News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[wdwmagic]

Live stream for today's circus meeting

 

[Heppenheimer]

Did you read the article @Chi84 posted that I replied to? This was in the article:

“I think he’s in trouble,” said Ron Gidwitz, a major GOP fundraiserwho served as the National Republican Senatorial Committee’s finance chair and was a Trump-era ambassador but is undecided for 2024. “There’s a lot of people that are concerned about DeSantis — and Trump for that matter. They’d like to have an alternative to Trump that can win. But is DeSantis the person?”

“Some of the stuff that he’s been doing recently doesn’t sit all that terribly well with donors,” he said, adding, “This craziness with Walt Disney — I mean, how do you get into a fight with Mickey Mouse?”

If you Google it you will probably see some more articles discussing it. It’s not just the conflict with Disney alone, but it’s a contributing factor.

In the last few months DeSantis‘s polling for the primary has dropped. That drop directly corresponds with his drop in polling for the general election. Several months ago DeSantis was polling ahead of Biden in a one on one matchup, that has flipped now. I’m not suggesting that’s only related to the Disney conflict. It’s a combination of that and other moves to impress the MAGA base. As he moves further right he’s less and less likely to win in the general. People are seeing that and bailing on him. As the guy quoted above says, there are a lot of people that just want a guy who can win. They had great hopes that could be DeSantis. Not anymore. This Disney conflict certainly contributes to that.

Not just the policies he's pursued, but in the winner-takes-all, never-admit-defeat/error manner in which he was done so has not exactly shone a flattering light on his underlying personality. His judgement must really be in question now.

 

[GoofGoof]

Live stream for today's circus meeting

According to reporting they will be discussing the lawsuit among other things. I can’t see how discussing the lawsuit is a good idea for them at this point but it should be entertaining.

Board overseeing Disney’s special district discusses lawsuit at Monday meeting

The board overseeing Disney’s special district is set to meet again Monday.

news.yahoo.com

 

[wdwmagic]

According to reporting they will be discussing the lawsuit among other things. I can’t see how discussing the lawsuit is a good idea for them at this point but it should be entertaining.

Board overseeing Disney’s special district discusses lawsuit at Monday meeting

The board overseeing Disney’s special district is set to meet again Monday.

news.yahoo.com

There is only one item on the agenda, "Board discussion and direction to litigation counsel and authorization to defend District officials sued in official capacities."

Central Florida Tourism Oversight District schedules a special meeting to discuss Disney's lawsuit

Central Florida Tourism Oversight District schedules a special meeting to discuss Disney's lawsuit

www.wdwmagic.com

 

[trainplane3]

Live stream for today's circus meeting

They keep testing their stream and it has the incorrect date on the first slide. Keep watching their Youtube channel because they just ended that stream too.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The assessment paid for roads, fire, ambulance, waste, water, garbage. Services the county would have to provide. ALL of us property owners would pay through our property taxes. I consider that a win for everyone.

There are three different models they could have adopted.

They could have said that everything inside Disney's gates is private infrastructure and Disney would have been responsible for the roads, waste, etc. The same way that Disney maintains the walking paths inside the theme park gates, they would have maintained the roads inside the WDW gates as part of their operating costs.

They could have said that the infrastructure is public and should be funded by the counties. I think this would have been appropriate if they had implemented it from the beginning, since the pizza places, t-shirt shops, hotels, and residents of Central Florida benefit from all of the economic development that Disney brought to the region and therefore should have shared in the cost. There's no way they should have sprung this on the counties now, since that would have been deeply inequitable to current property owners. If this was going to be the structure, it would have had to be the structure since the beginning.

Or they could have done the special district.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

One of the things that I really like about this website is that while people will debate a controversial opinions in good faith (like mine, Horizons wasn't that great!), they immediately call out BS.

Ok…this is not a “new to Disney forums” person…obviously…

But that doesn’t mean it’s somebody booted trying to back door. It could be someone from the OTHER site that doesn’t want to deal with their shenanigans.

I won’t label a “troll” until I see them crawling under a bridge

 

[CaptainAmerica]

And what did those taxes do? Paid for municipal services (roads, electricty, waste management, EMS, etc).

The argument is that the roads within Walt Disney World ought not be considered municipal services in the first place, they ought to be considered private infrastructure of TWDC.

So instead of Disney paying taxes to RCID and RCID maintaining the roads, Disney just maintains the roads.

It's obviously not the model that was chosen but I don't think it's entirely far-fetched, either.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

There are three different models they could have adopted.

They could have said that everything inside Disney's gates is private infrastructure and Disney would have been responsible for the roads, waste, etc. The same way that Disney maintains the walking paths inside the theme park gates, they would have maintained the roads inside the WDW gates as part of their operating costs.

They could have said that the infrastructure is public and should be funded by the counties. I think this would have been appropriate if they had implemented it from the beginning, since the pizza places, t-shirt shops, hotels, and residents of Central Florida benefit from all of the economic development that Disney brought to the region and therefore should have shared in the cost. There's no way they should have sprung this on the counties now, since that would have been deeply inequitable to current property owners. If this was going to be the structure, it would have had to be the structure since the beginning.

Or they could have done the special district.

…winner

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The argument is that the roads within Walt Disney World ought not be considered municipal services in the first place, they ought to be considered private infrastructure of TWDC.

So instead of Disney paying taxes to RCID and RCID maintaining the roads, Disney just maintains the roads.

It's obviously not the model that was chosen but I don't think it's entirely far-fetched, either.

Roads that cross wdw connect to public thruways as well.

So…”no”…in other words

They shouldn’t get them for free…but they also shouldn’t donate them to orange and Osceola counties either

 

[trainplane3]

@wdwmagic, the correct stream has been posted.

 

[MisterPenguin]

The argument is that the roads within Walt Disney World ought not be considered municipal services in the first place, they ought to be considered private infrastructure of TWDC.

Except for any of the roads used to transverse the property. WDW covers a huge area of the county and if WDW wasn't there, the county would most likely have roads transversing the property rather then everyone driving all the way around it to get to the other side.

If I bought the property on the other side of the street in addition to keeping my house, the road that runs between my two properties is still the municipality's concern if other people are using it.

 

[GoofGoof]

There are three different models they could have adopted.

They could have said that everything inside Disney's gates is private infrastructure and Disney would have been responsible for the roads, waste, etc. The same way that Disney maintains the walking paths inside the theme park gates, they would have maintained the roads inside the WDW gates as part of their operating costs.

They could have said that the infrastructure is public and should be funded by the counties. I think this would have been appropriate if they had implemented it from the beginning, since the pizza places, t-shirt shops, hotels, and residents of Central Florida benefit from all of the economic development that Disney brought to the region and therefore should have shared in the cost. There's no way they should have sprung this on the counties now, since that would have been deeply inequitable to current property owners. If this was going to be the structure, it would have had to be the structure since the beginning.

Or they could have done the special district.

This is why just dissolving the district was so flawed as an approach. That and the bonds. I do think it’s possible to unwind RCID the right way but it would have to be done slowly over time with direct negotiations between the counties and Disney. Some of the services provided could be shifted to Disney directly while others would go to the counties or even the state. If you gradually add services to the counties they can slowly raise taxes and factor it into their overall budget. So if something like EMS was rolled into the counties you do it gradually so local taxpayers aren’t slammed with an upfront charge. Maybe some of the costs are offset by transferring utility assets to the counties to run. The revenue from selling power could partially offset the costs. Maybe some of the roads go private and are taken over by Disney and others are turned over to the county or FDOT to maintain. Maybe the preserved wetlands are transferred to a subsidiary of Disney to be managed. It’s possible to do any of this if all parties cooperate and agree on this. Disney probably ends up with some sort of development agreement with the counties anyway.

Or…..instead of all that work they could have just left RCID “as is“ since it wasn’t harming anyone and was actually a big benefit to local taxpayers and to a nice way for Disney to control development of their own property.

 

[lazyboy97o]

According to reporting they will be discussing the lawsuit among other things. I can’t see how discussing the lawsuit is a good idea for them at this point but it should be entertaining.

Board overseeing Disney’s special district discusses lawsuit at Monday meeting

The board overseeing Disney’s special district is set to meet again Monday.

news.yahoo.com

They need to official decide to respond and dedicate the resources to the defense. Whether or not they keep quiet being that will be seen.

 

[GoofGoof]

They need to official decide to respond and dedicate the resources to the defense. Whether or not they keep quiet being that will be seen.

If I were advising them I’d say “lawyer up” and say as little as possible….but I’m not advising them and that would be no fun so carry on

 

[CaptainAmerica]

If I bought the property on the other side of the street in addition to keeping my house, the road that runs between my two properties is still the municipality's concern if other people are using it.

I don't think that analogy works.

Disney didn't buy the property on both sides of the street because there was no street. The street only exists in the first place because Disney wanted it there to connect their own stuff to more of their own stuff.

And then two minor points... 1) I wasn't a lifer, but I lived in Orlando for 3 years and I've never heard of anyone driving through or across Walt Disney World surface streets unless they were doing Walt Disney World things. So the claim that the roads are for public use is dubious to me. 2) None of us can know how the land would have developed absent RCID.

This is why just dissolving the district was so flawed as an approach.

Right, and they realized that, and they didn't do it. That was the source of all of the doom and gloom articles about tax burdens and bond debt shifting to the counties, which they said wouldn't happen, and it hasn't.

For all the things they got wrong, at least they got that part right. If you're going to dissolve the district, you have to replace it with something different (that looks a whole lot like the exact same thing with a new name and a panel of cronies in charge).

 

[peter11435]

I wasn't a lifer, but I lived in Orlando for 3 years and I've never heard of anyone driving through or across Walt Disney World surface streets unless they were doing Walt Disney World things. So the claim that the roads are for public use is dubious to me.

It’s actually very common for locals to use certain WDW roads to cut across the region.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

It’s actually very common for locals to use certain WDW roads to cut across the region.

From where to where? I believe you, I just can't picture it.

Nobody lives West of property. I-4, even with traffic, is going to be your most direct route for anything between ChampionsGate and Doctor Phillips. Western Way to Buena Vista Drive might be faster than 192 but what's over there on the Western Way side?

 

[Touchdown]

Yeah I’m sure using EPCOT drive when I4 is jammed to miss a lot of the backup is common.

 

[wdwmagic]

LOL finally one of the public speakers is talking some common sense.