SeaBase86
Member
Why has only 1 person commented on this post? This was the best post in the thread IMO.
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Rock n Roller coaster troubles continuing
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
Why has only 1 person commented on this post? This was the best post in the thread IMO.
Lee
Adventurer
Haven't heard the full details, but as Slipknot has said, I hear it was a restraint issue. Nothing too major, though, and nothing to warrant avoiding riding in the future.
The only way legal would be involved in something like this is if they simply mandated that the ride close until all restraints could be checked and verified to be working properly.
It was a combination of improper, outsourced maintenance and a bad connecting rod between the cars.
Trained Disney maintenance would likely have caught it. The idiots they hired really didn't even check.
The end of outsourcing maintenance.
The only way legal would be involved in something like this is if they simply mandated that the ride close until all restraints could be checked and verified to be working properly.
It was a combination of improper, outsourced maintenance and a bad connecting rod between the cars.
Trained Disney maintenance would likely have caught it. The idiots they hired really didn't even check.
The end of outsourcing maintenance.
JustInTime
Well-Known Member
It's open today. :sohappy:
NutsForFlorida
Well-Known Member
That was a pretty good post.
GrumpyFan
Well-Known Member
I believe that took place under Cynthia Harriss and Paul Pressler during a time when they were trying to maximize profits. In the end, it came back to bite them with incidents such as this and a continued decline in attendance and revenue. Those two were hired from retail and just didn't get the "Disney" way of doing things, and it wound up killing somebody. Hopefully the company learned something from it.
yellowstone
New Member
Excellent post, funny and right on!
Brian Noble
Well-Known Member
With all due respect, this is splitting hairs. Blame for that fatality still falls squarely with Disney---whether the root cause was due to an error by an Outside Machinist or a Cast Member is more an issue of what the benefits package is than anything else.
Thrill Seeker
Well-Known Member
Like what has already been said, if the ride is operating (which it is now to the best of my knowledge) it is completely safe. Disney doesn't take chances with safety.
NutsForFlorida
Well-Known Member
What do the cast members do when these rides close for a few days like this case or a few months for refurbishment? Are they assigned to different posts or rides or what?
No, it isn't. It just means there is no KNOWN problem. The monorail operated for decades in the same manner before an accident deemed that manner unsafe. Cigareetes were considered safe until medical science disproved that assertion. Same with lead paint. And accidents don't NEED to occur for something to be unsafe. It's the potential for accidents that make something unsafe.
Brian Noble
Well-Known Member
This wasn't my recollection, so I went back and re-read the Cal-DOSH report. From that report, the root cause was a process failure, not a materials failure. Conclusion 2 states:
A rod connecting two cars (the locomotive towbar) did fail, but it was not the root cause. That happened after the locomotive's floating axle had already detached and wedged under a brake assembly. This is described on Page 3, Lines 4-11 of the report. There was one other connector (on the floating axle) that failed (page 2 lines 3-7), but that happened after the wheel assembly had fallen off, presumably on the cycle before the accident (page 1, lines 20-23).
Space Mountain
Well-Known Member
That is not the first Vekoma to have lap bar problems..
Brian Noble
Well-Known Member
That's correct. However, *if* maintenance is doing their inspections/upkeep properly, any potential problems are almost always caught long before anything reaches the breaking point. For example, the Rip Ride Rockit case was almost certainly the result of one of the existing operators (very possibly Universal) discovering the out-of-spec stresses on the connector---as someone on another site points out, that could only have been done on an operating installation. That operator reported it to Maurer Söhne, who then in turn issued the bulletin.
Universal closed Rockit a few weeks thereafter---possibly because their magnetic/ultrasound testing found something wrong, or perhaps just due to an abundance of caution, or possibly for an unrelated reason. But, it reopened a week or so ago. Interestingly, the Sentinel article reports that Universal addressed the connector issue before even getting the bulletin from Maurer. If that's so, then Universal was almost certainly the operator that found the problem, but I'm guessing that the Sentinel is just up to their usual standard of accuracy.
Do things still sometimes go wrong? Yes. But, again, you are probably more likely to get hit by lightning than experience a serious injury or fatality on an amusement park ride.
sshindel
The Epcot Manifesto
While I agree in theory that their safety checks do not guarantee that it is "completely safe", I think you are going a little far. Nothing in life is 100% guaranteed to be safe. There are most likely an infinite number of UNKNOWN issues that may or may not exist that may or may not make me safe. I may be riding dumbo and an asteroid might happen to fall out of the sky and kill me. I might be walking through Animal Kingdom when a tiger decides to posess superhuman (or is it supertiger?) strength and agility and jump out of it's enclosure and maul me for looking at it funny.
I think that what people are trying to say is that Disney takes safety very seriously. If their safety checks deem the ride to be operational, it means that to the best of their knowledge, they have tested for all potential issues, either issues they know have or could happen. It's impossible to test for every unknown issue. They are unknown.
So, you are right, there are millions of unknown things could possibly happen, therefore the ride is not "completely safe". But, I think that it's good to assume that it's "safe", with the knowledge that there is always inherent risk in everything in the world. Some things come with more risk than others. Riding a rollercoaster that shoots off at 60mph and does multiple loops will ALWAYS carry inherent risk.
As has been said. Riding theme park rides is a buyer beware type situation. You can trust Disney to do the best of it's ability to ensure that you will not be injured or killed on one of their rides. If they were omnipotent and could forsee all unknown issues, I think they'd have a better track record with safety, ie. never a single injury that was not caused by 100% rider error.
Brian Noble
Well-Known Member
In this particular case, it isn't all that surprising. As I recall, Disney completely changed the blocking zone layout after the ride was installed. But, I'm having a hard time finding a source for that one.
The collision on Screamin' was due to a (set of) valves installed by Disney---replacing Intamin parts with parts from another supplier. Those parts apparently were not identical in design.
http://articles.latimes.com/2005/oct/14/local/me-disney14
Edited: that said, Intamin doesn't have the best reputation---their restraint systems have had to be redesigned in several instances (having thrown "guests of size" to their deaths from a couple completely different rides), and their hydraulic rockets have been particularly problematic (with the ones at Knott's, Cedar Point, and Six Flags Great Adventure all having serious issues in the past few years).
JillC LI
Well-Known Member
pfffffffffffft! That's the sound of me spitting a mouthful of my lunch on my computer screen as I read this! Thanks for the laugh! :ROFLOL:
jakeman
Well-Known Member
Everything has the potential for accidents. That's why they are called accidents. It doesn't mean that everything is inherently unsafe, just that there is always a potential for greater safety. When humans are involved there is always that potential.
Really it's splitting hairs over the definition of "safe". Nothing is ever truly one hundred percent safe. It's all relative to risk. At a certain risk threshold something is considered safe. That is also human nature. To constantly pick on the potential, especially when we have no expertise in the area is an unnecessary stress.
The monorail accident was tragic, could have been averted, and led to improvements in the safety of the system, but the system was safe for almost 40 years. As unfortunate as the death was, and by no means making light of it, the chances of dying on a WDW monorail have to be up there with being killed by a meteor.
Additionally, I don't think RnRC falls into the same category as cigarettes and lead paint. Research and development in every industry has come a long ways since the days of cigarettes and lead paint.
sweetpee_1993
Well-Known Member
Haven't heard the full details, but as Slipknot has said, I hear it was a restraint issue. Nothing too major, though, and nothing to warrant avoiding riding in the future.
The only way legal would be involved in something like this is if they simply mandated that the ride close until all restraints could be checked and verified to be working properly.
It was a combination of improper, outsourced maintenance and a bad connecting rod between the cars.
Trained Disney maintenance would likely have caught it. The idiots they hired really didn't even check.
The end of outsourcing maintenance.
Thanks, Lee. I think you win for the most informative post of the thread. :wave:
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
This where, despite a well established relationship, that Disney and Vekoma could be butting heads. In order to cover themselves, Vekoma may be taking longer to help address the issue than Disney would like, which is nothing unusual in the industry. The ride manufacturer wants to go back through everything both with the particular ride and similar ones, look at modifications, look at similar issues, etc. that all take time, but the park wants that to get that ride back up and running safely as quickly as possible.