News Splash Mountain retheme to Princess and the Frog - Tiana's Bayou Adventure

[crazy4disney]

All of that may be well and true @Phicinfan



Name me a single Tomorrowland less “outdated” as Splash?
Speedway, monsters, buzz, CoP, PM, space? Nothing even close.
There’s a half dozen in fantasyland.
And arguable on pirates or jungle cruise.

It’s not even close to the most outdated thing in the park. And saying it is, is hyperbole.

What this discussion really shows is how disney maintenance has turned to garbage in the last 2 decades and how they’ve just rested on their laurels on their most popular park.

exactly.... maintenance has been an issue for a longggg time now not only in Parks but resorts as well... 7 lets not even talk about cleanliness either. Parks that use to be spotless and bathrooms that were borderline pristine. I feel like im walking into Yankee Stadium at times when using the bathroom not to mention trash bins (tabletops for bloggers) being filled to a point you cant throw stuff away at times... a disgrace and embarrassment. hence why i have no clue Why Josh gets a pass always on this matter

 

[Phicinfan]

All of that may be well and true @Phicinfan



Name me a single Tomorrowland less “outdated” as Splash?
Speedway, monsters, buzz, CoP, PM, space? Nothing even close.
There’s a half dozen in fantasyland.
And arguable on pirates or jungle cruise.

It’s not even close to the most outdated thing in the park. And saying it is, is hyperbole.

What this discussion really shows is how disney maintenance has turned to garbage in the last 2 decades and how they’ve just rested on their laurels on their most popular park.

Fair enough. Just looking at speedway and Space Mountain I would have to agree there.

 

[the_rich]

Well, I'm leaving today after a day in each park. I've been to Dl recently but this was my first time in WDW since 2017. From reading these forums I would have expected to see filth. But instead I saw a clean park with cms constantly picking up after inconsiderate guests.

 

[Dear Prudence]

Just to put things in perspective, there were a couple of people from Louisiana, one from specifically NOLA, who also said that Splash didn't really fit Louisiana or NOLA. They were so repeatedly disrespected (about this topic among other things), they don't post here anymore. Many folks are about their whataboutisms, but these folks actually knew what they were talking about. But heaven forbid you get between some of these people on here and them feeling good about themselves over a park retheme.

 

[WondersOfLife]

Dinosaur and Everest just got some updated needs,

The running carnotaurus is still stuck in the forward motion with its back half exposed.. lol... And many effects still dont work on everest, but ALSO, everest is STILL experiencing extended downtimes.

Imagination isn't a good choice as the ride itself is a mess.

That literally means it is a good choice for an example. Even if the ride is a mess, the show quality should not be as awful as it is... Figment AA hanging on by a stick, a "blast" frame been down for nearly a year... ect.

Mermaid, agree here with number of times animatronics are down or not working

Yea?

Last I was there Slinky, Rockin, Peoplemover, Mission:Space, Ratatouille and Everest and IASW were all fine and operating normally.

I'm glad they were in an operational state for you.

Nemo hadn't been replaced yet so not a fair comparison in my mind

How is that not a fair comparison? You see articles of them cancelling the shows all the time.

Yes, Disney has a lousy maintenance plan. No one says it doesn't. As for condition of Splash again agree to disagree.

I don't agree to disagree. With a better maintenance plan, Splash would be in fine shape. Lol.

I would LOVE, an update of Splash and a new ride for Tiana, but that isn't what Disney is doing due to SotS and restaging Splash. So it is what it is

THIS, I can agree with.

 

[retr0gate]

The people who are arguing that a New Orleans inspired area in Frontierland would feel out of place have clearly never played Red Dead Redemption 2 and visited Saint Denis.

Half joking, but seriously, I think Red Dead 2 is actually a great example of why PatF / New Orleans as a part of Frontierland is justified. For those who have never played the game, Rdr2's open world setting takes place in a fictionalized depiction of the western, midwestern and southern parts of the US set in the late 19th century - sound familiar? Among the many western inspired towns and cities you visit in the game (many of which are reminiscent of what you see in Frontierland itself) is the fictional city of Saint Denis - inspired by the real city of New Orleans. As a result, you have several of these different, distinct environments all under a shared "wild west" theme.

The time period of this game allows these different settings to coexist in what feels like a seamless environment, just as the chronological progression of Liberty Square to Frontierland allows the same. The story of Princess and the Frog may take place in the 1920s, but there's no reason the exterior cannot be made to depict New Orleans as it appeared in the 1890s so that it matches the surrounding environment. Nor does the story being told inside need to coalign with that time period. As many others have stated, Country Bear Jamboree does this, as well as Splash Mountain in its current form. The only area where things get a bit iffy is the placement of Big Thunder, but I do believe there are creative solutions to this problem.

 

[disneyfireman]

Cough cough… Snow white scary adventure.. cough cough.. Mr. toads wild ride… Cough cough… Peter Pan‘s flight .. I think most people get it… At least they should

And every one of those attractions is light years better than some of the new “dark” rides. IE. Under the sea…

 

[Smiley/OCD]

"Here we experience the history of our country's past...the colourful drama of Frontier America in the exciting days of the covered wagon and the stagecoach...the advent of the railroad...and the romantic riverboat. Frontierland is a tribute to the faith, courage and ingenuity of the pioneers who blazed the trails across America.” - Walt Disney.

Huh. Sounds like a “West land” to me.

Living in NJ, I know New Yorkers that still think anything west of the NJ Turnpike is the wilderness…

 

[Rich Brownn]

In a theme park design sense, sometimes being self-aware makes it what it is!

Well now we are changing the subject, but if you really care to know:

Yes, it could, attractions do this all of the time on various levels as a storytelling element to various degrees. On Jungle Cruise and Haunted Mansion for example, you are on a tour where things of adventure and humor fit their tones.

In Country Bear Jamboree, the script literally mentions from the get-go that you are there to see a revue show dedicated in its atmosphere to the past and we get a cast of characters performing songs. This works for the tone of Country Bear Jamboree because it is a cast of characters that clearly are not polished, and we have to "bear" with them. It has a self-aware that fits the tone.

Tiana's attraction could easily do the same thing if the idea was to take you back into the heritage of Louisiana and go on an adventure of the Frontiers of Louisiana that made it what it is today. That is not very endearing and not something Disney is likely to do whimsically or put the effort into these days. They would rather do book reports without a segue or much avenue to build into the experience for animated IP attractions and recent rethemes.

Splash Mountain does this in the sense of the queue with the equipment and facilities of a time and place where it is evident of farming. mining and logging. There is a bit of hints of critters that grows throughout the way being anthropomorphic until the flume falls slipnfalls take you into that whimsy in 360 formats. You have to remember that even if you want to reference Uncle Remus, who is not in the ride but rather we know Brer Frog is a similar character role of storyteller, and the story of Brer Fox and adventures he has are not just current, but have already happened, hence why they are stories and why it "happened on one of them zip a dee doo dah days." We are taken back to and through those events. A time when critters and people (the romanticized frontier that tells this fable) were a little closer together.


On your thoughts on the music:
Wells Fargo Wagon and other Music Man songs fill the air in Main Street USA, The Ballad of Davy Crockett was written in the 50s. X Anticio wrote Yo Ho (A Pirates Life for Me) in the 60s. These are suspensions of disbelief do not break the theme. Just like the Disney theme parks are not touted as museums, they are not historical preservation of their musical playing or choices. They are inspired by the mythology of Americana and ideals, from the old country fairytales Americans told their children to the romanticized view of reality and dreams of tomorrow. Like the faux buildings fabricated recently based on centuries old structures, music can be produced in a different time to evoke or fabricate to entertain in a theme park setting.

The Broadway showtimes music was added years after the park opened and it ALWAYS jars me every time. Probably because I am so familiar with the shows. But it has never worked for me, and it has always bothered me. (When I worked Main Street it was all still period music. But we also dressed like people from the 1890s and not the theater usher costumes used now lol)

 

[heapster411]

Just to put things in perspective, there were a couple of people from Louisiana, one from specifically NOLA, who also said that Splash didn't really fit Louisiana or NOLA. They were so repeatedly disrespected (about this topic among other things), they don't post here anymore. Many folks are about their whataboutisms, but these folks actually knew what they were talking about. But heaven forbid you get between some of these people on here and them feeling good about themselves over a park retheme.

As being in New Orleans, we are below sea level. The French Quarter is right above sea level. That being said, the only Mountain here is a hill in Audubon Park. The levees are higher than that hill, so in perspective, Where is this mountain that the log flume ride supposed to based on? So is this a view of the thread that gets you banded? Watching TPatF, it seems to be based in the Acadian region of the state.

 

[Dear Prudence]

As being in New Orleans, we are below sea level. The French Quarter is right above sea level. That being said, the only Mountain here is a hill in Audubon Park. The levees are higher than that hill, so in perspective, Where is this mountain that the log flume ride supposed to based on? So is this a view of the thread that gets you banded? Watching TPatF, it seems to be based in the Acadian region of the state.

He wasn't banned, he just got sick of the way people (who were not from there) kept talking down to him and telling him he didn't know what he was talking about.... when he was literally from there. I don't know enough about the layout of NOLA or Louisiana, so I was interested in what he had to say--as well as your comments. I know that I know am going to be looking a lot of this up! Thank you!

 

[disneyfireman]

Regardless...its still mind numb and ever so..lobotomised thinking to even consider this redo. Literally no one at Disney will speak up and say,,oh yeah, this is my idea..lol. Literally.. thee worst decision Disney ever made since and maybe even as much as removing toad from MK.. Carl Sagan would even be stumped by this decision or rationalization..lol

 

[BuddyThomas]

Regardless...its still mind numb and ever so..lobotomised thinking to even consider this redo. Literally no one at Disney will speak up and say,,oh yeah, this is my idea..lol. Literally.. thee worst decision Disney ever made since and maybe even as much as removing toad from MK. Carl Sagan would even be stumped by this decision or rationalization..

You’re dragging Carl Sagan into this now? Makes sense.

Anyway, a less than 60 second Google search reveals that Bob Weiss led the imagineering team that came up with the retheme.

So your assertion that “literally no one at Disney will speak up” is simply not factual in any way.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Re: the mountain debate

Even as Splash is currently, I never took the mountain part literally. You dive into the "mountain" but are really diving into another world.

Once you dive down, you are seemingly outside again, trees around you, vines hanging. There are scenes in the MK version specifically with the sky in the distance:

Entering the "mountain" is leaving the real world, and entering a made up fantasy / cartoon like world.

I really don't need, or ever needed justification for the mountains existence, and I don't need Imagineering justifying it now, regardless of the IP inside.

Entering the mountain is like going down the rabbit hole in Alice, taking me to a new world.

 

[crazy4disney]

You’re dragging Carl Sagan into this now? Makes sense.

Anyway, a less than 60 second Google search reveals that Bob Weiss led the imagineering team that came up with the retheme.

So your assertion that “literally no one at Disney will speak up” is simply not factual in any way.

Tony Baxter had his name attached as well. Wonder what he is doing for this lol

 

[LittleBuford]

Re: the mountain debate

Even as Splash is currently, I never took the mountain part literally. You dive into the "mountain" but are really diving into another world.

Once you dive down, you are seemingly outside again, trees around you, vines hanging. There are scenes in the MK version specifically with the sky in the distance:

View attachment 662528

Entering the "mountain" is leaving the real world, and entering a made up fantasy / cartoon like world.

I really don't need, or ever needed justification for the mountains existence, and I don't need Imagineering justifying it now, regardless of the IP inside.

Entering the mountain is like going down the rabbit hole in Alice, taking me to a new world.

I took the mountain somewhat more literally than you did, since I knew the film well and read it as a representation of Chickapin Hill (which it is). Nonetheless, I agree with you that fantasy matters much more than reality with such rides, and the fact that mountains are not to be found in the actual Louisiana is (to me at least) pretty inconsequential given what we’ll be dealing with once the retheme has been completed: a Magic Kingdom attraction based on an animated film that is full of all kinds of wonderful and impossible things.

 

[Dear Prudence]

Re: the mountain debate

Even as Splash is currently, I never took the mountain part literally. You dive into the "mountain" but are really diving into another world.

Once you dive down, you are seemingly outside again, trees around you, vines hanging. There are scenes in the MK version specifically with the sky in the distance:

View attachment 662528

Entering the "mountain" is leaving the real world, and entering a made up fantasy / cartoon like world.

I really don't need, or ever needed justification for the mountains existence, and I don't need Imagineering justifying it now, regardless of the IP inside.

Entering the mountain is like going down the rabbit hole in Alice, taking me to a new world.

The point I brought up was that people who were actually from NOLA expressed concern/ brought up valid points, and the one poster who no longer posts here was talked down to and over so much, he no longer feels comfortable here.

 

[Ghost93]

I don't know why we are even discussing whether Louisiana has mountains since "Splash Mountain" is no longer the ride's title. It's now Tiana's Bayou Adventure, and by all accounts, Tiana, a bayou, and an adventure will be featured in the new ride. The drop won't be part of a "mountain" necessarily.

 

[Rodj]

It is way closer to what it should be than many other attractions on property...

Have you been on Imagination recently? Dinosaur? Everest? Little Mermaid?

For Splash being as old as it is, and on top of that, being surrounded by water all the time, it is in much better shape than these other AA-heavy attractions. Out of the 10 or so rides broken down on my last trip, Splash wasn't one of them. You know what WAS?

Slinky Dog Dash, Rockin' Roller Coaster, Finding Nemo the Musical, Little Mermaid, PeopleMover, Mission: Space, Guardians of the Galaxy, Ratatouille, Expedition Everest, and freaking It's a Small World of all rides. And this was just one day at each park.

...Sounds like Splash Mountain, when it ISN'T operating, isn't a result of it being old. Disney just has crap source for maintenance. So that is still no excuse to close it. Otherwise, Disney would have to close 20 other attractions on property in their current state, too. New and old.

Don't forget about the horrible state of the Tower of Terror recently. Its show maintenance has plummeted the most(pun not intended) compared to other attractions since Chapek took over. At least in the last few years with Iger, Tower was at least kept in somewhat decent shape. New loud speakers were added to the drop shafts in 2018(which unfortunately started to have issues in 2019) and many other minor show effects were addressed late 2019-early 2020. There would of been a budget allocated to address the major show issues had the virus not happen.
There has not been a single positive change to the Tower after Chapek took over. The audio is in a very messed up state currently, the new window projector in the hallway scenes is displaying in grayscale and to top it off, there is no plans for new drop shaft motors, meaning that it will remain on the less intense drop sequences.

 

[LittleBuford]

I don't know why we are even discussing whether Louisiana has mountains since "Splash Mountain" is no longer the ride's title. It's now Tiana's Bayou Adventure, and by all accounts, Tiana, a bayou, and an adventure will be featured in the new ride. The drop won't be part of a "mountain" necessarily.

That’s a good point. The concept art turns the mountain into a fanciful evocation of Mama Odie’s Tree.