Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[Lee]

That's the faulty thinking, which compiles onto the other problem you have in here: They should start thinking about how to keep the guests they have from heading out to try the rest of Orlando...

Oh, they have...
That's the reason behind enabling/forcing all guests to manage their entire vacation through MM+, booking all their meals and fastpasses months in advance, planning everything down to the last second. It's a virtual ball and chain to keep people on property.

 

[flynnibus]

Regardless whether one thinks that is bad or does not matter, it gives Disney a huge advantage over other similar types of programs to really figure out individual profiles and do behaviour research.

...and why such programs are worth such a huge investment to realize. That type of understanding of your customer... to shape both your operations and offerings... is pure gold. And a competitive advantage it has against others...

 

[ChrisFL]

I guess you didn't notice government agencies like DHS and IRS are creating their own armies.

Sounds like Fox News propaganda

 

[PhotoDave219]

Yup.
And if they don't institute that "tiered" system where you can't pick three E-tics....gonna get ugly when no non-planners can get a good FP.

We'll find a way. We will find a way to to get on the rides. We always do.

 

[SJFPKT]

...and why such programs are worth such a huge investment to realize. That type of understanding of your customer... to shape both your operations and offerings... is pure gold. And a competitive advantage it has against others...

He is an example I have. For the past 4 years when we planned on staying on site,(weekend trips are always off property). I go to the website and log in. I search all three categories of rooms and differents dates within a month of each other. I do this for a couple of days a week for two or three weeks. Then I leave the website alone. A month later I get a PIN in the mail for sometime in that time frame I have searched for. They have now made it more affordable for me. Little do they know, I know how web site traffic works and a little bit about monitoring that traffic. In effect I have phished them for a PIN. Granted I know when they do certain discounts by their patterns so I know what to expect for the time frame I am going and you can't plan super far in advance doing this but you can normally do this 4-5 months out.

The beauty to these types of systems is if you lean their patterns of discounts and what sets them off, you can actually manipulate this system to work in your advantage.

 

[Lee]

We'll find a way. We will find a way to to get on the rides. We always do.

Of course. Welcome to Standby City.

 

[flynnibus]

The beauty to these types of systems is if you lean their patterns of discounts and what sets them off, you can actually manipulate this system to work in your advantage.

Yes, but just like SEO... when you game the system... the game changes. And it's an endless game of cat and mouse.

 

[Mouse Detective]

They should start thinking about how to keep the guests they have from heading out to try the rest of Orlando...

Oh, they have...That's the reason behind enabling/forcing all guests to manage their entire vacation through MM+, booking all their meals and fastpasses months in advance, planning everything down to the last second. It's a virtual ball and chain to keep people on property.

So why then do they offer next to nothing for adults in the category of nightlife? Adults have the cash and many of them are on property without families. Yet every night Disney almost pushes them off property.

 

[scout68]

Of course. Welcome to Standby City.

Standby City, the ever expanding metropolis where small clusters of people claiming to be families spend hours on end attending to their phones trying to figure out how to book a fast pass for next years trip...

Ahhh quality time.

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

So why then do they offer next to nothing for adults in the category of nightlife? Adults have the cash and many of them are on property without families. Yet every night Disney almost pushes them off property.

I'm convinced they don't want adults anymore. They only want you if you have small children.

 

[Lee]

I'm convinced they don't want adults anymore. They only want you if you have small children.

Agreed. We don't spend enough on merchandise, Photopass and character meals.

The only adults they want are with conventions. That's where the money is.

 

[rudyjr13]

Agreed. We don't spend enough on merchandise, Photopass and character meals.

The only adults they want are with conventions. That's where the money is.

But as I said in the other thread, these new planning tools go against what most of us with small children can do. Maybe it's just me but I can't see committing to being in a place in the park at a specific time with 2 toddlers. We already do not schedule table service meals.

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

Agreed. We don't spend enough on merchandise, Photopass and character meals.

The only adults they want are with conventions. That's where the money is.

Now that's puzzling. Don't conventionEARS want someplace to go at night? Right now there's nothing save the BoardWalk, which isn't much of an option unless you're staying at one of the Epcot resorts or have a car.

I just don't get it. I sure like CityWalk though! Rising Star is a blast.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Oh, they have...
That's the reason behind enabling/forcing all guests to manage their entire vacation through MM+, booking all their meals and fastpasses months in advance, planning everything down to the last second. It's a virtual ball and chain to keep people on property.

Thought for future discussion...what is the possibility that the public could reach saturation point and this whole thing completely blow out on them. What if it has the opposite affect. Isn't that possible? Just for an example, I have nothing to back this up other then what I think, there are more people that stay offsite then onsite. (just thinking about numbers in parks as opposed to numbers of rooms available on site) Couldn't that cause more to stay offsite due to mind boggling planning requirements then not. Even if they offered more perks to those onsite, isn't there a point of diminishing returns for customers just as well as there is for providers?

Since 1983 I have in 42 trips stayed on-site only once. That was more out of curiosity then desire. I have become a huge Disney fan (both in loyalty and size) over that time and have never felt the need to be onsite to accomplish that. I buy my admission tickets from places like AAA, and do counter service during the day in the parks. Leave for a while late afternoon, have dinner in one of the gazillion restaurants offsite (no reservation required) and head back to the parks in the evening. I occasionally pull a Fastpass, but can also see that with just a little planning on my part can work around it if necessary.

The question is...what is to stop others from doing the same thing? At what point does the public come to realize that the requirements that Disney is placing on them is about the same as staying at a 5 star hotel and having to clean your own room and change your own sheets. I also wonder if casual observance of the use of the parking lots is a reliable indicator of that trend. I remember when I first started to go on a regular basis, the parking lots were always full. I can remember glancing across the lots and thinking that I would love to just have that revenue for one day. (that's when it only cost about $3.00 a day) Then I seem to recall that I started to notice fewer cars in the lots in the early 2000's. Last time I was there, in January, it seemed to me that those number were looking larger again. Could that be more people staying offsite? I don't know, just wondering.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Agreed. We don't spend enough on merchandise, Photopass and character meals.

The only adults they want are with conventions. That's where the money is.

Again, short term quarterly profits over long term strategy. Should have put the turnstyles back up at PI and not tried to copy citywalk.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Thought for future discussion...what is the possibility that the public could reach saturation point and this whole thing completely blow out on them. What if it has the opposite affect. Isn't that possible? Just for an example, I have nothing to back this up other then what I think, there are more people that stay offsite then onsite. (just thinking about numbers in parks as opposed to numbers of rooms available on site) Couldn't that cause more to stay offsite due to mind boggling planning requirements then not. Even if they offered more perks to those onsite, isn't there a point of diminishing returns for customers just as well as there is for providers?

You mean the point where we've maxed out the number of Disney fans willing to shell out $7k for a week at Disney? (Thats the number circulated I've heard that it costs, including transportation for a family of 4 to come here)

I think we've reached that point.

 

[luv]

But as I said in the other thread, these new planning tools go against what most of us with small children can do. Maybe it's just me but I can't see committing to being in a place in the park at a specific time with 2 toddlers. We already do not schedule table service meals.

That's an excellent point!

 

[Goofyernmost]

You mean the point where we've maxed out the number of Disney fans willing to shell out $7k for a week at Disney? (Thats the number circulated I've heard that it costs, including transportation for a family of 4 to come here)

I think we've reached that point.

Yup, that's what I mean. Just for comparison, in 2008 I brought my entire family for a vacation to WDW. There were 11 people on the trip. My two daughters, my two sons in law and my (at the time) three grandchildren plus my sister and my nephew. I purchased or provided the transportation of 9 of them (including myself). 7 round trip airfares from Vermont and 2, myself and friend, drove down. I rented a 6 bedroom villa just barely off property, bought 6 adult, non-expirational one park 7 day tickets and 3 children's (same), rented two other vehicles** making three available, including my own for the idea that we might not want to all go to the same place at the same time and the parking lot fees (I think $12.00 each back then) for all three cars when we used all three, which was most of the time. In case you have been counting (I truly doubt that you have) the other two that were in our group, my sister and nephew paid their own way. We all paid for our food separately so I'm not counting that other then my own and my girlfriends. We shared grocery expense for in-house groceries unless it was special requirement. The total for that 7 day, six night stay was $7200.00. At the time that I was planning that I also attempted to see if staying onsite was doable. I stopped counting when it hit $10,000.00 and never looked back. I was a long way from the end at that point.

At the time I had the money to spend it all at Disney, but I would/could not without my entire trip being ruined. I would have felt almost violated because frankly there wasn't sufficient return on the investment. I had the same fun time and never had to plan other then when we were going, how we were going to get there and how we were going to stay in contact. We all ended up going to the same parks on the same day, but, we didn't all go on the same rides or see the same thing or eat in the same place. When one of us decided to get something at counter service we would text the others and invite them to join us if they wanted, if not that was ok too. I don't see how any of that would be even remotely possible with the new improved Disney.

**Actually one of the car rentals was included in the villa rental, so just one extra! That's what I call a perk!

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

You mean the point where we've maxed out the number of Disney fans willing to shell out $7k for a week at Disney? (Thats the number circulated I've heard that it costs, including transportation for a family of 4 to come here)

I think we've reached that point.

$7K is about right for a deluxe/deluxe villa week vacation during non-peak with dining plan and airfare. Dare to travel outside of non-peak, and watch the numbers soar!

 

[luv]

You mean the point where we've maxed out the number of Disney fans willing to shell out $7k for a week at Disney? (Thats the number circulated I've heard that it costs, including transportation for a family of 4 to come here)

I think we've reached that point.

My sister decided to skip the whole "Lets go stay in a WDW hotel for a week!" thing this year. We all go for a week and then we come back to the house. She also skipped the APs and we spent more time at Uni, Sea World and water parks this year. We did do two nights at RPH.

She and I (more her, lol) are such dedicated fans that even though we can sleep for free, we still paid Disney prices to go stay there.

This year was the first year we said, "To heck with it. Not worth it." And that decision was made before the recent emotional turmoil. It was based on, "It's just too much now."