Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[danlb_2000]

I am curious. Not been to the New Fantasy Land yet but, for comparison's sake, how does the Rockwork in that area and the 7 Dwarves Mine Coaster stack up against Potter? Transformers? Now, I would love to see Disney build on a pace closer to UNI but is the level and the overall amount of detail required in the rockwork a longer process than throwing up a building? Even if that building is themed? Case in point, LOVED the Despicable Me ride and the interior theming but other than a basic facade of Gru's house, the rest was a billboard on a building. I guess, instead of the detail Disney did on Haunted Mansion, they could have slapped some plywood up on a building side and called it a day? Did I mention I loved the Despicable Me ride and to be truthful, was very impressed with IOA and USF. Just saying that besides Disney ammortizing the build over a longer period, maybe their methods take longer as well?

Transformers is a hard comparison since it is a relatively simple exterior and this is the third time they have built the ride. I would put the quality of the work in Harry Potter Phase 1 up against anything Disney has done in the US parks. As for time of construction, the entire Harry Potter Phase 2 which will have two major new rides, a restaurant, shops, and some pretty heavy theming will likely take just about as long to build as it is taking to build the 7 Dwarfs Mine Ride.

 

[Goofyernmost]

If you want to see beautiful rockwork, the Fantasyland Expansion is THE place to be. Problem is, once you get past the beautiful rockwork, there's not a lot else there.

I wouldn't say that the rockwork is poor, in fact, I would say it is quite attractive, but you asked for a comparison between Potter and FLE. Well, first of all, I don't remember all that much rockwork at Potter, so I can't really compare it. However, it would be difficult anyway because Potter is a land in and of itself with theme's that are directly associated with Potter. FLE rockwork is more of a faux land decoration in that there is no real consistency of theme there. There is Mermaid and Belle and soon the 7 DMT. All they can do with the rockwork there is create the necessary scene for each attraction. It's not Little Mermaid land. Once the Mine train is done then it becomes even more diluted because then FLE becomes just a part of the entire Fantasyland picture. Still the overall appearance should be improved with the removal of the construction wall.

Not sure when they actually started work on the mine train itself, but New Fantasyland broke ground in early 2010 which means it would be about 4 years of construction. (Again if they started the mine train at the same time. Someone out there knows better than me.)

For comparison's sake it took Disney 3 years (official groundbreaking to open) to build all of Carsland which was a much larger rockwork project. So Disney can work faster when they want to. They chose to spread this one out.

Don't quote me on this, I tried to find the reference but was unable, but I think that it was just a little over 3 years to completely build EPCOT. Disneyland was completed in 1 year. Is 4 years a bit much for FLE? I think an argument can be made that it was way too much!

 

[magicallactose]

From the description of the Lorax dark ride from HTF at Orlando United, it sounds like it will be a very awesome family experience. That combined with the rumoured ride line-up coming our way in the next few years is quite exciting.

 

[WDW1974]

I love this post. I truly want to know what you do for a living. Your posts are the most analytical on these boards... I love it.

They are great. My money would be top exec in a financial role --like CFO -- of a medium or large corp ...or there is always corporate counsel.

 

[WDW1974]

Got a name? I have many IP infringements by the lifestyle corps I'd love to report

They only care when they feel like it.

If the slug is helping them in other ways, then it's a hands-off policy.

 

[WDW1974]

Again, it doesn't matter what your opinion is about casinos. It's the fact that Disney has bought and fought considerably to keep casinos out of FL while profiting immensely from them. Hypocrisy with a touch of Pixie Dust.

That is it.

At the core. And, no, the fact Disney released films for more adult audiences absolutely nothing to do with this. It is a very bad comparison. Movies are art. And Walt's original films were not children's fare either. A better comparison would be if Disney suddenly decides to have a division that makes films.

You can't preach against gambling for decades and then quietly enter the business and hope no one notices. I have the feeling that just because of this thread discussion, people are noticing. But I NEVER know what I am talking about!

 

[WDW1974]

Someone here asked about Jim Lewis and whether I had more info on him that I can release and the answer is no (right now)-

I firmly believe he blackmailed Disney when he left. As execs at that level neither need, nor get, letters of recommendation for new jobs (especially after being fired for financial improprieties).

He also is Jason Garcia's top Disney inside source.

 

[WDW1974]

I think you gloss over that while the Marvel product is marketed to children - it is not exclusively a kid product.

Iron Man is a drunk, womanizing playboy. Not exactly the poster hero for your 8 yr old. The demographics for Marvel are not just toddlers.. but males.

When they put Mickey Mouse on the slot machines... I think you might have a moral argument. But these are separate brands. This should be even LESS contentious than Touchstone/etc was because this isn't even the same company doing it.. where Touchstone was basically just a front.

Really, they are separate?

So, Disney didn't just place them with Phineas and Ferb? So, Iron Man doesn't appear in an exhibit at DL? So, they aren't opening a Thor meet-greet-and-grope at DL next month? So, they don't sell Marvel toys and merchandise side by side the Princesses, Pooh and Mickey and the gang at Disney Stores worldwide? (they didn't sell a line of Pulp Fiction tees back in the 90s).

While I totally AGREE that Disney has no morals so it has no moral indignation to oppose gambling on any front, you are dancing all over the place to make excuses for why this is nothing abnormal and simply business as usual for Disney. ...which is fine, except it is not.

Let's see what happens on this front ...

 

[WDW1974]

I believe - personal opinion/interpretation- they are looking at reputation/site traffic and trying to weed out "guy who started a blog to get free ****."

As they should, IMO.

well, if they were looking at traffic, I don't see how @wdwmagic is never invited (unless they look at the views of threads I start and blame him for them!)

And other serious writers like @KevinYee aren't as well. But DisneyLifestylers.com are (I think they owe me money as does the petulant man child, who apparently has fallen out of favor with the Mouse and now has to rely on his girlfriend) on the list ...and that crazy Josh guy who used to troll here.

Of course, one has to wonder what their metrics really are when a thread here can, in a few weeks, outpace the looks that a blogger gets in months or years.

I don't see Blondie, Bland Tommy, Crazy Gary or Scary Steven stopping by here to explain anything though (but they'll read, oh they'll read!)

 

[WDW1974]

Definitely.

Although... I can't help but wonder how much of the traffic of certain sites is driven by the fact that they get info and access from Disney that others don't. Are these more popular blogs truly independent sources of information... or the digital equivalent of puppet regimes?

THIS!!!

Which is exactly why you see the , moaning and self promotion (and even tacit threats at Disney) in the Twitverse. Without the access, you lose eyes and with less eyes well, one would think you lose invites. It's all a circle.

But if you don't think getting special treatment makes a difference take a look at our pal @WDWFigment and his site. I love his work. Absolutely. But I have never seen anyone get free reign to enter parks at 4 a.m. In Tokyo to take photos that will make his site more valuable and therefore put him above others. Again, I like the guy (his wife will kill me apparently if I criticize him and you have to admire her for that!), I think he is very talented. I'd hire him if I were Disney. But no one else has ever gotten the chance to photograph TDR parks while they were empty. That kind of advantage can be huge.

So far, it hasn't seemed to compromise him. He has still bashed WDW and Disney were he feels it appropriate.

But I've said it before, everyone has their price. Most of these Lifestylers can be bought off for very little.

 

[WDW1974]

So I just found out about those big "mega attractions" coming to Universal in the next few years:

-Jurassic park is basically gonna become Dinoland U.S.A. with new Carnival games and more food/merchandise carts where carnival hucksters can sell more crap to people. This is in addition to the random hair braiding stations and rock climbing wall that are junking up that area BTW. The big "e-ticket" will be a roller coaster thats themed to look like its racing through an amber mine. Universal is also considering adding a spinner to the land. What any of this has to do with the theme of a zoological theme park filled with Dinosaurs I have no idea. Forget any dreams that they would dig out lavish concepts like the Jeep adventure or Helicoptours or some new Dinosaur adventure.

-IOA will also be getitng a Lorax 3D movie in Suess Landing.


Seems like after Harry Potter Universal is gonna start following the Eisner/Iger model of doing business.

This is about 25% right and 75% waaaaaaay off.

 

[WDW1974]

Oh no, I hope you're wrong.... Ugh

He is.

(And I owe you a PM).

 

[PhotoDave219]

well, if they were looking at traffic, I don't see how @wdwmagic is never invited (unless they look at the views of threads start and blame him for them!)

And other serious writers like @KevinYee aren't as well. But DisneyLifestylers.com are (I think they owe me money as does the petulant man child, who apparently has fallen out of favor with the Mouse and now has to rely on his girlfriend) on the list ...and that crazy Josh guy who used to troll here.

Of course, one has to wonder what their metrics really are when a thread here can in a few weeks outpace the looks that a blogger gets in months or years.

I don't see Blondie, Bland Tommy, Crazy Gary or Scary Steven stopping by here to explain anything though (but they'll read, oh they'll read!)

I don't think any of us have a problem with the distribution method of your information gathering organization.

Whether it is audio, video, dead tree or written word.... it all comes down to quality, accuracy and honesty. Thats what a disproportionate amount of all the bloggers don't get. They don't get public trust, they don't understand sourcing and accuracy.

They only care about being first because being right certainly hasnt been part of their M.O.

The one thing that they definitely care about is free stuff and gloating on twitter that they got into a Disney Media Event.

 

[flynnibus]

Really, they separate?

So, Disney didn't just place them with Phineas and Ferb? So, Iron Man doesn't appear in an exhibit at DL? So, they aren't opening a Thor meet-greet-and-grope at DL next month? So, they don't sell Marvel toys and merchandise side by side the Princesses, Pooh and Mickey and the gang at Disney Stores worldwide? (they didn't sell a line of Pulp Fiction tees back in the 90s).

Separate does not mean ISOLATED.
Of course there is cross-overs, promotion, etc. The existence of that doesn't mean they aren't separate. Marvel has done collaborations and cross-overs with it's #1 competitor DC Comics as well. The fact they cross-promote and collaborate doesn't mean they are any less separate from each other. The Disney and Marvel brands are setup to co-exist and target markets as needed... just like Disney Channel vs ABC, etc. Leveraging your independent brands to boost each other is natural... that doesn't necessarily merge the brands.

I find the issue of Disney plastering Marvel merchandise indiscriminately in the parks a much greater conflict in messaging and branding than the topic of TWDC letting Marvel license to gaming.

 

[WDW1974]

I think the first thing we need to all understand is there is no war. They all build we all win

Also Disney is planning many things down the road....we just have to wait longer than we'd all like

Just a dose of reality, but almost all things of substance that WDW will be adding (not including the C-Ticket at best kiddie coaster) won't open before 2018.

You think about that while visiting parks that were stale a decade ago...

 

[WDW1974]

I'm not so sure you are exactly right...

I have art for the amber mine coaster. Looks fantastic, but I last heard they were going another direction.
And the Lorax attraction, as I hear it, is a ride, not a movie (though with some 3D elements).

And then there are the big plans for Toon Lagoon for 2017 or so....

You hear correct. But we both sorta knew that (just wondering if I'll get as many likes for this as you did ...)

 

[WDWDad13]

Just a dose of reality, but almost all things of substance that WDW will be adding (not including the C-Ticket at best kiddie coaster) won't open before 2018.

You think about that while visiting parks that were stale a decade ago...

No thanks...when I'm there I'm having a great time with my family and not thinking about all the Disney is evil and negativity talked about around here

 

[misterID]

This is about 25% right and 75% waaaaaaay off.

I really, really hope so.

And if they're going in a different direction with the Amber Mine train... What direction are they going and which direction are they leaving behind?

 

[ScoutN]

Separate does not mean ISOLATED.
Of course there is cross-overs, promotion, etc. The existence of that doesn't mean they aren't separate. Marvel has done collaborations and cross-overs with it's #1 competitor DC Comics as well. The fact they cross-promote and collaborate doesn't mean they are any less separate from each other. The Disney and Marvel brands are setup to co-exist and target markets as needed... just like Disney Channel vs ABC, etc. Leveraging your independent brands to boost each other is natural... that doesn't necessarily merge the brands.

I find the issue of Disney plastering Marvel merchandise indiscriminately in the parks a much greater conflict in messaging and branding than the topic of TWDC letting Marvel license to gaming.

So you are saying all of the 5-12 year olds that will be knocking door to door hoping someone sane behind them will give them candy in just under two month's time wearing Avengers costumes and Spidy get ups are separate? Sorry but I will not buy into that one. I have plenty of little cousins in that age range who idolize the Avengers now as the older generation once saw Superman. If one of them were with me in a gas station and saw Mr Thor on a scratch card for gambling they would want me to buy it without blinking. If they would do that with just a scratch card then imagine what a loud, flashy, and somewhat stimulating machine would do to their senses. Disney knows Avengers and Marvel needs to hit with the same Demo that Mickey (whose cousin was slaughtered at the neighbor's house in an attic last night) does on top of the older Demo that it already has.

 

[WDW1974]

@HTF (aka "HatetoFLy") has a better track record with Universal info than anyone--even a certain Spirit--and he has outlined the whole ride on his own personal discussion board. Won't steal hits from him with details, but this isn't another 3D movie.

As for JP ... well Springfield shows Universal knows how to do a glorified food court right. They've earned a certain amount of good will before I start comparing their new project to the Worst. Land. Ever. At least let's see some concept art...

So Lee, it's definitely the Lagoon not Lost Continent that's on the chopping block? If so, doubt it will be LotR (that would be three psuedo-historical fantasy lands in one park). Any hints, or is this another riddle from you?

I'll argue that first point... But largely because HTF still hasn't convinced me that the big monkey is coming back to UNI.

I haven't posted much news about UNI until the last couple of years, but the info has always been big and dead accurate. I am a bit touchy on this because I recall when I said Amity was leaving for Potter 2.0 and that a train was going to connect the parks and be a top attraction as well, I was met with derision and 'that is impossible ... Infrastructure ... Potter is a flash in the pan ... Blah, blah' blah.' I have been wrong about Disney before (very rarely). My UNI track record is damn near perfect.

But I would listen to @Lee, his info is great. He gets it from Mrs. Lee who gets it from me!