So, You Want to be an Imagineer Season 18 HYPE THREAD!

mickeyfan5534

Well-Known Member
omg...
I'm honestly not mad. Not anywhere near as mad or eyeroll-y as I thought it'd be. Splash is an all-time classic for sure but I think there's clear passion behind this and the fact the creative team is being led by two black women (which I don't think has EVER happened) who clearly hold this film dearly in their hearts and there's a clear line of love and adoration behind this ride. Splash's time has come. Princess and the Frog has been around long enough to cement itself as a classic and is just as worthy of holding down an E-ticket headliner. Long story short I'm in favor.
 

TwilightZone

Well-Known Member
The thread for the news reminds me why I don't check outside of the imagineer stuff much anymore.
I think this news is great, and to cross post what I put earlier in the thread people wanted something like this to happen. I'm honestly a bit baffled of the negativity going on in there.
Also it's a reminder how bubbly the community can be for a lack of a better word. I have two friends, one of which who is super into defunctland, who are excited for this news.
 

NigelChanning

Well-Known Member
I’m going to miss Splash Mountain but I understand that this needs to be done. I’m excited for Tiana to get her own attraction but I’m curious as to how she’ll fit into Frontierland at WDW?
 

Pi on my Cake

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
omg...
I'll post more full thoughts later, but I think this is a dumb move using the current climate to disguise a cheap cash grap IP overlay of a classic. If this was about inclusivity or racism, they would've fixed the mistakes of the past and given the Brers a proper adaptation by black creators instead of erasing one of the last examples of African folklore in pop culture. Remember, Brer Rabbit pre-dates Song of the South and could have easily been updated to outlive it if this was about inclusivity. The whole IP could've been reclaimed and become a celebration of the folklore of early African Americans instead of just being forgotten and hidden away.

No. This is Mission Break Out or Incredi-Coaster with a timed announcement for good PR. And I think visually and thematically that concept art is a poor fit for it's location at WDW. It doesn't look like it will blend into the surrounding area and the jazz music the movie is known for won't flow with the country/folk/western music Fronteirland is known for. This is a shoehorned in IP that they'll probably bend to fit just enough like GotG in Epcot.

Don't get me wrong, I love PatF and think it deserves a ride. And I understand the reasoning behind this decision. And I'm sure the new ride will be great (Tony Baxter is involved which is always a good sign and there is clearly a ton of passion). But I fully disagree with this decision and think it is dumb and I don't give Disney any progressive brownie points for this when they could have actually fixed mistakes of the past rather than just pretend they never happened.
 

NateD1226

Well-Known Member
I'm so thrilled for this ride. As I have stated many times before, PATF is my favorite disney movie haha. Everything about it is perfect! So I don't mind seeing Tiana take over Splash. She is finally getting the recognition she deserves.
 

pix

Well-Known Member
I'll post more full thoughts later, but I think this is a dumb move using the current climate to disguise a cheap cash grap IP overlay of a classic. If this was about inclusivity or racism, they would've fixed the mistakes of the past and given the Brers a proper adaptation by black creators instead of erasing one of the last examples of African folklore in pop culture. Remember, Brer Rabbit pre-dates Song of the South and could have easily been updated to outlive it if this was about inclusivity. The whole IP could've been reclaimed and become a celebration of the folklore of early African Americans instead of just being forgotten and hidden away.

No. This is Mission Break Out or Incredi-Coaster with a timed announcement for good PR. And I think visually and thematically that concept art is a poor fit for it's location at WDW. It doesn't look like it will blend into the surrounding area and the jazz music the movie is known for won't flow with the country/folk/western music Fronteirland is known for. This is a shoehorned in IP that they'll probably bend to fit just enough like GotG in Epcot.

Don't get me wrong, I love PatF and think it deserves a ride. And I understand the reasoning behind this decision. And I'm sure the new ride will be great (Tony Baxter is involved which is always a good sign and there is clearly a ton of passion). But I fully disagree with this decision and think it is dumb and I don't give Disney any progressive brownie points for this when they could have actually fixed mistakes of the past rather than just pretend they never happened.

It feels very much like companies that make everything come in rainbow for June and then not give a sh*t any other time of the year and it is completely messing with the mountains of the park which is a huge staple of the Castle parks. Not a fan.
 

NigelChanning

Well-Known Member
I think the area surrounding Splash Mountain at Disneyland should be incorporated into New Orleans Square and the rest of Critter Country should just become the Hundred Acre Wood from Winnie the Pooh.
 

mickeyfan5534

Well-Known Member
I'll post more full thoughts later, but I think this is a dumb move using the current climate to disguise a cheap cash grap IP overlay of a classic. If this was about inclusivity or racism, they would've fixed the mistakes of the past and given the Brers a proper adaptation by black creators instead of erasing one of the last examples of African folklore in pop culture. Remember, Brer Rabbit pre-dates Song of the South and could have easily been updated to outlive it if this was about inclusivity. The whole IP could've been reclaimed and become a celebration of the folklore of early African Americans instead of just being forgotten and hidden away.

No. This is Mission Break Out or Incredi-Coaster with a timed announcement for good PR. And I think visually and thematically that concept art is a poor fit for it's location at WDW. It doesn't look like it will blend into the surrounding area and the jazz music the movie is known for won't flow with the country/folk/western music Fronteirland is known for. This is a shoehorned in IP that they'll probably bend to fit just enough like GotG in Epcot.

Don't get me wrong, I love PatF and think it deserves a ride. And I understand the reasoning behind this decision. And I'm sure the new ride will be great (Tony Baxter is involved which is always a good sign and there is clearly a ton of passion). But I fully disagree with this decision and think it is dumb and I don't give Disney any progressive brownie points for this when they could have actually fixed mistakes of the past rather than just pretend they never happened.

The problem with that position (and if any of our Black members would correct me if I'm wrong or confirm if I'm correct) is Black people largely DESPISE the Uncle Remus stories. Their entry into popular culture was a white man stealing stories from black women, collecting them into a book under the thin veil of a "black" character written in a vernacular that was stereotypical even then, and profiting from it without giving anything back to the community he took those stories from. The fact of the matter is, African American Folklore (ESPECIALLY in the South) is so much more than Uncle Remus and for all we know, Disney is working on an animated film based on those other stories. Tiana is by-and-large one of the most beloved Disney Princesses and Princess and the Frog has proven its worth to hold an E-ticket. Song of the South has had its moment. Splash Mountain has had its moment. It's time to move on.

Ultimately, look at the response from the Black community:


(^ this one's a thread)




I'm not accusing you of anything. You said yourself, Tiana is absolutely deserving of a ride and I'm somewhat in agreement that PatF deserves better than a retheme. But I think this is a change that will be for the better.
 

Pi on my Cake

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
The problem with that position (and if any of our Black members would correct me if I'm wrong or confirm if I'm correct) is Black people largely DESPISE the Uncle Remus stories. Their entry into popular culture was a white man stealing stories from black women, collecting them into a book under the thin veil of a "black" character written in a vernacular that was stereotypical even then, and profiting from it without giving anything back to the community he took those stories from. The fact of the matter is, African American Folklore (ESPECIALLY in the South) is so much more than Uncle Remus and for all we know, Disney is working on an animated film based on those other stories. Tiana is by-and-large one of the most beloved Disney Princesses and Princess and the Frog has proven its worth to hold an E-ticket. Song of the South has had its moment. Splash Mountain has had its moment. It's time to move on.

Ultimately, look at the response from the Black community:


(^ this one's a thread)




I'm not accusing you of anything. You said yourself, Tiana is absolutely deserving of a ride and I'm somewhat in agreement that PatF deserves better than a retheme. But I think this is a change that will be for the better.

I learned the history of Brer Rabbit and how it pre-dates Uncle Remus and Song of the South from black Disney fans and fellow cast members back when I worked there. It was what turned me onto the idea of reclaim over replace in the first place. Of course, we're both just two white guys debating what we think black people would want based on something we've heard from black people in the community we don't personally know. So, neither of us can claim any authority really.

I never put too much stock in Twitter reactions since it is a site with a notoriously terrible, over-reactionary community. Especially the much maligned DisTwitter community. The reaction I've seen from POC friends and Disney fans of mine has been significantly more mixed. Same on other social media sites. Even if mostly everyone gets it, not everyone agrees this was the best course of action. Even Twitter gets more mixed in the reactions for POC Disney fans once you get past the top layer of popular influencers and overwhelmingly majority of white people trending. Heck, even what you posted, two were the same guy and two were just about a PatF ride with no real connection to Splash itself.

I do understand and fully agree that something had to be done to address Splash Mountain and it's heritage. I just don't think this was the best option for that and that Disney is just using the current to cover up the backlash of replacing a classic, (essentially) IP ride with a much more marketable and merchandisable IP that doesn't fit the land it is in. Modern Disney Imagineerings go to move that always gets significant backlash, but now Disney can hide behind looking progressive.
 
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Pi on my Cake

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
I learned the history of Brer Rabbit and how it pre-dates Uncle Remus and Song of the South from black Disney fans and fellow cast members back when I worked there. It was what turned me onto the idea of reclaim over replace in the first place. Of course, we're both just two white guys debating what we think black people would want based on something we've heard from black people in the community we don't personally know. So, neither of us can claim any authority really.

I never put too much stock in Twitter reactions since it is a site with a notoriously terrible, over-reactionary community. Especially the much maligned DisTwitter community. The reaction I've seen from POC friends and Disney fans of mine has been significantly more mixed. Even Twitter gets more mixed in the reactions for POC Disney fans once you get past the top layer of popular influencers.

I do understand and fully agree that something had to be done to address Splash Mountain and it's heritage. I just don't think this was the best option for that and that Disney is just using the current to cover up the backlash of replacing a classic, (essentially) IP ride with a much more marketable and merchandisable IP that doesn't fit the land it is in. Modern Disney Imagineerings go to move that always gets significant backlash, but now Disney can hide behind looking progressive.
Again, I have no doubt in my mind the new ride will be fantastic even if it clashes with the surrounding area (Splash was not a perfect fit either, but it did fit visually and tonally. Plus, the music and time period lined up a LOT better). I just feel this is Mission Break Out on both coasts disguised as something progressive. Rather than actually trying to address the issues and fix past mistakes or do better.
 

DisneyManOne

Well-Known Member
The thread for the news reminds me why I don't check outside of the imagineer stuff much anymore.
I think this news is great, and to cross post what I put earlier in the thread people wanted something like this to happen. I'm honestly a bit baffled of the negativity going on in there.
Also it's a reminder how bubbly the community can be for a lack of a better word. I have two friends, one of which who is super into defunctland, who are excited for this news.
Someone actually made a thread on Twitter detailing some of the worst takes other WDWMagic users have had regarding this news. Spoiler alert: quite a few of them are racist.


It's not like Splash fit into Frontierland all that well in the first place.
Agreed. Going from a typical Western town to the Deep South isn't exactly that strong a theming transition.
 

TwilightZone

Well-Known Member
Someone actually made a thread on Twitter detailing some of the worst takes other WDWMagic users have had regarding this news. Spoiler alert: quite a few of them are racist.


bleh! looks like I got some people to ignore.

Agreed. Going from a typical Western town to the Deep South isn't exactly that strong a theming transition.
Looking back on the mountain something about it looks just fake and plasticy. I know the final product never turns out like the concept art, but tiana mountain as I am calling it looks gorgeous and a definite step up.
 

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