Star Wars: Rise of the Resistance

[TalkingHead]

And look at how much more positively Falcon has been received then Hagrid’s!!!

Oh, wait...

Reviews are pouring in: “It’s sorta disappointing and kinda sucks. But at least there’s no downtime!”

 

[WDWTrojan]

Millennium Falcon, on the other hand, has had a stellar uptime.

Same can't be said for the people sleeping through it. Snooze of a ride.

 

[SplashJacket]

And look at how much more positively Falcon has been received then Hagrid’s!!!

Oh, wait...

Same can't be said for the people sleeping through it. Snooze of a ride.

I rode both rides. I was blown away by Hagrids. Millennium Falcon did not blow me away, was a great ride but far from a headliner.

Hagrid's was an absolutely exceptional attraction, undoubtedly one of the best in the world. I was absolutely blown away by it.

I was not stating that one ride is superior to the other. I was simply stating a fact. The performance Universal has put on with the uptime for Hagrids is laughable.

The Hagrids wait times are hyperinflated not solely because it is an amazing ride but primarily because of its performance issues. The ride is running at a significantly reduced capacity for a ride with an already low capacity. Additionally, the ride is only open for a small fraction of the day. The ride was closed for the first half of the day, and then it opened. Immediately when my party saw it had opened we rushed for it as due to its reputation for downtime wanted to experience it before it was too late. I assume many other people are in this same boat. It resulted in an instant surge of wait time. Shortly after we left the attraction, the ride was closed several hours prior to park closing because the wait time exceeded the park closing. I was there during the weekend which Dorian was supposed to hit, and while starting up conversations the majority of people seemed to be locals. My point for all this is, the sky-high wait times for Hagrid's were caused by the attraction's performance issues which are quite simply a poor demonstration of showmanship.

On the other hand, despite lower than expected attendance for the opening weekend, Millennium Falcon had its act together. I must make it clear, I am not, in any way, defending the ride, I am simply defending the handling of guests and Disney's demonstration of showmanship.

I was in the land for at shortly afternoon for a couple of hours and a couple of hours prior and to closing.

The attraction sat at around 90-120 minute wait while I was in the land. The line filled the entire queue and backed up past the cantina. If Disney wanted to explode the wait time they could have. Fastpasses were not being distributed and the ride was not continuously going down forcing everyone to experience it at once. I will defend next to nothing which Disney has done as of recent, but I fail to see how a ride doing its intended purpose of passing guests through it is not a positive.

 

[Tom Morrow]

It's also cool that you can, you know, get in line for Falcon up to the park closing time. Three months later and Universal still randomly decides when they will close off the line for Hagrid's, only because they do not want to schedule or pay their operations employees slightly longer. But you guys Universal doesn't ever cheap out like Disney!!!

It's also funny how everyone is being so smug that Universal released a great ride and Disney a not so great one. I guess after numerous mediocre to terrible attractions in a row, one of them has to be great, right? Y'all had nothing to say when Fallon debuted at the same time as Flight of Passage.

 

[Casper Gutman]

It's also cool that you can, you know, get in line for Falcon up to the park closing time. Three months later and Universal still randomly decides when they will close off the line for Hagrid's, only because they do not want to schedule or pay their operations employees slightly longer. But you guys Universal doesn't ever cheap out like Disney!!!

It's also funny how everyone is being so smug that Universal released a great ride and Disney a not so great one. I guess after numerous mediocre to terrible attractions in a row, one of them has to be great, right? Y'all had nothing to say when Fallon debuted at the same time as Flight of Passage.

*Looks at Halloween Horror Nights*
“Why won’t Uni pay large numbers of staff members to stay late?”

Sorry, that’s a bit glib. Let’s be more serious. Let’s talk about context. SWGE was Disney’s big shot, their reaction not just to HP but to the overall changes in the theme park industry. It was to be their masterpiece, the culmination of Igers acquisition-focused reign, the proof that Disney was still number one in the theme park industry. Hagrid’s was an addition to an existing land officially announced late in the development process, an obvious clumsy attempt to counter the SW/Disney juggernaut. And Disney came up short. Eli Manning beat Tom Brady. And it wasn’t real close.

And Fallon didn’t occasion much comment because it was a minor ride that opened three years after Diagonal-Alley, one of the greatest theme park additions ever built, in a period when Uni was adding content yearly (and Kong is a VERY GOOD ride while Springfield was a VERY GOOD addition). Avatar opened after years of build-up, in the wake of a decade and a half of neglect, in a spot that should have had a major land years earlier, with one very good ride... and one of the most obvious cost-cut rides ever built. And Avatar land still got a lot of praise.

Add in WDWs absurd price increases on food, tickets, and hotel rooms, the proliferation of up charges, the slashing of budgets, frequent layoffs... and a (fair) narrative about WDWs budgetary approach to the parks has been set.

PS: I actually think the importance of HHN to Disney vs Uni perceptions is often overlooked. HHN is Uni’s signature event, one of the first things folks associate with them. Each year they build ten high-quality, lengthy, original, detailed attractions and stage one or two major shows and charge less for admission then Disney does for a cupcake party. That goes a long way towards creating the impression that Uni is willing to build and offer value for guest dollars, even if that view may be overly simplistic.

 

[Tom Morrow]

*Looks at Halloween Horror Nights*
“Why won’t Uni pay large numbers of staff members to stay late?”

Theme parks operate by assigning different budgets for different forms of operation. So the daily operating budget says IOA closes at X and we do not want to pay the TM's any longer than X:45 or whatever. HHN is not part of daily operations and has its own staffing budget.

Sorry, that’s a bit glib. Let’s be more serious. Let’s talk about context. SWGE was Disney’s big shot, their reaction not just to HP but to the overall changes in the theme park industry. It was to be their masterpiece, the culmination of Igers acquisition-focused reign, the proof that Disney was still number one in the theme park industry. Hagrid’s was an addition to an existing land officially announced late in the development process, an obvious clumsy attempt to counter the SW/Disney juggernaut. And Disney came up short. Eli Manning beat Tom Brady. And it wasn’t real close.

That's your opinion. To me, Galaxy's Edge is more impressive for feeling huge in scope and scale, while Diagon feels like a heavily detailed mall/food court. Galaxy's Edge feels like I'm exploring a new world, while Diagon feels like I'm walking through a tribute to the movies.

And Fallon didn’t occasion much comment because it was a minor ride that opened three years after Diagonal-Alley, one of the greatest theme park additions ever built, in a period when Uni was adding content yearly (and Kong is a VERY GOOD ride while Springfield was a VERY GOOD addition).

Universal fanboys be like:

"This just isn't that good."

"Wow!! Such immersion! So innovation!" *head explodes from amazement all over cafeteria-quality Krusty Burger food*

Add in WDWs absurd price increases on food, tickets, and hotel rooms, the proliferation of up charges, the slashing of budgets, frequent layoffs... and a (fair) narrative about WDWs budgetary approach to the parks has been set.

I'm not arguing here, the cut elements and budget cuts are crap. But this whole knee-jerk reactionary constant praise for Universal's mostly sophomoric recent efforts, as if we have to pick ONE of the two juggernauts to champion instead of looking at both objectively is out of hand and I think the theme park enthusiast community needs to perhaps step away from the negative internet echo chambers.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Theme parks operate by assigning different budgets for different forms of operation. So the daily operating budget says IOA closes at X and we do not want to pay the TM's any longer than X:45 or whatever. HHN is not part of daily operations and has its own staffing budget.


That's your opinion. To me, Galaxy's Edge is more impressive for feeling huge in scope and scale, while Diagon feels like a heavily detailed mall/food court. Galaxy's Edge feels like I'm exploring a new world, while Diagon feels like I'm walking through a tribute to the movies.


Universal fanboys be like:
View attachment 412995

"This just isn't that good."

View attachment 412996

"Wow!! Such immersion! So innovation!" *head explodes from amazement all over cafeteria-quality Krusty Burger food*


I'm not arguing here, the cut elements and budget cuts are crap. But this whole knee-jerk reactionary constant praise for Universal's mostly sophomoric recent efforts, as if we have to pick ONE of the two juggernauts to champion instead of looking at both objectively is out of hand and I think the theme park enthusiast community needs to perhaps step away from the negative internet echo chambers.

No one has defended F&F, here or on the Uni boards I frequent. Lots of people DO defend Midway Mania, which I consider to be about as well-made.

But yes, for various reasons I am biased in favor of Uni. The main part of that bias is because, at almost exactly the moment I realized WDWs decline was fundamental, long-term, and probably irreversible, Uni began to improve dramatically, in sharp contrast. It softened the blow. A smaller part is my fondness for HHN.

But we all need to examine and acknowledge our biases, and you might want to consider whether you might have reasons for wanting to see WDW in a more positive way then it’s overall direction warrants and to dismiss masterpieces of theme park design as “like a food court” because they threaten Disney’s dominance. If I have a tendency to notice and emphasize every imperfection at WDW, you seem eager to do the same at Uni.

 

[Stripes]

*Looks at Halloween Horror Nights*
“Why won’t Uni pay large numbers of staff members to stay late?”

Sorry, that’s a bit glib. Let’s be more serious. Let’s talk about context. SWGE was Disney’s big shot, their reaction not just to HP but to the overall changes in the theme park industry. It was to be their masterpiece, the culmination of Igers acquisition-focused reign, the proof that Disney was still number one in the theme park industry. Hagrid’s was an addition to an existing land officially announced late in the development process, an obvious clumsy attempt to counter the SW/Disney juggernaut. And Disney came up short. Eli Manning beat Tom Brady. And it wasn’t real close.

And Fallon didn’t occasion much comment because it was a minor ride that opened three years after Diagonal-Alley, one of the greatest theme park additions ever built, in a period when Uni was adding content yearly (and Kong is a VERY GOOD ride while Springfield was a VERY GOOD addition). Avatar opened after years of build-up, in the wake of a decade and a half of neglect, in a spot that should have had a major land years earlier, with one very good ride... and one of the most obvious cost-cut rides ever built. And Avatar land still got a lot of praise.

Add in WDWs absurd price increases on food, tickets, and hotel rooms, the proliferation of up charges, the slashing of budgets, frequent layoffs... and a (fair) narrative about WDWs budgetary approach to the parks has been set.

PS: I actually think the importance of HHN to Disney vs Uni perceptions is often overlooked. HHN is Uni’s signature event, one of the first things folks associate with them. Each year they build ten high-quality, lengthy, original, detailed attractions and stage one or two major shows and charge less for admission then Disney does for a cupcake party. That goes a long way towards creating the impression that Uni is willing to build and offer value for guest dollars, even if that view may be overly simplistic.

I'm sure others will have different opinions (as is always the case), but in my opinion:

Millennium Falcon>Gringotts

I'm actually curious what others think of this matchup.

I think we'll have to wait until Guardians to see Disney's response to Hagrid's.

 

[Tom Morrow]

I'm sure others will have different opinions (as is always the case), but in my opinion:

Millennium Falcon>Gringotts

I actually kind of hated both after my first ride, but after a few more rides I grew to like both more. Both have very impressive queue experiences. Both are hindered by the same fallacy of promising that you're getting to do something from the franchises you always figured would be a blast and then not living up to the experiences we saw in the films. When everyone heard we'd be riding on the Gringotts bank carts, we all envisioned a crazy, wild, whimsical roller coaster, yet instead we mostly just shuffle from show stop to show stop to watch action unfold. When we heard we were going to get to pilot the Millennium Falcon, we envisioned doing some sort of heroic, tense mission, and instead we got a low stakes, cartoonish, lighthearted video game side-quest with a character we don't care about.

I have come to appreciate both more for what they are, but due to their premises and the expectations they set forth before you even ride, both are easy to dislike after first impressions, especially when compared to something like Hagrid's and Flight of Passage.

 

[Tom Morrow]

to dismiss masterpieces of theme park design as “like a food court”

I'm referring to how it is enclosed and consists of narrow, cramped corridors that loop around to each other. To me it always felt more like a mall/food court in that sense than bustling city streets. I'm NOT referring to the theming and detail, which are top notch. I believe that Diagon's strength is in how much detail is crammed into relatively small spaces, while Galaxy's Edge's strength is in it's massive scale.

 

[Rich Brownn]

*Looks at Halloween Horror Nights*
“Why won’t Uni pay large numbers of staff members to stay late?”

Sorry, that’s a bit glib. Let’s be more serious. Let’s talk about context. SWGE was Disney’s big shot, their reaction not just to HP but to the overall changes in the theme park industry. It was to be their masterpiece, the culmination of Igers acquisition-focused reign, the proof that Disney was still number one in the theme park industry. Hagrid’s was an addition to an existing land officially announced late in the development process, an obvious clumsy attempt to counter the SW/Disney juggernaut. And Disney came up short. Eli Manning beat Tom Brady. And it wasn’t real close.

And Fallon didn’t occasion much comment because it was a minor ride that opened three years after Diagonal-Alley, one of the greatest theme park additions ever built, in a period when Uni was adding content yearly (and Kong is a VERY GOOD ride while Springfield was a VERY GOOD addition). Avatar opened after years of build-up, in the wake of a decade and a half of neglect, in a spot that should have had a major land years earlier, with one very good ride... and one of the most obvious cost-cut rides ever built. And Avatar land still got a lot of praise.

Add in WDWs absurd price increases on food, tickets, and hotel rooms, the proliferation of up charges, the slashing of budgets, frequent layoffs... and a (fair) narrative about WDWs budgetary approach to the parks has been set.

PS: I actually think the importance of HHN to Disney vs Uni perceptions is often overlooked. HHN is Uni’s signature event, one of the first things folks associate with them. Each year they build ten high-quality, lengthy, original, detailed attractions and stage one or two major shows and charge less for admission then Disney does for a cupcake party. That goes a long way towards creating the impression that Uni is willing to build and offer value for guest dollars, even if that view may be overly simplistic.

Hagrid's closing early has nothing to do with staffing. They are still working on getting the ride up to speed and are using the extra time on that. Right now they've gotten it up to run pretty reliable with 9 trains, the eventual goal being 11 (12 has become a pipe dream). The ride has been running pretty reliably with 9 (Wait times have dropped to 90-120 ,minutes posted, actual wait times between 45 -90 minutes). They've even been running it into the evenings on weekends. Probably in another month it will be running as it should.

 

[Rich Brownn]

I'm referring to how it is enclosed and consists of narrow, cramped corridors that loop around to each other. To me it always felt more like a mall/food court in that sense than bustling city streets. I'm NOT referring to the theming and detail, which are top notch. I believe that Diagon's strength is in how much detail is crammed into relatively small spaces, while Galaxy's Edge's strength is in it's massive scale.

And yet GE is much more a food & shop area than Diagon. Other than MFSM and RoTR, everything else is either a shop, paid experience, or food stall. There's no entertainment. You can't watch the Lightsaber show (unlike Olliwanders). Theres no real interactive. It basically has more trees.

 

[Tom Morrow]

And yet GE is much more a food & shop area than Diagon. Other than MFSM and RoTR, everything else is either a shop, paid experience, or food stall. There's no entertainment. You can't watch the Lightsaber show (unlike Olliwanders). Theres no real interactive. It basically has more trees.

Is it though? Let's break them down:

Disney's website lists 8 shops, 5 food locations, and 2 attractions for Galaxy's Edge. Shows: none, buuut the park itself has three major Star Wars shows, though I agree that Galaxy's Edge needs some too.

Universal's website lists 13 shops, 5 food locations, and 2-ish attractions for Diagon Alley (I say ish because Hogwarts Express is not exclusive to Diagon). There are three shows: Olivander's, and two live performances.

So Galaxy's Edge has (currently) no entertainment and could use a free experience like Olivander's, but it also has two E-tickets vs. Diagon's one. Diagon has significantly more shops. To me they are pretty close and I'm willing to bet entertainment will be added to Galaxy's Edge, evening them out further.

 

[Steph15251]

And yet GE is much more a food & shop area than Diagon. Other than MFSM and RoTR, everything else is either a shop, paid experience, or food stall. There's no entertainment. You can't watch the Lightsaber show (unlike Olliwanders). Theres no real interactive. It basically has more trees.

Yes the land needs a show ,not sure why they can not move the shows that the park already has to GE. I am not bias and I think GE is a really nice build land and I am looking forward to ROTR .

 

[Steph15251]

Reviews are pouring in: “It’s sorta disappointing and kinda sucks. But at least there’s no downtime!”

I liked MF it is not the best ride around but really it is not even GE main ride ,I think ROTR which it opens should be compared to Hagrids but really they are not even the same type of ride. One is a roller coaster and the other is a trackless dark ride.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Is it though? Let's break them down:

Disney's website lists 8 shops, 5 food locations, and 2 attractions for Galaxy's Edge. Shows: none, buuut the park itself has three major Star Wars shows, though I agree that Galaxy's Edge needs some too.

Universal's website lists 13 shops, 5 food locations, and 2-ish attractions for Diagon Alley (I say ish because Hogwarts Express is not exclusive to Diagon). There are three shows: Olivander's, and two live performances.

So Galaxy's Edge has (currently) no entertainment and could use a free experience like Olivander's, but it also has two E-tickets vs. Diagon's one. Diagon has significantly more shops. To me they are pretty close and I'm willing to bet entertainment will be added to Galaxy's Edge, evening them out further.

GE currently has ONE attraction which even friendly critics don’t claim is an E. Diagon should probably receive credit for the train, since they were added together, but in any case it gets partial credit for a wonderfully themed second ride.

Entertainment was cut from GE, and when Disney panics they cut rather then adding -and they’re panicking now.

 

[Steph15251]

Not sure if this was put up but I found this from 3 weeks ago

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2019/09/02/disney-imagineer-heres-what-went-into-designing.html

 

[Mickeyboof]

Both are hindered by the same fallacy of promising that you're getting to do something from the franchises you always figured would be a blast and then not living up to the experiences we saw in the films. When everyone heard we'd be riding on the Gringotts bank carts, we all envisioned a crazy, wild, whimsical roller coaster, yet instead we mostly just shuffle from show stop to show stop to watch action unfold. When we heard we were going to get to pilot the Millennium Falcon, we envisioned doing some sort of heroic, tense mission, and instead we got a low stakes, cartoonish, lighthearted video game side-quest with a character we don't care about.

Oof I’d have to agree.

After riding Gringotts, I said to my friend this ride suffers from the same thing most modern theme park rides are plagued by:

The designers truly believe their imagination is more deep, more valued, and more important than the guests.

That’s why we have to stop and watch the action unfold. This is the current wave of theme park design. Goodbye to clever attractions that leave the guest to weave their own narrative, or feel that impulse reaction.

I never thought there could be too much story in theme parks, but now I’m exhausted.

 

[drizgirl]

Yes the land needs a show ,not sure why they can not move the shows that the park already has to GE. I am not bias and I think GE is a really nice build land and I am looking forward to ROTR .

Don't give them ideas. Moving something from the rest of the park (with too little to do already) is a terrible idea. There's not enough there already. And adds nothing.

 

[Steph15251]

No one has defended F&F, here or on the Uni boards I frequent. Lots of people DO defend Midway Mania, which I consider to be about as well-made.

But yes, for various reasons I am biased in favor of Uni. The main part of that bias is because, at almost exactly the moment I realized WDWs decline was fundamental, long-term, and probably irreversible, Uni began to improve dramatically, in sharp contrast. It softened the blow. A smaller part is my fondness for HHN.

But we all need to examine and acknowledge our biases, and you might want to consider whether you might have reasons for wanting to see WDW in a more positive way then it’s overall direction warrants and to dismiss masterpieces of theme park design as “like a food court” because they threaten Disney’s dominance. If I have a tendency to notice and emphasize every imperfection at WDW, you seem eager to do the same at Uni.

While I have not been to UNI in years I feel both UNI and Disney have flaws .I feel UNI has mainly roller coasters and screen rides ,not everyone likes or can go on those type of rides.They have very few family rides as in dark rides or slow moving rides.Disney on the other hand has a ton of family rides and while some think Disney is not improving ,I do think some things are improving they have been adding more Pandora imo is a great land with FOP which imo is the best ride at Disney world,They added toy story land which I feel is a nice family land ,they added SWGE which I happened to think is nice land to me MfSR is a good ride and ROTR should be opening soon and if it is like they say I think that would be a great ride.They are adding MMRR ,RAT,Guradians,and Tron all of which I think would be good additions.