Spirited News and Observations and Opinions ...

[Pixiedustmaker]

I think your view is quite simplistic.

Having FP+ isn't going to speed up the loading and dispatch times of boats and coaster cars and Doombuggies at all. If it did, it would be increasing capacity on every attraction.

That's not happening. PoC isn't going to have more throughput every day because FP+ exists.

So, no, you don't just tap and ride. You tap and wait, which when you think about it isn't at all different from handing a FP to someone and waiting.

MagicBand will most likely decrease wait times in the following lines:

1. Entrance line.
2. Fast Pass lines.
3. ODV lines.
4. Cash register lines for merchandise.
5. Counter Service lines.

Even lines to get into the parking lot.

So, no, I didn't say anything about the wait in lines for attractions, but theoretically, a virtual queue is better than standing in a conventional line. It could work for certain attractions.

 

[WDW1974]

Ehh.. a MAJOR component of the MyMagic+ experience is.. suprise.. the MyMagic Experience WEBSITE. You know.. where people actually go and arrange their vacation? All ticket holders, including children, have profiles in this system. That is where COPPA comes into play. Oh, and we have those pesky mobile applications too. The online aspect is integral to the solution.

Additionally, COPPA has scope related to MARKETING to children.

So it very much is in play wrt MyMagic.

Well, at least you and I are on the same page here. Monty seems very confused, but with all that frigid weather up north, the heater on his igloo may not be working or may be letting carbon monoxide in.

Indeed, you are correct above.

I personally don't think it's a huge thing because basically the HIGH level message is.. you need parental consent. Ok, since we don't have many children under 13 visiting or planning trips to WDW without their parents.. I don't think it's a show stopper. The worst case scenario is maybe they didn't incorporate the controls and features in their products that they needed to comply with COPPA issues.. but that would be cost/time issues.. not that the whole system is going to run fowl of COPPA at it's core.

Actually, it is a huge thing. You want to know who hit the nail on the head? You did. NEXT GEN is all about interactivity and deriving revenue through a dynamic tech-based dialogue with all guests. Especially children under the age of 13. Sure, you could stop that dialogue. Cut the data stream ... stop the datamining, but then, why does NEXT GEN exist?

Parental consent, the requirement of all businesses under COPPA, tends to work at least somewhat effectively in a static enviornment. Everything behind the revenue modeling for NEXT GEN speaks to a dynamic ever-changing relationship between Disney and its consumers. Closely look at the now amended version of COPPA (which I strongly believe you already have as the man who posted about Disney needing to initiate Johnny Jr to act while usurping or subverting Johnny Sr), and tell me how you get around that dilemma.

 

[Lee]

Ah ... that's why Mark Zuckerberg and Facebook following a dong line of other 'new media' companies have dared not to go after children under the age of 13.

Heheheheh....you said dong....

And on the watch question...I wear one whenever I'm awake. Feels wrong without it.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

NEXT GEN is all about interactivity and deriving revenue through a dynamic tech-based dialogue with all guests. Especially children under the age of 13. Sure, you could stop that dialogue. Cut the data stream ... stop the datamining, but then, why does NEXT GEN exist?

Is this a rhetorical question or you literally don't understand how the MagicBands will make money?

Forget about the "data-mining", the big piece of cheese is making the vacation experience easier, which also allows guests to buy more stuff and be more likely to return. Its the same thing as Disney dollars, make spending in the parks a sort of fun activity, without the explicit signs of money changing hands. Plain and simple. I expect Disney to make millions off of this facet of the program alone.

Disney "data-mines" all the time when they put up turnstiles and do surveys. There are safeguards in this program, and they sure as heck won't be selling anybody's info to anybody else . . . too many barrels of money to be made.

 

[flynnibus]

Actually, it is a huge thing. You want to know who hit the nail on the head? You did. NEXT GEN is all about interactivity and deriving revenue through a dynamic tech-based dialogue with all guests. Especially children under the age of 13. Sure, you could stop that dialogue. Cut the data stream ... stop the datamining, but then, why does NEXT GEN exist?

Simple - COPPA doesn't say you CAN'T get and use this data - it says you must have consent before you do. It also doesn't limit sharing this data, again you just need consent.

Is it a dent in potential audiences if people say 'no you can't collect the data' and opt out? Sure - but is that going to be a significant portion? I would wager 'no' - but that's all opinion.

My comments about Johnny Jr were more about the comment that the child is the gold mine. I disagree with that because the child is not easily reached, and has trouble spending on their own. The gold mine is knowing Johnny Sr has a kid, and what his kid likes. Johnny Jr on his own is of limited value.. knowing the family demographic is a more complete picture and has a better chance of closing the deal. Kids watch ads, but just like every sales call.. your job is to identify who is the decision maker and if there is money available to spend. An interested party with no ability to buy is a nice audience, but no sales lead.

Everything behind the revenue modeling for NEXT GEN speaks to a dynamic ever-changing relationship between Disney and its consumers

Elaborate more here by what you mean by dynamic relationship? I'm curious to hear what you mean here and how it alters the relationship between Disney and the guest.

 

[WDW1974]

This. The whole COPPA debate is pretty much academic since they will be getting parental consent when the parents sign up little Billy and Jane for My Magic plus and FP+ reservations.

Um ... that's not how MyMagic+ was/is designed to work.

While @Lee addressed this as something academic I believe he was speaking for himself as he doesn't have children (Neville wasn't legally adopted). The COPPA debate in the context of Disney's NEXT GEN is far from academic.

COPPA doesn't allow parents to sign away blanket children's rights to things they may not even be aware of ... the interactivity of Disney is the dynamic part of this ... it's a dialogue. Who can predict where it will go? Disney hopes to. But no parent can give consent for the unknowable ... let's say Disney knows your child loves Nemo and is riding the clamshells and as soon as he/she exits, the child is prompted by name to purchase an item (plush, tee, pin etc) from the gift shop at the exit. And your little angel goes and spends $37.32 at said shop. The child has been contacted by the company multiple times in a matter of minutes and engaged as a consumer in a dynamic dialogue that you and your wife (having that lovely overpriced pasta lunch at Tutu Italia) have no control, knowledge or being a part of it.

That is the 'wittle bugaboo in the whole system. And that is the one that Disney really wants to exploit.

 

[WDW1974]

Ever had to sleep with a Coast to Coast wristband on? Blech

PS: before you let your charter lapse, can you grandfather me in as a same sex domestic partner???

No and, most definitely, no ... I have a line of fanbois who would kill for that status!

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Simple - COPPA doesn't say you CAN'T get and use this data - it says you must have consent before you do. It also doesn't limit sharing this data, again you just need consent.

Is it a dent in potential audiences if people say 'no you can't collect the data' and opt out? Sure - but is that going to be a significant portion? I would wager 'no' - but that's all opinion.

My comments about Johnny Jr were more about the comment that the child is the gold mine. I disagree with that because the child is not easily reached, and has trouble spending on their own. The gold mine is knowing Johnny Sr has a kid, and what his kid likes. Johnny Jr on his own is of limited value.. knowing the family demographic is a more complete picture and has a better chance of closing the deal. Kids watch ads, but just like every sales call.. your job is to identify who is the decision maker and if there is money available to spend. An interested party with no ability to buy is a nice audience, but no sales lead.

Elaborate more here by what you mean by dynamic relationship? I'm curious to hear what you mean here and how it alters the relationship between Disney and the guest.

The only way that the relationship, IMHO, can be changed is that the MagicBands can make it more personal. Eventually, you will be able to receive texts/notifications based on your touring plans/wants. You might get notified when, as somebody said, the ride for your FP breaks down AND there might be a list of potential disgruntled guests such that when you go to a restaurant the waiter apologizes for a ride being down, and perhaps offer you a free desert.

Maybe.

WDW74 loves the VIP perks he can get, and most guests do as well, so this is an opportunity to turn a faceless guest into a real living person with different needs/expectations from everybody else. I think most of this would be opt in, but there are some really nice moments that could arise when CMs use the tech to make a guest's stay more magical, IMHO.

 

[Hakunamatata]

This may have been discussed, but could Disney be recognizing that future generations are going to be so tied to their mobile device (from a wierd "cant live without it because its almost my companion" way) that they are integrating it into the experience now. Years from now when the current teens have grown up and are looking back on their fond memories of family vacations at WDW, they will remember how much fun they had with family and phone.....

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Um ... that's not how MyMagic+ was/is designed to work.

While @Lee addressed this as something academic I believe he was speaking for himself as he doesn't have children (Neville wasn't legally adopted). The COPPA debate in the context of Disney's NEXT GEN is far from academic.

COPPA doesn't allow parents to sign away blanket children's rights to things they may not even be aware of ... the interactivity of Disney is the dynamic part of this ... it's a dialogue. Who can predict where it will go? Disney hopes to. But no parent can give consent for the unknowable ... let's say Disney knows your child loves Nemo and is riding the clamshells and as soon as he/she exits, the child is prompted by name to purchase an item (plush, tee, pin etc) from the gift shop at the exit. And your little angel goes and spends $37.32 at said shop. The child has been contacted by the company multiple times in a matter of minutes and engaged as a consumer in a dynamic dialogue that you and your wife (having that lovely overpriced pasta lunch at Tutu Italia) have no control, knowledge or being a part of it.

That is the 'wittle bugaboo in the whole system. And that is the one that Disney really wants to exploit.

I doubt that would be put into effect as it sounds just too creepy. Disney doesn't need to hock most of the junk . . . errr wonderful merchandise in the parks, it is freakin' everywhere in case you haven't noticed. MagicBand is about concierge type service/experiences.

 

[flynnibus]

That is the 'wittle bugaboo in the whole system. And that is the one that Disney really wants to exploit.

Meh... it's not going to take volumes to describe WHAT info Disney collects, nor will it need to detail out in PRECISION how that data is used. The latter can be covered with sweeping terms and given examples.

Again - COPPA doesn't say Disney can't do the type of marketing or collecting that you described - only that it must get parental consent before doing so.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

The example being used for RFID in DLR is that Al Lutz, (or some very complaint-prone APers) shows up to Guest Relations and their name and rap list automatically pops up, red lights start flashing, and they call the manager who tells them to shove off because they are a known complainer.

Doesn't matter if a majority of APers want it or not (as long as it is opt-out, which it would be), if even a couple thousand APers are using it, then it speeds up the whole experience for everybody else. Less waiting to get into the parks, less waiting for food, and for fast pass.

APers *love* their wrist bands. Everytime I go to the park for a special event there a throng of APers with special wrist bands on, looking at me like, "Hey buddy! You got one of these!", they point at their wrist bands, "this is our park!"

Yeah, APers were happy to buy and wear glow with the show ears, they'll all have MagicBands in a year or so.

I don't see local APers liking this at all. Yeah, you get 20 FP+s. But one of the major reasons to have an AP is that you can wake up on Saturday morning and decide to go the WDW. But if you didn't plan you day trip 60 days in advance, those 20 FP+s are going to get you a lot of rides on Aladdin's Flying Carpets because resort guests that DID have their trip planned out a year in advance will have sucked up at the FP+s for the popular rides/restaurants like TSMM and Soarin' and Le Cellier. I actually see a lot of locals DROPPING their APs because they will be pretty much worthless unless you like the Flying Carpets and counter service meals.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

This may have been discussed, but could Disney be recognizing that future generations are going to be so tied to their mobile device (from a wierd "cant live without it because its almost my companion" way) that they are integrating it into the experience now. Years from now when the current teens have grown up and are looking back on their fond memories of family vacations at WDW, they will remember how much fun they had with family and phone.....

Agree^, same thoughts I've been having.

Disney is just ahead of the curve, IMHO, and I doubt Disney will do anything completely tacky/stupid/illegal as WDW74 believes. Contrary to his opinion, the folks running this aren't complete dullards, they have a cash cow and they'll use it wisely.

But if in 15 years everybody uses their cell phone to buy stuff, and if other theme parks offer special perks based on a user's characteristic, Disney will be ahead of the curve. Probably all of this will come to pass.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Empty Tables cannot always be filled. Short Staffing is a big problem they need to work on

I think that may have been his point.

 

[Hakunamatata]

But if in 15 years everybody uses their cell phone to buy stuff, and if other theme parks offer special perks based on a user's characteristic, Disney will be ahead of the curve. Probably all of this will come to pass.

I think I heard there are already places where you can buy stuff from vending machines with your cell phone.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

I don't see local APers liking this at all. Yeah, you get 20 FP+s. But one of the major reasons to have an AP is that you can wake up on Saturday morning and decide to go the WDW. But if you didn't plan you day trip 60 days in advance, those 20 FP+s are going to get you a lot of rides on Aladdin's Flying Carpets because resort guests that DID have their trip planned out a year in advance will have sucked up at the FP+s for the popular rides/restaurants like TSMM and Soarin' and Le Cellier. I actually see a lot of locals DROPPING their APs because they will be pretty much worthless unless you like the Flying Carpets and counter service meals.

Maybe. In the end, Fast Pass was put into place because guests, most non-APers, had a "must-see" ride that no matter happened on their vacation they had to see it, getting a Fast Pass was a sort of guarantee. Plus, there are the folks who don't want to wait long lines, no matter what.

In reality, FP+ just enables these folks so that they can get their reservation for Splash. I agree that waking up on the weekend and going to WDW on a whim is awesome, I used to do this myself! But if the Fast Passes are reserved way in advance, like days or weeks in advance for Splash, then presumably angry guests will complain and TDO will have to build more rides. MK is nothing compared to Disneyland given that there aren't nearly as many as rides, though you can see CoP and ride the PeopleMover.

I think MagicBand will draw so many more guests to the park because they can guarantee what they can get on, more guests is good, IMHO, as it puts more pressure on getting more rides built.

Right now FP+ would be nice at DLR as everybody and their cousin wants to ride RSR, and they have a line that stretches around the block for FP. For the must-see guests, they'd get to ride RSR.

 

[flynnibus]

I think I heard there are already places where you can buy stuff from vending machines with your cell phone.

common in asia - even before NFC was in phones. Doing things like buying via SMS, etc. Parking via mobile was big in Europe too before parking meters went the way of the dodo here in the states.

 

[kittybubbles]

Not so sure I'd agree with that, I certainly would like to use a MagicBand during my next visit. I could park hop easily, buy stuff super fast, such as snacks, meals, merchandise, all without having to scrounge around for my wallet. Think about how many interactions would become so much more easy:

1. Ticket entrance, maybe 2-3 times a day if you park hop.
3. Maybe 2-3 meals a day and snacks/drinks
4. Buying that special sweater in the Norway gift shop.

And not only do you save time getting out your wallet, but the whole stupid line moves so much faster!

There's also the psychological factor of whipping out a $50/credit cards for drinks and popcorn for the group, yes, the monetary amount doesn't change with the MagicBand, but I think some guests wouldn't want to think about how Disney takes advantage of guests every time they buy a drink.

Call me crazy, but I think I'll love the MagicBand thing and hope that it comes to DLR.

Maybe I am wrong, but based on the way they require you to ask for the Disney Visa card discount today when using the card (it is not automatic if you do not ask for it, you do not get it), I am certain that you would still need to take out your paper copy of your AP or find your Chase Disney card to show them if you'd like any discounts you might be entitled to which might just alienate some customers...but I guess they figure folks would forget or get tired of that and just not bother.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Maybe I am wrong, but based on the way they require you to ask for the Disney Visa card discount today when using the card (it is not automatic if you do not ask for it, you do not get it), I am certain that you would still need to take out your paper copy of your AP or find your Chase Disney card to show them if you'd like any discounts you might be entitled to which might just alienate some customers...but I guess they figure folks would forget or get tired of that and just not bother.

Hmm. I wasn't thinking about discounts, but I'm sure the system could be adjust so that if you have a discount coming you'll get it. I get about a 20% discount on food/merch. in the parks (DLR), but I have to show my special little card to get it. I can see they might not make it automatic, but having MagicBand would mean I have to get out just one card, instead of fumbling with two.

 

[GoofGoof]

Um ... that's not how MyMagic+ was/is designed to work.

While @Lee addressed this as something academic I believe he was speaking for himself as he doesn't have children (Neville wasn't legally adopted). The COPPA debate in the context of Disney's NEXT GEN is far from academic.

COPPA doesn't allow parents to sign away blanket children's rights to things they may not even be aware of ... the interactivity of Disney is the dynamic part of this ... it's a dialogue. Who can predict where it will go? Disney hopes to. But no parent can give consent for the unknowable ... let's say Disney knows your child loves Nemo and is riding the clamshells and as soon as he/she exits, the child is prompted by name to purchase an item (plush, tee, pin etc) from the gift shop at the exit. And your little angel goes and spends $37.32 at said shop. The child has been contacted by the company multiple times in a matter of minutes and engaged as a consumer in a dynamic dialogue that you and your wife (having that lovely overpriced pasta lunch at Tutu Italia) have no control, knowledge or being a part of it.

That is the 'wittle bugaboo in the whole system. And that is the one that Disney really wants to exploit.

I say it's academic because while its an interesting debate I don't see this bringing the system down. I'm no expert on COPPA but there are so many loopholes in most laws that I don't think they will have an issue finding a way around it. Probably already have that worked out with the lawyers. From my limited understanding even if a parent gives consent (which I do believe would be accomplished by signing your kids up) they have the right to know what information is being collected and have the right to either block the collection of that data in the future or request it to be deleted. This would have to be spelled out in terms and conditions along with a way to request this info in order for Disney to comply. Who really is going to read all of the terms and conditions? Not many and if people do how many will request more info? Even fewer. This is why I see it as mostly academic. The biggest hit will be bad PR IMHO.