Soarin' and The Land changes - what is your opinion?

[PhotoDave219]

Boy, that looks like a mandate to me.

 

[Wckd Queen]

I think the newly styled pavilion is a breath of fresh air! My last visit, I felt like I had entered a time warp back to the 80s. All that I was missing were some leg warmers and big hair :lol: It just looked old.

I think that updates like this are good for EPCOT because it keeps it fresh and alive. The new colors are welcoming and lively. The space is utilized rather than wasted. In all honesty, while the fountain was very pretty, I didnt see how it fit the "theme", if you will, of the food court. It just felt like any mall food court.

And the new thrill ride? Just the thing to infuse new life and energy into EPCOT

 

[KevinPage]

Option: Yes, I think the addition of Soarin' [is] a good thing, [but I do not prefer airport theming which exists starting on the bottom half of the pavilion to the original or potential].
Reasoning: NOT because it looks bad... (it actually looks good - for a Trendy airport or for a shopping mall).
My thoughts can be explained in Buzzy's article: http://www.d-troops.com/articles.php?id=485
...but is it The Land?

OY VEY is all I can say.

The best part of the rehab is that it makes D-TRoops and Grizz "eat crow" whether they'll admit it or not. :lol: :lol: :lol:

:drevil: :drevil: :drevil:

 

[figmentfan]

I rode Soarin 4 times last weekend for the AP Preview. Everybody going or coming from The Land Pavilion was VERY HAPPY! Soarin will make a good addition to Epcot. A very nice attraction that everybody in the family can do.

I was worried myself about the revamped Land Pavilion. I like the pavilion the way it was, but I was very happy with the progress they made. Brings the pavilion into the 21st century. To me, the airport themeing is nice, and it fits in with the Land. I also notice that they also kept the mission statement of the Land, the Symbosis plaque (the old golden diamond shape plaque.)

I think we as extreme Disney fans, sometimes look at the bad of things that Disney does. Disney took an important Epcot pavilion and did not destroy it, but updated it and made it nice for all memebers of the family. Now people can spend probably over 3 hours in the Land pavilion. See the Circle of Life movie, have lunch at the Seasons or Garden Grill, and enjoy a family moment on Living With the Land and Soarin.

Enjoy the new Land Pavilion and of course the new ride, Soarin!

 

[Testtrack321]

A better question may be how is it not related to the Land? Forget the preconceived notion that an airport theme was being overlaid on the pavilion. The reality is only the Soarin’ addition took on an airport theme. One which, by the way, is exceptionally done with natural wood ceilings, wooden wall decorations, curved and flowing lines along the walls and along the ceilings, blue natural lighting and one room with a beautiful, almost cloud-like ceiling. Not to mention the five large panoramic views of Earth’s biomes in the Great Hall with its ever-changing number of questions and factoids about them to entertain and educate guests waiting in line. Is the airport theme that embraces these natural elements any less appropriate than a rock n’ roll concert theatre/venue that was part of the former pavilion? I find it hard you could argue it did.

Back to the rest of the pavilion. The entire central portion now has a greater, more cohesive theme of “ the land” than ever before. Is it a little less "earthy", perhaps, but is that all that would make it appropriate? I realize we all agree the atrium/ceiling works very well, so I’ll spare the regurgitation of how it works for the Land pavilion. The bottom floor though is no more an airport terminal than the old food court was something you could see in a dated shopping mall. If you went in looking for it to be that way, you could easily find evidence of it on both sides. After all, in the former pavilion, the farmer’s market theme dealt more with the “food” and less with “the land”. Now let’s look at the new pavilion for what it presents as a total package. Forget the biased idea it looks like an airport and for a second stop trying to see how it does, because there is SO much more there. We now have an entire experience from the food to the seating areas to the atrium that all deal with the land’s four seasons, integral to the way the land is shaped on a yearly basis and affecting how man can interact with it. The seating areas are decked out in bright bold colors representing each season. The tables further that themeing as they are imprinted with various images depicting that particular season. Fall leaves decorate the autumn tables and suns on the tables in the summer section depict the summer. Coupled with the curved lines used throughout, dark, natural looking wood chairs that actually have a back to them surround all tables. This is in stark contrast to the small, backless, stools of the former pavilion. These new chairs and the surrounding benches may actually let guests sit back and relax for once and take in the beautiful atrium. And then there is the food, continuing the experience of the seasons and the land with tastes and smells representative of each season. How did the food at the old farmer’s market extend the theme of the land beyond the food and the notion it was grown from the land? I'm not convinced yet it did.

The central part of the pavilion then takes the experience to a new level and gives the pavilion its “Future”/modern look, as it is part of FUTURE world afterall. Modern art representations and bright open colors are complemented with representations of green tree trunks along the pavilion’s columns and lighting structures that represent either clouds or trees….whatever the eye wants to see, it all has to do with The Land in the end.

Please understand I see, respect and undertand your points of view. Vaild arguments have been made. I only ask that you forget trying to prove it looks like an airport terminal by using fragmented, one-sided quotes from mostly forum members here, one-sided views and deceiving “photos” and talk about the theme that’s there. I even saw something in the recent D-troops article that is a DIRECT quote from something I said here regarding the hope for more seasonal themeing to indicate which food serving area is what. It's true, I do, but it comes nowhere close to representing my true feelings on the new look of the pavilion and, for me, proof of the one-sided bias nature of the review and even may bring into the question the credibility and reliability of the D-troops for good reviews (for me at least). Its only my background knowledge of many of the founders of that site (mainly from our history here) that keep me knowing you all want to have the best intentions. I don't expect for us all to share the same viewpoints, but it wouldn't hurt to provide a balanced perspective at the forefront and not just in an editorial down the road. The pavilion has more to do with the land than you seem to want to give credit for.

CTXRover, no, don't hold back, tell us how you really feel! :lol:

Well, let me tell you this, i agree with CTXRover, and I have something for Grizz. This pavilion is amazing as it is now, it's very well themed and amazing. BUT IT'S NOT DONE. Remeber the M:S que, and how things were added to it after it opened? Grizz, there are more important things to worry about (CoP, Timekeeper, Stich) than The Land. It's obvious WDI did a good job and the metal railings you always complain about are just as un-Land like as the colored pavement from previous incarnations of the land.

 

[jmuboy]

<!--StartFragment -->People who have been inside themselves, please correct me. But from what i have seen in the tons of pictures that came out this weekend is:

The flight / airport terminal theme is apparent in the Soarin' queue. This is fine in my opinion, as it fits the "flight" element of the ride. However, I don't think the building's new interior really screams airport terminal...especially to the average gust. Yes, it is more modern with sleeker lines. But still, not necessarily an airport.

On a somewhat related note, what will the new uniforms look like for the other areas of the pavilion?

 

[figmentfan]

Hey, jmuboy..........

I have been the Land Pavilion, and from what you saw on the photos are right. The airport themeing is only around the Soarin area. Also, I saw some Living With the Land CMs being trained, and the uniforms are the same as they were before the Land closed.

 

[AndyP]

I think the new pictures look great and I'm eally impressed. Last visit in 2004, we went to The Land beacuse we wanted to try things we hadn't done in a long time, obviously it previously hadn't stuck in our minds as a must see. Living with the land was good, and the food was too, since we at while waiting for our Fastpass slot. However, I thought the foodcourt was awful in look(ok maybe not awful, thats a bit strong), really outdated and uncomfortable fr everyone. The plastic umbrellas above the tables took away from the whole atmosphere and it felt crammed. The new land is updated, and heck, with all the great improvements, I'm not going to gripe oe metal rails rather than wood, the railings match the pavilion, and as long as everything is themed (I don't like cost cutting), I'd rather the wooden rail money jumped over to WoL (it needs gutting). Furthermore, FUTURE world, is now looking like future world. The Land, M:S and Test Track (ok, TT is more modern, but its not outdated and won't date quickly!!), hopefully WoL will continue this fantastic revamp of EPCOT! One final point, WITH the neon and 3D, I think the Soarin' sign now looks good! The Land will no longer be a time filler, its a must see for everyone.

Well done WDI, keep up the good work!

 

[jeanylaser031]

the addition of soarin because the land has changed because disney wants to.

 

[its_my_friday]

I agree that the addition of Soarin' is great and will give The Land more attention, but I must say that I am not all happy with the changes made to The Land itself. It is definitely good to send the pavilion into the next couple years, but I liked it before. I think the biggest things that I will miss are the cute umbrella tables and the fountain in the middle. Ah well, things can't alway stay the same and at least they are leaving the pavilion, unlike other Epcot attractions that are no longer existing.

 

[Buzzy989]

Is it just me or was there a much simpler solution to this retheming. Why did they have to go a concentrate on the flying aspect of Soarin, when the ride is about stunning vistas and mother nature. They didn't have to figure out a way to tie the airport theming to the broader land pavillion. They could have changed the theming for soarin to a more land friendly theme and kept the feel and ideals of the land intact.

The land is about nature...it is supposed to have an organic feel to it. These modernized and mechanized "representations of nature just don't sit righ with me. Metal and plastic don't have to be the only vision of the future used in future world. With a little imagination an organic future can be visualized that would have been a nice counterpoint to the "futuristic visions" over on the otherside of future world.

Very well said, BrerVeritas! Soarin' has the remarkable capability of fitting in with the rest of the pavilion - - appreciation of our natural resources and the beauty of our environment. Remember, also, that it's a simulation of a "hang-glider" experience, not an airplane ride. Why did Disney go all-out and give The Land an airport terminal theme? It's more edgy and modern. But it does not instill any respect for our natural resources or the beauty of the natural world! We see some basic, bare-bones theming elements: sure, the metallic light poles look a little bit like trees, and the table tops have images of leaves and other season-related things. But the overall feeling and atmosphere is not one of nature's lushness, nature's serenity, or nature's beauty. It's cute, but not as inspiring, enriching, or meaningful as theming we have seen in the past.

The Land is no longer "intact." You have Living with the Land in a world of its own, separated from the vastly different atmosphere of the main lower level - - it's evident that Disney's efforts to create symbiosis within the pavilion were less than half-hearted. Also, what type of impression do the steamlined, metallic elements of the pavilion make? Why the metallic industrial-like railings? They sure fit into an airport, but they have nothing to do with The Land. Man's imposing on the land and its beauty, sure. But nothing to do with the natural beauty and harmony of the land that nourishes and sustains us. The new decor's connections to the theme and the heart of the land are slim and strained, and I agree with you, BrerVeritas, that the designers should have "kept the feel and ideals of The Land intact."

Buzzy

 

[Wckd Queen]

Ok, I never do this, but I am curious. I want to play devils advocate here.

Let me ask this of those who are unhappy with the new interior: What, in the original Land pavilion, did the fountain amid the generic tables/chairs/umbrellas of the food court have to do with the theme of the Land? How did the interior of that pavilion convey The Land?

 

[Epcot82Guy]

ooh ooh! Me! Me! (just kidding - I used to tell guests this all the time). The SUnshine Seasons Food Fair (so technically not the original, but close enough) represented a forest floor basically. You were under the sun (represented by the windows and balloons which had the "sun" symbolized all over them). The umbrellas represented individual suns themselves (why they were lighted). The tables were to represent the plants and fungi that gave us food (hence why stools instead of chairs because they looked more mushroom like, so more earthy). Then the carpeting represented the fallen leaves on the floor that lead into the cycle. The fountain was the center of the pavilion because the whole system basically requires the interaction of things with light and water (so where light and water met). The design represented abstractly leaf and seed shapes since that powered the system of photosynthesis, which sustains life on this planet. The music, finally, represented the cycle of sun and moon (titles) that also keep the system going.

As a whole, the entire thing was based on cycles that keep The Land operating.

 

[Wckd Queen]

ooh ooh! Me! Me! (just kidding - I used to tell guests this all the time). The SUnshine Seasons Food Fair (so technically not the original, but close enough) represented a forest floor basically. You were under the sun (represented by the windows and balloons which had the "sun" symbolized all over them). The umbrellas represented individual suns themselves (why they were lighted). The tables were to represent the plants and fungi that gave us food (hence why stools instead of chairs because they looked more mushroom like, so more earthy). Then the carpeting represented the fallen leaves on the floor that lead into the cycle. The fountain was the center of the pavilion because the whole system basically requires the interaction of things with light and water (so where light and water met). The design represented abstractly leaf and seed shapes since that powered the system of photosynthesis, which sustains life on this planet. The music, finally, represented the cycle of sun and moon (titles) that also keep the system going.
As a whole, the entire thing was based on cycles that keep The Land operating.

Thanks, Epcot82Guy! That's very cool and very interresting!

But, now I am going to play devils advocate once again (yeah..Im bored at work :lol: ) I now want to ask how many folks generally knew that? Heres why: I have been in that pavilion myself several times, and never knew that or even got that feeling of "symbiosis" (although I did know about what the balloons represented :lol: ) Was anyone able to discern this meaning from the interior decor, or was this something you generally wouldnt get unless you asked a CM specifically?

 

[Computer Magic]

I can't wait to see the new Land and ride Soarin'.

 

[speck76]

Thanks, Epcot82Guy! That's very cool and very interresting!

But, now I am going to play devils advocate once again (yeah..Im bored at work :lol: ) I now want to ask how many folks generally knew that? Heres why: I have been in that pavilion myself several times, and never knew that or even got that feeling of "symbiosis" (although I did know about what the balloons represented :lol: ) Was anyone able to discern this meaning from the interior decor, or was this something you generally wouldnt get unless you asked a CM specifically?

Chances are....less than .001%.

If WDC starts making decisions based on what that .001% want, we are all screwed!

 

[HauntedPirate]

Since I haven't seen pictures of the interior, and won't be there for.... 12 more days, I'll be withholding judgment for now.

However, I can almost guarantee that we won't be eating at the new food court. None of the food items listed sounds the least bit appetizing to me. I much preferred the options available at the old food court, because it appeared as though you couldn't get many of those items at your resort food courts. And that's what made it nice. Hated the multiple lines, but loved the food choices.

 

[DarkMeasures]

I absolutly love the new design. It brings back the future of Future World in a different way than what Mission Space and Test Track did. It is also more than just an update, it is beautiful and very cultured update. The Curves of the seating area, the carpet, the trees, everything blends in a way reflectful of Nature, the Future, and Art. All 3 go well together and I feel the pavilian is now in much better shape than that outdated 80's concrete style that lingered through on the 94 rehab.

I am also glad the nuitrition aspect is gone. Nature itself is much more important and what Soarin allows is the fact that a new video can be shot and filmed every few years much like Circlevision was like before Timekeeper.

I do have 2 things I was not pleased in though there are actually nothing wrong with these 2 things.

Curtains- I understand the gold but I always felt the ceiling looked bare with the curtains. What needs to be done is something needs to be placed behind the curtains to fill the space. Otherwise the ceiling is displeasing too look at due to the emptyness.

Walls- All 1 shade. I would personally like to see complex designs or other things on these walls. The same reason as before. To giving a filling space. The number 1 reason I think why old Future World buildings seem out of date is because there is so much of a lack in detail in the buildings altogether compared to what the newer buildings have.

 

[Buzzy989]

ooh ooh! Me! Me! (just kidding - I used to tell guests this all the time). The SUnshine Seasons Food Fair (so technically not the original, but close enough) represented a forest floor basically.

Very good insights, Epcot82Guy! But the former theming represented symbiosis in an even more general, more apparent sense. The elements of nature as represented in the "old land" (flowing water, suns and flowers on the table canopies) were a lot more richly and deeply colored and provided a more celebratory view of nature. It was playful and joyous, and it had its own sense of liveliness and humor. What we see today is less joyous and lively but more stylish and modern - - without the same *unique* charms.

The Sunshine Season Food Fair was also more "homey," and its theming represented a more intimate connection between man and the land. The stations were set up like farmhouses, painted with images of vegetables, and gave a sense of nostalgia in recalling old country-style food markets. The pavilion played to the past in this way, but in a good sense! Our most harmonious relationships with the land occurred long ago during the age of the farmer - - and the pavilion was meant to showcase new technologies and new ways of obtaining our food supply, but also while showing us how to keep that same respect for our land. This is the source of the *joy* of the older pavilion. The new theming doesn't show the "simple life," the essential harmonious relationship between men and women and the land they depend on. The theming was influenced by gardening, also - - and gardening is an art that still carries with it a respect for the land's beauty.

The new theming is not in tune with this homey, intimate sort of spirit. The new food court is contemporary and "fast-paced" in its design, no longer hearkening back to the more rich relationships that we enjoyed with our land. The pavilion continues to focus on new technologies and still offers a tour of the greenhouses via Living with the Land, yet it is this "simple life" spirit that the new pavilion lacks and yet truly needs to convey its full message. Everything looks white, clean, and industrialized. We have the concept of "modernity," but we lack that relaxed, simple life, earth-connected atmosphere. The decor is more streamlined - - patterns on the table, colored carpet, tree-like light structures. . . but the pavilion lacks the old sincerity and depth of spirit with the complete change in decor and theme.

The old pavilion was one of simple pleasures. The music was folksy and relaxing, and while there were crowds at times, the crowdedness was balanced with a serene fountain and a sense of peacefulness conveyed by the deep, rich colors and the "homey" ambience. But when the new pavilion becomes crowded, there will be little to balance the frantic elements. There is little that is lively or joyful or nourishing in the new whiteness or metallic flourishes. The benches that were around throughout the 1980s and 1990s on the upper level have been removed. Why? Because The Land is no longer the enriching place to relax and ponder and enjoy the truly simple pleasures. The style reflects the modern pace of life, and the new food court looks like most others in an airport terminal: FUNCTIONAL rather than conveying deep thematic meaning or significance.

The quality of life has completely changed, and The Land has lost an important part of its message. The simple, beautiful, intimate relationships with our land are no longer part of the atmosphere, and it will be a tremendous loss to the pavilion and its important, nourishing, mind-and-soul-feeding message of symbiosis.

 

[MrNonacho]

The quality of life has completely changed, and The Land has lost an important part of its message. The simple, beautiful, intimate relationships with our land are no longer part of the atmosphere, and it will be a tremendous loss to the pavilion and its important, nourishing, mind-and-soul-feeding message of symbiosis.

I don't think they carried that message all that well, since so many people failed to pick up on it. It's not a big loss as far as I'm concerned.