News Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge - Historical Construction/Impressions

[SSG]

It's funny though, the mantra that "Bob" synonymous for corporate Disney doesn't give a **** about Disneyland's history is getting harder to maintain when they are replacing the 80's Big Thunder Elements with throwbacks to Nature's Wonderland.

Careful. Anything even mildly complimentary to Iger will get you thrown right out of the Disney fan community.

 

[britain]

I think we are going to get something that looks like this. See mark at 13:30

Nice - yes, but less Splash Mountainy, I'd say.

And the trestles will be higher up to permit clearance for the Fantasmic floats.

 

[Phroobar]

Nice - yes, but less Splash Mountainy, I'd say.

And the trestles will be higher up to permit clearance for the Fantasmic floats.

True less fake looking but still the same basic idea except with more waterfalls.

 

[WDW1974]

Agreed! They are obviously installing some eye candy along the new trails and tracks on the Frontierland side of this construction.

True enough, but would they have to install anything if not for the terribly misplaced ego-trip, throw the Iger IP anywhere (especially by sticking a huge tumor on DL's back side) build of the Star Wars Experience?

BTW, heard this forum was home for all the refugees who hung out on LP.com until the bitter (or was it simply quiet) end. Wonder whatever happened to gadfly/very small-time one-time Disney consultant Lee MacDonald (just try and find one human being at Disney's Asia-Pacific HQ in HK who has ever heard of him, just one).

I haven't gone through 95 pages because, as you may know, I tend to stick to News and Rumors here, but I've been told that the general vibe here is "what is wrong with Star Wars Land at DL? Walt didn't want the park to be a museum. Blather, blather, rinse, repeat."

Because you can like SW and you can even be happy it is going in DL, but I haven't read one legit explanation anywhere for why it belongs and why it isn't fundamentally altering Walt's park in a way nothing else has for 61 years and why that is OK.

Oh, can I also say The Force Awakens was very mediocre and Bob Iger has been unhappy with Rogue One? OK, just did ... nevermind.

 

[WDW1974]

It's eye candy like this and the blending of environments that I think will make this version of SWL far superior to the DHS version. Their version will go from a city scape to an arch into SWL. Inside it will be the same but outside I bet they will try to make it look like a hot set with fake walls

The actual lands are going to be almost completely identical ... if you care about transitions, then maybe this will seem to fit more. I think that may well be accurate. However, the fact one land is going to be based on an IP and treated like a park within a park (basically saying 'this is more important than DL itself') is something that sets a very, very bad precedent for Disney, no matter how pretty this looks.

 

[WDW1974]

Yeah, I've seen some of the maps of the DHS version and they don't have nearly as much space to work with there to transition Star Wars into the rest of the park. It's going to be abrupt. Which is weird and ironic; yet another WDW park that seems strapped for space and land.

WDW and WDI don't seem to place as much care on planning and land use in the swamps. My guess is that is because of Walt's old blessing of size deal (Y'all recall when he said ''We have enough land here for all of the timeshares we can possibly dream up", right?) The Bob Iger Land IP MAGIC Park should have enough land to make for quality transitions, but I doubt you'll get them. ... And having Star Tours cut off from the SWE is bizarre because I will bet that, unlike Anaheim, ST stays open for years in the swamps.

At Disneyland, all this new eye candy will dramatically improve the giant walls of overgrown trees and shrubs that have defined the back half of Frontierland for decades. All the new cliffs and waterfalls along the Rivers of America, the trestles and rocky ledges along the Disneyland Railroad trackbed, the cavern entrances into Star Wars Land, etc., etc.

It will be a dramatic theme improvement over The Great Boring Wall of Green that defined this third of the park for the past 30 years (since they shut down Nature's Wonderland in '77), where a few fiberglass animals frozen in place, a peek-a-boo look at the parking structure, and that rickety Indian Chief were big highlights.

IMPROVE?!?!?!? Where's my crazy Phil Kippel emojis? Hold on ... OK, there we go.

Some of us loved the beautiful natural rustic feel of Frontierland's back country. Don't know why, could it be because it fit so well? Despite talk of saving trees, Disney basically denuded the area of trees that in some cases dated back to the 1950s. Just hacked them to pieces. Yes, they will be improving the banks of the RoA and tossing a few nice and cheap show upgrades along the way. But I find it hard to praise them when two Star Wars attractions that don't come close to Walt-era high capacity E-Tix 50 years later is what we are getting.

And every man and woman I have talked to that works or has worked for WDI who isn't involved in the project has ripped Disney for this ... oh, and for that little Guardians of the Galaxy takeover of the Hollywood Tower Hotel. It would seem today that WDI (stateside anyway where they don't have to answer to other ownership groups or the Chinese Communist Party) has lost all ability to pitch non-IP projects or to make sure they are placed where they belong from a thematic and storytelling and cohesive standpoint.

But what do I know. John Hench, Herb Ryman and Marc Davis and Co would have loved this type of forced placement.

 

[Disney Analyst]

WDW and WDI don't seem to place as much care on planning and land use in the swamps. My guess is that is because of Walt's old blessing of size deal (Y'all recall when he said ''We have enough land here for all of the timeshares we can possibly dream up", right?) The Bob Iger Land IP MAGIC Park should have enough land to make for quality transitions, but I doubt you'll get them. ... And having Star Tours cut off from the SWE is bizarre because I will bet that, unlike Anaheim, ST stays open for years in the swamps.



IMPROVE?!?!?!? Where's my crazy Phil Kippel emojis? Hold on ... OK, there we go.

Some of us loved the beautiful natural rustic feel of Frontierland's back country. Don't know why, could it be because it fit so well? Despite talk of saving trees, Disney basically denuded the area of trees that in some cases dated back to the 1950s. Just hacked them to pieces. Yes, they will be improving the banks of the RoA and tossing a few nice and cheap show upgrades along the way. But I find it hard to praise them when two Star Wars attractions that don't come close to Walt-era high capacity E-Tix 50 years later is what we are getting.

And every man and woman I have talked to that works or has worked for WDI who isn't involved in the project has ripped Disney for this ... oh, and for that little Guardians of the Galaxy takeover of the Hollywood Tower Hotel. It would seem today that WDI (stateside anyway where they don't have to answer to other ownership groups or the Chinese Communist Party) has lost all ability to pitch non-IP projects or to make sure they are placed where they belong from a thematic and storytelling and cohesive standpoint.

But what do I know. John Hench, Herb Ryman and Marc Davis and Co would have loved this type of forced placement.

Welcome to the Disneyland page!!

Have you heard anything about the Fantasmic updates?? It sounds like they are making some huge changes out west.

 

[WDW1974]

Careful. Anything even mildly complimentary to Iger will get you thrown right out of the Disney fan community.

Well, to be fair he is a piece of human excrement. Fans mostly don't get this because they tend to look at everything Disney does as how it makes them feel (take a look at the glee some WDW fans took when they found out GotG was going only in DCA ... or so they thought at the time).

 

[britain]

Yes, they will be improving the banks of the RoA and tossing a few nice and cheap show upgrades along the way.

So, yes, we are agreed that the banks are being improved.

 

[180º]

Yeah, I've seen some of the maps of the DHS version and they don't have nearly as much space to work with there to transition Star Wars into the rest of the park. It's going to be abrupt. Which is weird and ironic; yet another WDW park that seems strapped for space and land.

At Disneyland, all this new eye candy will dramatically improve the giant walls of overgrown trees and shrubs that have defined the back half of Frontierland for decades. All the new cliffs and waterfalls along the Rivers of America, the trestles and rocky ledges along the Disneyland Railroad trackbed, the cavern entrances into Star Wars Land, etc., etc.

It will be a dramatic theme improvement over The Great Boring Wall of Green that defined this third of the park for the past 30 years (since they shut down Nature's Wonderland in '77), where a few fiberglass animals frozen in place, a peek-a-boo look at the parking structure, and that rickety Indian Chief were big highlights.

Okay, I get it. It's going to be gorgeous. I don't doubt it will be stunning. Just cool it a little with my "Great Boring Wall of Green," which was genuinely one of my favorite parts of Disneyland. The loss still stings.

At least I can enjoy the Great Big Beautiful Wall of Green at the Magic Kingdom, which, by the way, never had Nature's Wonderland.

Anyway, I'm glad they're at least taking the great effort to conceal Star Wars Land beyond extensive earthen berms and lots of foliage. I'm looking forward to taking the Disneyland Railroad again, which I'm sure will still be a lovely trip.

(EDIT: I try to be gracious here, but to be completely honest, THIS is about how I feel)...

IMPROVE?!?!?!? Where's my crazy Phil Kippel emojis? Hold on ... OK, there we go.

Some of us loved the beautiful natural rustic feel of Frontierland's back country. Don't know why, could it be because it fit so well? Despite talk of saving trees, Disney basically denuded the area of trees that in some cases dated back to the 1950s. Just hacked them to pieces. Yes, they will be improving the banks of the RoA and tossing a few nice and cheap show upgrades along the way. But I find it hard to praise them when two Star Wars attractions that don't come close to Walt-era high capacity E-Tix 50 years later is what we are getting.

And every man and woman I have talked to that works or has worked for WDI who isn't involved in the project has ripped Disney for this ... oh, and for that little Guardians of the Galaxy takeover of the Hollywood Tower Hotel. It would seem today that WDI (stateside anyway where they don't have to answer to other ownership groups or the Chinese Communist Party) has lost all ability to pitch non-IP projects or to make sure they are placed where they belong from a thematic and storytelling and cohesive standpoint.

But what do I know. John Hench, Herb Ryman and Marc Davis and Co would have loved this type of forced placement.

 

[DDLand]

Oh, can I also say The Force Awakens was very mediocre and Bob Iger has been unhappy with Rogue One? OK, just did ... nevermind

So true...

I was strongly in favor of Star Wars Experience for the first several months after it was announced. Then I went to WDW and started thinking about Episode VII -you kind of see lots of Star Wars at WDW these days, or at least ads for nonexistent offerings- and I reflected on the new movie. I had been caught up in the hype of it. As I slowly started to think about it, I surprised myself by realizing that I honestly don't care about it. It sounds almost like work to watch it again, and I do love Star Wars.

That's when it hit me. They're adding Star Wars to Disneyland. They're changing this incredible place's very essence. There's no going back. This is permanent and will change it forever. I may sound irrational (and it is), but it just doesn't feel right. It just does not fit.

We're running out of land at Disneyland. With Frozenland or Experience coming, Disneyland will be fully built out. Where does the next ego-centric CEO who doesn't care about the parks put his favorite IP? There aren't going to be any other places behind the berm to hide a land. If nothing is really valuable to management, if nothing is special or meaningful, if anything can fit, then how well does that bode for Disneyland's future?

It makes me worry.

It looks like it will be awesome, really it does, but it's in the wrong park. That's a shame in my book.

 

[britain]

I personally have no insider info, SWE may end up as a disaster. But I like everything I've seen so far, and love the new life it is giving the railroad. I'm super excited to see some good railway / rock work action along a tighter Big Thunder Trail.

 

[WDW1974]

Welcome to the Disneyland page!!

Have you heard anything about the Fantasmic updates?? It sounds like they are making some huge changes out west.

Thanks. But just visiting and I owe a friend a favor. I talk DLR as it fits into the entire Disney P&R puzzle. I do it on News and Rumors because that's where the majority of this site's peeps hang out.

All I have heard is that it will be as spectacular in 2017 as the original was when it debuted. I am sure it will be. Disney always nails night time entertainment.

 

[DDLand]

Using terms like 'ego-trip', 'Iger IP' and 'huge tumor' to make your point don't really help sell your augment.

Isn't it all three though?

A huge, damaging, ugly, uncontrollable thing is growing at the top of Disneyland that will fundamentally alter the makeup of the park. It's being rushed because it has "synergy" with Iger's biggest accomplishment, and it's opening just after he leaves to put one final glorious thing on his list of "successes."

Doesn't that check all the boxes?

 

[WDW1974]

That's when it hit me. They're adding Star Wars to Disneyland. They're changing this incredible place's very essence. There's no going back. This is permanent and will change it forever. I may sound irrational (and it is), but it just doesn't feel right. It just does not fit.

That is it in a nutshell. I like Star Wars. I guess in the 70s and 80s I was even a fan. The prequels did nothing but turn me off the series. And I wasn't a junkie on SW anyway. I always preferred Star Trek (and not simply for a family reason) and the James Bond movies and, of late, Harry Potter. When you cut through all the BS and fanboi drool, you realize that the last great SW film was the only one and it came out in 1980. And when fans start talking about 'extended universe' and 'what's canon' I tune out like I do for most baseball games except say a Game 7 of a World Series between two teams with a history of futility. It means nothing to me.

But I don't view anything as simply what are my tastes because if I did then I'd be a hypocrite since I rally against that fanboi mentality. I don't like Frozen very much. But I get that it is popular. I get that much like Star Wars was a cultural touchstone in 1977 and that the Lion King clicked with the zeitgeist of a generation in 1994, a whole generation simply is enthralled with Ana and Elsa ans Olaf. So, I get why it has a place in Disney parks (that place just shouldn't be World Showcase).

At it's most basic level, you are right. Or your feelings are (and I know some SWE apologists will come in here and explain to the world that opinions are not right etc etc.). SWE at DL just doesn't feel right. Sticking it where it is going is putting a square peg in a round hole because of the huge ego of a risk averse CEO. Before you ask where SW belongs, it belongs in its own gate and Disney is a big enough slum lord in Anaheim to have more than enough land to properly create an entire universe based on George Lucas's creations.

We're running out of land at Disneyland. With Frozenland or Experience coming, Disneyland will be fully built out. Where does the next ego-centric CEO who doesn't care about the parks put his favorite IP? There aren't going to be any other places behind the berm to hide a land. If nothing is really valuable to management, if nothing is special or meaningful, if anything can fit, then how well does that bode for Disneyland's future?

It makes me worry.

It looks like it will be awesome, really it does, but it's in the wrong park. That's a shame in my book.

Again, very valid concern. When SWE is built. And the Frozen/Fantasyland project is done. And Toontown is repurposed ... where does any expansion go at DL? Tiny areas like the Motorboat Cruise lagoon, maybe a major Tomorrowland rebuild that adds a second level? Or more likely and cheaply, it happens by eating up existing real estate again. What will leave next time to put in current IP?

 

[WDW1974]

I personally have no insider info, SWE may end up as a disaster. But I like everything I've seen so far, and love the new life it is giving the railroad. I'm super excited to see some good railway / rock work action along a tighter Big Thunder Trail.

I like a lot of tight things, but jeans and the Big Thunder Trail wouldn't be two of them!

 

[britain]

Isn't it all three though?

A huge, damaging, ugly, uncontrollable thing is growing at the top of Disneyland that will fundamentally alter the makeup of the park. It's being rushed because it has "synergy" with Iger's biggest accomplishment, and it's opening just after after he leaves to put one final glorious thing on his list of "successes."

Doesn't that check all the boxes?

I'll admit that when looking at how the railroad route is now being bent into the park, rather than being the smooth, vaguely triangular loop around the park we all know, the analogy of a tumor is what comes to my mind too.

But the park is more than a map, and I'm excited to see Discovery Bay's land be put to better use.

 

[WDW1974]

Isn't it all three though?

A huge, damaging, ugly, uncontrollable thing is growing at the top of Disneyland that will fundamentally alter the makeup of the park. It's being rushed because it has "synergy" with Iger's biggest accomplishment, and it's opening just after after he leaves to put one final glorious thing on his list of "successes."

Doesn't that check all the boxes?

Yup, it does. But if Hans is his old LP self he just likes being contrary to generate arguments. Unfortunately, he never was as good as my old pal Jon Nadelberg. I still recall making Darkbeer, who I knew would show up somewhere sometime, cringe when we'd argue that DCA 'The Heroin Monkey on DL's Back' according to Al Lutz, actually saved DL in Anaheim ... something, btw, I wasn't simply saying to provoke a response.

 

[WDW1974]

I'll admit that when looking at how the railroad route is now being bent into the park, rather than being the smooth, vaguely triangular loop around the park we all know, the analogy of a tumor is what comes to my mind too.

But the park is more than a map, and I'm excited to see Discovery Bay's land be put to better use.

Except that it isn't. ... Something isn't better than nothing if that something doesn't fit and precludes all sorts of future possibilities. I kinda wish that Geyser Mountain concept for the ranch area had gone through a good 10-15 years ago because then we wouldn't be having this discussion now.

 

[britain]

Again, very valid concern. When SWE is built. And the Frozen/Fantasyland project is done. And Toontown is repurposed ... where does any expansion go at DL? Tiny areas like the Motorboat Cruise lagoon, maybe a major Tomorrowland rebuild that adds a second level? Or more likely and cheaply, it happens by eating up existing real estate again. What will leave next time to put in current IP?

I don't think I understand. Arguing against expansion by saying they aren't leaving room for expansion?