Security at Epcot

[celluloid]

The easiest way to get out of the Epcot Security check after already going through the TTC is merely leap out if the monorail doors as they conveniently open over the park.

 

[MAGICFLOP]

I don't really give a rats behind that you're inconvenienced by waiting an extra 30 minutes. I'd rather the parks be safe. If you don't like it, then go to Maui instead.

What are you willing to give up for a false sense of security? Would you been willing to submit to intense scrutiny ? Perhaps if Disney required a security inspection of your home, you know just know who is really coming into the parks? Perhaps submit a complete online trail of where you go on the net? Perhaps they can check if you have a gun permit? You just so that they can guarantee everyone's safety.

I know my examples are extreme, but my point is WDW has to be somewhere between walking into that park not even observed to intense 6 month pre investigation of all aspects of you life before you can enter.

So for you to rudely pelt someone for not subscribing to your interpretation of security needs is not fair. Maybe your OK with the 6 month intrusive check, but I draw the line.

As for myself, I recognize the fact that I am the first and primary security / defense for my family, no matter where I am. Anyone who off loads their security to others are at societies mercy. Sadly the kids at Parkland found that out with deputies in ear shot of gun fire..

 

[PeakSeason]

So at what point would you say the security would be excessive? Right now if you take the monorail from the Poly to Epcot, you are screened twice, once when boarding the monorail at the resort then before going into Epcot. If the also had security checks when you change monorail at the TTC, is that OK with you? What if they had a security check at the exit of the monorail as well? So you would go through 4 security checks on the way to the park?

The original point about the thread was that Epcot is checking people who were already considered "safe". They were checked before getting on the monorail in the first place. These people should be separated from the "unchecked" people at Epcot and be allowed to go directly to the turnstiles. (Like how the MK is currently configured.)

We are planning a monorail resort, pub crawl of sorts, on our next trip. We're staying at Boardwalk, thought we'd enter through International Gateway, walk to the front of Epcot, board the monorail to TTC, then take the resort monorail stopping at Polynesian, Grand Floridian, and Contemporary, each for about an hour and a half. We would probably take a cab at the end of the night. Does this plan mean we go through bag check and security 3 times? or is it even more than that?

 

[larryz]

Does this plan mean we go through bag check and security 3 times? or is it even more than that?

Nothing makes security more fun than going thru it snockered.

 

[_caleb]

I’m disappointed in this discussion. It’s clear to me that some of you don’t like the bag checks. But other than complaining about infringement and posturing as defenders, I don’t understand the thinking. I’m really trying here, but nobody seems interested in explaining.

As far as I can tell, some folks think the security checks are a necessary inconvenience. It’s part of what Disney does in their attempts to mitigate threats to guests in the park.

On the other side are those who clearly don’t think Disney should have bag checks at all. That argument, as far as I can tell, focused on:

• What we have to give up (still not sure: maybe time? Privacy?)
• The failure rate of bag checks
• It’s all for show (though all security has some element of “show”)

But this side doesn’t seem to acknowledge that the bag checks are only one part of the effort. They are combined with other things (cameras, plainclothes guards, and possibly laser beams).

I also haven’t seen any alternative ideas for what they’d prefer instead of bag checks. Anyone care to clarify for me?

 

[lazyboy97o]

I’m disappointed in this discussion. It’s clear to me that some of you don’t like the bag checks. But other than complaining about infringement and posturing as defenders, I don’t understand the thinking. I’m really trying here, but nobody seems interested in explaining.

As far as I can tell, some folks think the security checks are a necessary inconvenience. It’s part of what Disney does in their attempts to mitigate threats to guests in the park.

On the other side are those who clearly don’t think Disney should have bag checks at all. That argument, as far as I can tell, focused on:

• What we have to give up (still not sure: maybe time? Privacy?)
• The failure rate of bag checks
• It’s all for show (though all security has some element of “show”)

But this side doesn’t seem to acknowledge that the bag checks are only one part of the effort. They are combined with other things (cameras, plainclothes guards, and possibly laser beams).

I also haven’t seen any alternative ideas for what they’d prefer instead of bag checks. Anyone care to clarify for me?

Other means of security are not dependent on the bag checks. And how is success not important?

 

[correcaminos]

Hence the reason for this entire thread because they were doing double bag checks and people were up in arms about it. They were checking at the monorail going to Epcot and then again at the normal gate. Double the security to try to make people safer, but people still complain.

You don't think it's annoying to have to be screened twice? Sorry but I do. It's more of security theater by doing this to begin with and having to do it twice? It's annoying and they really do *need* to fix this. The poor monorail resort people are getting hit with double checks and truly, it sucks.

Disney needs to get their act together with bag checks. As I said no where else I go that is equally as 'big of a target' is done so poorly.

I’m disappointed in this discussion. It’s clear to me that some of you don’t like the bag checks. But other than complaining about infringement and posturing as defenders, I don’t understand the thinking. I’m really trying here, but nobody seems interested in explaining.

As far as I can tell, some folks think the security checks are a necessary inconvenience. It’s part of what Disney does in their attempts to mitigate threats to guests in the park.

On the other side are those who clearly don’t think Disney should have bag checks at all. That argument, as far as I can tell, focused on:

• What we have to give up (still not sure: maybe time? Privacy?)
• The failure rate of bag checks
• It’s all for show (though all security has some element of “show”)

But this side doesn’t seem to acknowledge that the bag checks are only one part of the effort. They are combined with other things (cameras, plainclothes guards, and possibly laser beams).

I also haven’t seen any alternative ideas for what they’d prefer instead of bag checks. Anyone care to clarify for me?

If you read my posts, I said this type of security is awful. I fully acknowledge the real security beyond this dance is what keeps us safe. So yes, that side *does* acknowledge the real security.

I want a streamlined process. I want to get in and out like I do when I go to a concert, a fair, Universal... all of these locations do it and do it well. You either hand your bag to go through a scanner or as you walk through a metal detector, or they have significantly more checks so that as you hand your bag (always as you walk through the detector - not some stupid double line randomness that Disney does) they look quickly and you get it on the other side of the detector. Wait time for that is pretty much nothing. A minute or two at most. Not 10, not 20 and certainly not 30 minutes.

Disney needs more staff, more detectors and a lot more incentive to go bagless and have the staff to deal with it. Their way is a mess.

They also need to funnel the monorail riders into Epcot so they don't have to be checked *again* which is annoying as all get out.

 

[drizgirl]

No I don't think it's annoying to be screened twice. Adding redundancy in security is welcome in my book. It could be that I spent a better part of my life in the military dealing with threats like this so I'm all for it. It's just where you and I differ. I have seen first hand what happens to people when security can be slack or where things can get missed so no I don't think added redundancy is annoying, not when it comes to this.

If twice is good, then 3 times is better right? Why not 4?

 

[drizgirl]

Now you're just trolling.

No, it's a logical and fair question. If more is better, why is 2 the magic number? I mean, we need to be safe right?

 

[correcaminos]

No I don't think it's annoying to be screened twice. Adding redundancy in security is welcome in my book. It could be that I spent a better part of my life in the military dealing with threats like this so I'm all for it. It's just where you and I differ. I have seen first hand what happens to people when security can be slack or where things can get missed so no I don't think added redundancy is annoying, not when it comes to this.

I'll say it again, if I thought this were the effective security I might maybe agree with you. I don't though.

I'm kind of fed up with the idea that I must sacrifice my time and even my physical health (again spinal issues with concrete and not moving much really do not mix) just for this. It's not worth it. It's a loophole they need to address and are too darn lazy or cheap to do so. Much like the room security checks, someone went through an idea for security without real thought. My privacy is also not worth all of this. The Epcot person who went through my credit cards really ticked me off and he had zero right to rifle through my personal cards. So yeah, I'm not thrilled with their level of 'security' now. Reading someone's credit cards is NOT okay. They need to be effective and not reduce my privacy.

Military threats (come from a military family too) are not the same as this and as military you should know this type of security is not effective like others.

If twice is good, then 3 times is better right? Why not 4?

Well said.

 

[DisneyJeff]

No I don't think it's annoying to be screened twice. Adding redundancy in security is welcome in my book. It could be that I spent a better part of my life in the military dealing with threats like this so I'm all for it. It's just where you and I differ. I have seen first hand what happens to people when security can be slack or where things can get missed so no I don't think added redundancy is annoying, not when it comes to this.

If they did the security screening well enough the first time, then there would be no reason for the 2nd time. What would have changed between the two? If there is anything that could have changed (like the person being handed a gun between the time that they were screened), then it's up to Disney to prevent that from happening by keeping screened people separate from un-screened people. This is how it's done at the Magic Kingdom entrance area: The monorail and ferryboat people are already screened and kept separate from the bus/walking/resort boat people until they go through security.

Having the Epcot monorail people be screened twice is like having another security checkpoint right after you went through a security checkpoint: completely unnecessary and a waste of time and resources.

I'm not saying the actual security screenings are good/bad, but having someone who was already checked have to be checked again is ridiculous.

 

[DisneyJeff]

We are planning a monorail resort, pub crawl of sorts, on our next trip. We're staying at Boardwalk, thought we'd enter through International Gateway, walk to the front of Epcot, board the monorail to TTC, then take the resort monorail stopping at Polynesian, Grand Floridian, and Contemporary, each for about an hour and a half. We would probably take a cab at the end of the night. Does this plan mean we go through bag check and security 3 times? or is it even more than that?

You would go through security at the International Gateway to get into Epcot. You wouldn't be screened again until you boarded the monorail after visiting the Poly. You would then be screened after your visited the GF. If you leave the Contemporary by cab, you would not have to go through security. So yes, you would have to go through security three times in this scenario.

 

[correcaminos]

I agree about the personal credit cards. No reason for them to do that. However, please don't question whether I should or should not know the effectiveness of security because I served. You're in no place to tell me that. Coming from a military family is not the same as experiencing it for yourself in person. You don't know anything about me or what I went through in the 10+ years I served as EOD. I have seen practically every kind of checkpoint, both success and failure, loophole and while Disney's security obviously isn't perfect, I can appreciate them having a secondary bag check regardless if it's a mild inconvenience. Maybe one day they'll make it all nice and perfect so people won't be as inconvenienced but until then I appreciate what they try to do.

No I do not know about your situation. I fully admit your military service comment irked me and I was flippant in my response. Now if you said you were in either amusement park security or even at a major event location like a stadium/park whether indoor or out, I might have not been quite as dismissive really. I could tell you what my military family who does have work in some security says differently about Disney (and even TSA). None of it is really qualifying though (even if you were in EOD, which is impressive, but not the same). I get my thoughts on this from research I have found, not from anecdotal evidence.

The security there really does things inefficiently. Let's compare to Universal. How quick did we get in and out? I'll compare it to my airport (not MCO - they suck compared to all others I go through) and again, in and out in minutes. How about the arena I go to for concerts - again in and out. Fair grounds again are in and out. Disney? I've had 20 minute waits. Not good. They can look at nearly anywhere they want for a better method. Getting scanners like Universal is better than visual checks from people who make pittance and are not properly trained really. It's a show at Disney. Their real security though - hats off to them!

If they did the security screening well enough the first time, then there would be no reason for the 2nd time. What would have changed between the two? If there is anything that could have changed (like the person being handed a gun between the time that they were screened), then it's up to Disney to prevent that from happening by keeping screened people separate from un-screened people. This is how it's done at the Magic Kingdom entrance area: The monorail and ferryboat people are already screened and kept separate from the bus/walking/resort boat people until they go through security.

Having the Epcot monorail people be screened twice is like having another security checkpoint right after you went through a security checkpoint: completely unnecessary and a waste of time and resources.

I'm not saying the actual security screenings are good/bad, but having someone who was already checked have to be checked again is ridiculous.

Agreed totally!

 

[BoarderPhreak]

I think people might be missing the point. There aren't two consecutive security checks by design. Merely that in some instances, yes, you can end up being checked twice. It's the exception rather than the norm, and I'm sure Disney doesn't like it any more than you do.

...in the 10+ years I served as EOD...

Dang, brother. Good on ya.

 

[correcaminos]

I think people might be missing the point. There aren't two consecutive security checks by design. Merely that in some instances, yes, you can end up being checked twice. It's the exception rather than the norm, and I'm sure Disney doesn't like it any more than you do.


Dang, brother. Good on ya.

It affects all monorail resorts. That's not an exception in my book especially since one is considered the 'flagship' It wouldn't take much to fix either, they choose not to do it. I don't honestly think Disney cares or they'd have fixed it rather quickly really.

 

[BoarderPhreak]

It affects all monorail resorts. That's not an exception in my book especially since one is considered the 'flagship' It wouldn't take much to fix either, they choose not to do it. I don't honestly think Disney cares or they'd have fixed it rather quickly really.

They definitely do need to address this issue at Epcot; but at least MK isn't this way and it's working as intended.

 

[correcaminos]

They definitely do need to address this issue at Epcot; but at least MK isn't this way and it's working as intended.

Yes, definitely they have made MK easier for sure. Resort hopping not so much, but unless they find a way to secure all of WDW in a bubble so to speak, they likely cannot fix that. And no, I don't see how they could do a full bubble.

We're just going to have a difference of opinion on this and I can accept that.

I can accept it too truthfully - I just enjoy discussing things

 

[_caleb]

Other means of security are not dependent on the bag checks. And how is success not important?

Right. But other means of security may be dependent on visible measures as deterrent or to signal less visible measures. Success is definitely important, but we don't know how successful Disney's bag checks are in finding weapons (if that's even the purpose of the bag checks).

 

[_caleb]

Even if the redundancies aren't by design (and they should be), two checks would necessarily provide more security than one. Two different (presumably well-trained) security guards looking through the same bag makes it more likely that a weapon is found than just one security guard.

By the way, one common way bad guys try to defeat security screening like this is to pass weapons to unwitting carriers. So you may be super confident that you don't have anything dangerous in your bag, but Disney wants to check to see if someone may have slipped something in (without you noticing) with plans to retrieve the dangerous item from you later (which would actually bring another threat to your person).

Nobody thinks it's fun to wait in line to pass through security. What I don't get is how anyone would see that Disney isn't doing bag checks well (backups, bad implementation) and conclude that Disney shouldn't do bag checks at all. More staffing, better training, and better technology can reduce waiting (and the number of people standing in one confined location) and improve security while also making it less obtrusive.

 

[_caleb]

I think drones and self driven cars are a bigger threat.

Ok. I would imagine that Disney has some other measures (besides bag checks) to mitigate those.