star-wars-cools-will-black-panther-reinvigorate-disney/
Disney's last mega-hit, "Star Wars: The Last Jedi," has raked in $1.31 billion at the global box office since its mid-December release, making it the ninth highest-grossing movie of all time, according to Box Office Mojo.
But its total haul is looking to fall short of some analyst hopes — the movie had a lackluster premiere in China, where the Lucasfilm anthology is not as well known, and winter hit "Jumanji" wound up overtaking "Last Jedi" domestically at the start of the year. Sales of "Star Wars" toys have also disappointed, says Bloomberg.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
That's fake news...not even possible.
93% of critics that were invited to the Hollywood premiere staged by Disney (with booze and likely narcotics in aerosol form pumped through the HVAC) agreed within 48 hours that is was "possibly the best one ever"...the amount of head scratching by fans on damn near everything that did and didn't happen in the movie, the actors criticism (then redacted), and the director warring on twitter daily is all an elaborate illusion from a conspiracy hatched by Brian Roberts and Jeffrey katzenberg.
smile
Well-Known Member
analysts are only disappointed because they didn't get what they were expecting - the ol' nostalgia googles, no doubt...
everyone i know thinks it's the greatest thing since sliced porg!
We know China wasn't into it (despite the rest of the world actually being very into it).
We know that it didn't do more than what some had hoped (it's actually rare for any movie to far exceed expectations, and who doesn't hope for the best?) even though it broke a lot of records.
We know that SW merch sales are down (despite it still being the largest toy franchise of this past holiday season).
We know that Jumanji was strong and beat SW weeks after it was release (but not the first two weeks Jumanji was released).
This ain't news. It's a rehash of straws the haters grasp at.
Did TLJ kill your brother or something?
fractal
Well-Known Member
It is new in that Disney's earnings came out yesterday and a lot of the chatter among analysts was the "soft" numbers from TLJ and the fan reaction. The feeling was that any home movie they put up there would have made $1billion and there is real concern over the long term damage TLJ may have made to future box office receipts. I think we will find out over the next year or so just how much Disney is truly committed to Kathleen Kennedy and Rian Johnson because Wall Street has its doubts.