Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Ep 8). SPOILERS. Plot points revealed and discussed.

[LukeS7]

I highlighted the relevant part. Newsflash, if this movie is at a $7.5 million loss after ONE weekend, it's doing stunningly well.

Oh, also, NEWSFLASH, if we go with the more realistic estimate of $400 million production/advertising cost, it's a $107.5 million loss for Disney, still "doing stunningly well"?

 

[Gomer]

As one critic said "making it up as they go along".

As far as the "miniaturized" Death Star Tech - wasn't the Death Star tech all about sucking the power from a star? I didn't see any star sucking - even a little bit. Maybe it was sucking the life out of Star Wars mythology, certainly seemed like lazy story telling to me.

Death Star pulls power from Kyber Crystal (same crystals used in lightsabers). Starkiller is the one that pulls from the sun.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

You really can't stop with the whole "I was completely incorrect but I'm still right" thing, can you?

I said that it was an overstatement on my part to say the movie was profitable based on the opening weekend alone. I said that estimates the movie cost in the $400 million range sounded right.

So, I don't know why you would say this.

Your numbers, if anywhere near to being accurate, show this movie to be successful at a level most movies could only dream of.

 

[Gomer]

Oh, also, NEWSFLASH, if we go with the more realistic estimate of $400 million production/advertising cost, it's a $107.5 million loss for Disney, still "doing stunningly well"?

We do all remember the movie has been out only a week right? I think it will still make a few more bucks before it starts collecting dust in the bargain bin at best buy.

 

[fractal]

Another complaint that took away from the movie (for me). Several times it seemed like all the characters in the movie had actually watched and were aware of the previous SW movies. The whole "Rebel Scum" talk for one was an eye rolling scene.

 

[fractal]

Death Star pulls power from Kyber Crystal (same crystals used in lightsabers). Starkiller is the one that pulls from the sun.

Ah yes, I stand corrected. Hard to keep the planet killing machines straight sometimes.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Oh, also, NEWSFLASH, if we go with the more realistic estimate of $400 million production/advertising cost, it's a $107.5 million loss for Disney, still "doing stunningly well"?

Yes. Absolutely, yes.

Tell me the movie lost $107.5 million two months from now and I'll give you a different number.

The movie took in over $20 million a day on Monday and Tuesday. Add in worldwide grosses and this "loss" will be gone by the end of the week.

 

[fractal]

Yes. Absolutely, yes.

Tell me the movie lost $107.5 million two months from now and I'll give you a different number.

The movie took in over $20 million a day on Monday and Tuesday. Add in worldwide grosses and this "loss" will be gone by the end of the week.

But again, that's not what you said. Nobody here said it was going to lose money.

 

[spacemt354]

And you managed to cherry pick the one thing from my post that benefits your argument and ignore everything else while at the same time mislabeling that detail. That's not in one weekend, that's to-date. It's also the estimate that's less realistic. If you want just opening weekend, that puts the gross at $450 million worldwide, meaning $292.5 million for Disney, meaning even with the low-ball estimate for the production budget, it puts the movie at a $7.5 million loss.

But I suppose that was obvious too, right? In the future, maybe don't ask for evidence then misquote it when you're provided it

List of Top Domestic Box-Office All-Time
Adjusted for 2017 Inflation

2 - Star Wars - $1,590,608,000
11 - The Force Awakens - $965,467,800
13 - Empire Strikes Back - $876,753,100
16 - Return of the Jedi - $839,950,500
18 - Episode I: The Phantom Menace - $806,486,800
57 - Rogue One: A Star Wars Story - $539,743,700
64 - Episode III: Revenge of the Sith - $529,768,500
94 - Episode II: Attack of the Clones - $477,473,400

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm

First off -- All 8 live-action Star Wars films (I don't count the animated one) are in the top 100 adjusted domestic box office of all time. That's beyond successful.

Secondly, despite the franchise's success, note the significant drop off between first installments in a trilogy and its follow up film.

The Phantom Menace to Attack of the Clones saw a $329,013,400 adjusted revenue difference. A 41% decline
Star Wars to Empire Strikes Back saw a $713,854,900 adjusted revenue difference. A 45% decline.

When looked at through a narrow lens, people will compare The Force Awakens totals to The Last Jedi totals, and claim that it is not living up to 'expectations'.

The Last Jedi will make Disney plenty of money in the long run. Currently, it is not keeping pace with The Force Awakens, nor do I expect it to ever catch up based on past trends.

 

[bclane]

You missed the point... if it wasn't an huge commitment by the empire... losing it wouldn't be a big deal.... and the audience wouldn't care... because the empire wouldn't care as much either.

The comment wasn't to call it the hq... the point was in storytelling you need the empire to have a lot on the line as well... or there is no tension.

Maybe I missed your point. I’m honestly not sure...but my post was also initiated by some of the other comments about the Death Star’s significance to the Empire. But I do think stories can be tense without all sides having as much on the line. The Empire Strikes Back was pretty lopsided in the sense that it looked pretty bleak for the Rebellion for pretty much the entire movie and yet it’s intensity was palpable...at least for me.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Uh... that's what regardless means - to ignore .. "without concern" or without paying attention to. That's what it means to ignore.../QUOTE]

I clarified what I meant, and regardless may not have been the right word to use, but by all means focus in on that so you can dismiss my comments outright, sounding hostile as usual.

 

[Gomer]

Maybe I missed your point. I’m honestly not sure...but my post was also initiated by some of the other comments about the Death Star’s significance to the Empire. But I do think stories can be tense without all sides having as much on the line. The Empire Strikes Back was pretty lopsided in the sense that it looked pretty bleak for the Rebellion for pretty much the entire movie and yet it’s intensity was palpable...at least for me.

Just to piggy back, there's also something to be said for emotional weight to the character. In Empire, as with TLJ, alot of the plot threads are important because they are important to the character and the character's development, even if they are relatively insignificant in to blowing up a death star or killing an Emperor.

A story must have significance, but that significance is not limited to just plot significance.

 

[bclane]

As one critic said "making it up as they go along".

As far as the "miniaturized" Death Star Tech - wasn't the Death Star tech all about sucking the power from a star? I didn't see any star sucking - even a little bit. Maybe it was sucking the life out of Star Wars mythology, certainly seemed like lazy story telling to me.

No, the Death Star had nothing to do with the power of a star. It was based around kyber crystals and hypermatter. You are thinking of Starkiller base

 

[fractal]

Just to piggy back, there's also something to be said for emotional weight to the character. In Empire, as with TLJ, alot of the plot threads are important because they are important to the character and the character's development, even if they are relatively insignificant in to blowing up a death star or killing an Emperor.

A story must have significance, but that significance is not limited to just plot significance.

Exactly, so with that said how was Rey's character developed? It really wasn't except for a few more amazing powers. This movie would have been much better served if it would have scrapped the hokey nonsensical trip to Casino planet and spent more time developing Rey's character - something we all wanted. Instead we got a poorly executed, cringe worthy political message.

 

[Gomer]

Exactly, so with that said how was Rey's character developed? It really wasn't except for a few more amazing powers. This movie would have been much better served if it would have scrappy the hokey nonsensical trip to Casino planet and spend more time developing Rey's character - something we all wanted. Instead we got a poorly executed, cringe worthy political message.

Rey, as with Finn, and as with Poe's stories were all about failure and learning the dangers of hero worship. Discovering that that seemingly heroic action, while it might give you legendary status, is not always the best choice for winning the war.

Rey's story in particular was about growing up. Meeting a hero, and realizing, all heroes and villains, are just humans with good qualities and bad. People who make mistakes. She learns that parents, mentors, and heroes, if put on a pedestal, will disappoint you. Because in the end, they are flawed, and the best way to learn from them is to use their failures to gain wisdom.

She fails to recruit Luke. She fails to turn Kylo, but in the end, uses what she has learned to realize that Kylo/Ben is headed down the wrong path. That railing in anger against your elders is the path to the dark side. She learns that her purpose isn't in finding her parents or in getting Luke to save the day, but instead by using the failures of past generations to achieve wisdom and bring hope to the new resistance. To grow beyond Luke, and hopeful do what he couldn't in restoring the Jedi to the light.

 

[bclane]

Not to change the subject, but is anyone else looking forward to seeing Luke become even more powerful as a Force Ghost than he ever was in life? Since I was a kid I’ve been dying to see Obi-Wan’s words about that come to fruition. And then there is the possibility of Dark side Force ghosts. Yikes!!! And what If we get a full on Force ghost battle between Luke, Yoda, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Anakin vs. the Emperor, Snoke and whoever else etc all duking it out. Holy cow!!!

 

[LukeS7]

Not to change the subject, but is anyone else looking forward to seeing Luke become even more powerful as a Force Ghost than he ever was in life? Since I was a kid I’ve been dying to see Obi-Wan’s words about that come to fruition. And then there is the possibility of Dark side Force ghosts. Yikes!!! And what If we get a full on Force ghost battle between Luke, Yoda, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Anakin vs. the Emperor, Snoke and whoever else etc all duking it out. Holy cow!!!

I'd honestly be not interested. They're all ghosts, yes there could be consequences to the still living characters but the ones fighting would all be ones that they've already killed, so there's no true consequences to those characters which seems like a huge cope out to me

 

[LukeS7]

List of Top Domestic Box-Office All-Time
Adjusted for 2017 Inflation

2 - Star Wars - $1,590,608,000
11 - The Force Awakens - $965,467,800
13 - Empire Strikes Back - $876,753,100
16 - Return of the Jedi - $839,950,500
18 - Episode I: The Phantom Menace - $806,486,800
57 - Rogue One: A Star Wars Story - $539,743,700
64 - Episode III: Revenge of the Sith - $529,768,500
94 - Episode II: Attack of the Clones - $477,473,400

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm

First off -- All 8 live-action Star Wars films (I don't count the animated one) are in the top 100 adjusted domestic box office of all time. That's beyond successful.

Secondly, despite the franchise's success, note the significant drop off between first installments in a trilogy and its follow up film.

The Phantom Menace to Attack of the Clones saw a $329,013,400 adjusted revenue difference. A 41% decline
Star Wars to Empire Strikes Back saw a $713,854,900 adjusted revenue difference. A 45% decline.

When looked at through a narrow lens, people will compare The Force Awakens totals to The Last Jedi totals, and claim that it is not living up to 'expectations'.

The Last Jedi will make Disney plenty of money in the long run. Currently, it is not keeping pace with The Force Awakens, nor do I expect it to ever catch up based on past trends.

Something to note: these are all domestic totals, not worldwide (Revenge of the Sith, adjusted is closer to $1.1 billion adjusted for inflation worldwide. Just wanted to point it out since the prequels and Rogue One seemed much lower than expected)

 

[bclane]

I'd honestly be not interested. They're all ghosts, yes there could be consequences to the still living characters but the ones fighting would all be ones that they've already killed, so there's no true consequences to those characters which seems like a huge cope out to me

Well yah if you put it that way. I’m assuming their would be consequences for the living. Since we saw Yoda bring down lightning in TLJ, I’m thinking about how Luke and others will be used in IX. Could get very interesting!

 

[LukeS7]

Yes. Absolutely, yes.

Tell me the movie lost $107.5 million two months from now and I'll give you a different number.

The movie took in over $20 million a day on Monday and Tuesday. Add in worldwide grosses and this "loss" will be gone by the end of the week.

I'm not saying it'll lose money as a whole, I'm saying lauding it as highly profitable this soon is an overstatement. I also wouldn't qualify two numbers that are $100 million apart as both being "stunningly well" but maybe that's just me