News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

JAB

Well-Known Member
I think there are 3 possible outcomes. First, the courts rule the entire process Desatis took was unconstitutional and c we go back to the original RCID. Second, the first bill eliminating the RCID is legal but the second bill taking over RCID is unconstitutional. Or third the state had the right to take over the district but the property owners still have the legal right to abolish the district and Disney does. Everyone is ignoring the property owners right to voluntarily abolish their special district.
Wouldn't dissolving the district dump its bond debt and maintenance expenses onto Orange and Osceola counties? I don't think Disney would want be the ones responsible for that, as it would really strain their relationship with the counties. That's probably why no one talks about it - because even if it's possible, it's very unlikely.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Wouldn't dissolving the district dump its bond debt and maintenance expenses onto Orange and Osceola counties? I don't think Disney would want be the ones responsible for that, as it would really strain their relationship with the counties. That's probably why no one talks about it - because even if it's possible, it's very unlikely.
Not necessarily. The planned dissolution dumped the debt on the counties because it (I don’t recall at the moment if it was in the bill itself or a reference to another statute) gave the assets and liabilities to the pre-existing local governments. A dissolution that handed the assets and liabilities to the existing local governments would shift much of that to the cities of Bay Lake and Lake Buena. Those cities could also annex the unincorporated district lands so that nothing went to the counties. This would still have issues with the bonds but the dumbing debt on the counties is not a given but doesn’t remove Disney’s de facto control.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I'm wondering if that's how it's going to end up -
1. New district stands or is not challenged (State gets to keep its new name and appointments)
2. Developer agreement is challenged, but left in place (Disney keeps agreement)
3. New board gets to hold meetings and "maintain the roads and maintain the basic infrastructure" and whatever other functions it has left.

So basically, each party gets what they want or at least the best they can get and moves on. Then the new board gets left in the dust doing stuff they probably think is below them.
That is exactly what Disney has said that they want publicly. They didn’t publicly/legally challenge the board takeover. They didn’t sue the state for potential 1st amendment violations. After the 2nd bill passed they released a statement saying that they were going to continue business as usual and work with the new board. Instead of being standoffish and threatening to pause investment or pull back in FL, Iger made public statements saying they plan to invest even more in the state. The company (at least publicly) seems sincerely interested in continuing to run its successful theme parks in FL, entertain their guests and make billions in the process.

So if your 3 steps above happen (I hope they do :)) then Disney gets what they want. The problem with all of this is the other side does not. What the Governor wants is a crusade. He wants a win. He wants something to brag about in campaign speeches in Iowa and NH and many other states. I don’t think he cares about roads or governing or local taxes.
 

seascape

Well-Known Member
Wouldn't dissolving the district dump its bond debt and maintenance expenses onto Orange and Osceola counties? I don't think Disney would want be the ones responsible for that, as it would really strain their relationship with the counties. That's probably why no one talks about it - because even if it's possible, it's very unlikely.
If Disney were to voluntarily give up the district, they would have to pay the bonds. However, if the courts ruled that the first bill was legal but the second wasn't, that would be interesting. Disney could then say are no longer liable for the bonds or voluntarily agree to pay them but put restrictions on that agreement. I know Disney is willing to go back to the original RCID or even a slightly modified version but what is currently in place is unacceptable
 

castlecake2.0

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Nobody forced Disney to build that resort on the absolute edge of their 47 square miles of land. 🤷‍♂️

There is a two lane road that goes out right near the entrance of that resort that'll take you past the Company D store and right into one of the more run-down areas outside of WDW.
Unsure if true but I remember reading they built it there to stop the Osceola Parkway from going right through property
 

flyakite

Well-Known Member
Can someone speak on how this would look in a lawsuit regarding intention of the governor:

Carolina Amesty - Florida State Representative - Windermere
April 17, 2023. Gov. DeSantis press conference WDW

“It’s time for Disney executives to have a sober conversation and retake the company from the woke ideologues who hijacked it.

You’re in the business of entertaining families, not promoting radical ideologies.

If you think you are, I have news: Florida is where woke goes to die.”

I hope a judge would not minimize this.
 
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drnilescrane

Well-Known Member
Unsure if true but I remember reading they built it there to stop the Osceola Parkway from going right through property
They at some point wanted Osceola Parkway to go through property and connect to 429. The main driveway of the hotel is a 4 lane divided highway that randomly drops down to 2 undivided lanes past the old guest entrance specifically because it was meant to connect through. Kidani was the afterthought.

They changed plans when they bought the land for Flamingo Crossings and decided to build Western Way instead.
 
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Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Not necessarily. The planned dissolution dumped the debt on the counties because it (I don’t recall at the moment if it was in the bill itself or a reference to another statute) gave the assets and liabilities to the pre-existing local governments. A dissolution that handed the assets and liabilities to the existing local governments would shift much of that to the cities of Bay Lake and Lake Buena. Those cities could also annex the unincorporated district lands so that nothing went to the counties. This would still have issues with the bonds but the dumbing debt on the counties is not a given but doesn’t remove Disney’s de facto control.
…so basically…it would have become a tangle that they should have never even broached in the first place?

It’s February 2nd again.

“Don’t pull on that that string”
 
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Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
They at some point wanted Osceola Parkway to go through property and connect to 429. The main driveway of the hotel is a 4 lane divided highway that randomly drops down to 2 undivided lanes past the old guest entrance specifically because it was meant to connect through. Kidani was the afterthought.

They changed plans when they bought the land for Flamingo Crossings and decided to build Western Way instead.
This was detailed in one of the great Carl Hiassen’s books…team rodent

Basically…they built DAKL on the only cost effective plot that Osceola parkway could have been extended to 27…making it a semi-effective thruway.

So that road is useless. But in the 90’s…Disney strong armed the locals much more than they could now.

Lack of comparative investment and changing local politics will do that
 
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Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Probably not wise for the legislature to pass a clearly unconstitutional bill in order to void a contract they are already convinced is null and void.

But they’re just tossing out ANY past blocks that forbid them from doing this. That’s what we have seen to this point.

Any doubt puffy Napoleon is going to stay in the governors mansion until something better comes along at this point?
I have none.
I get such a kick out of all the media headlines that proclaim words to the effect of “DeSantis to void the Disney agreement,” as if he or any government body can simply declare a contract void. What the headlines should say is “DeSantis to exhibit more false bravado and claim Disney agreement is void, only to set himself up to suffer yet another embarrassing defeat.”
The problem is that “normalcy” would have dictated that this would have gone nowhere from the start.

And we’re already at like…”step 5”

…there have been no safeguards to this point that we assume were there. It’s political Mayhem that is actively trying to mess with Disneys bottomline.
And since - let’s not BS - they are the biggest dog in the state…it’s potentially disastrous to the counties, Orlando and Florida itself.

In pop culture terms…it’s like some new punk picking a fight with yoda cause he doesn’t know any better…

…I wouldn’t.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member

ParentsOf4

Well-Known Member
…yeah…even still…

Newsweek was one of the most trusted journals…when print was key

They are a fringe kinda weirdo clickbait thing now.

Just saying
As much as Republicans used to be pro-business, Democrats historically have believed in strong government oversight of private businesses. I think the poll reflects a mix of traditional Democrat/Republican values for some, and how those values have evolved for others.

Similarly, private businesses used to be among the most conservative organizations within the United States, headed by a bunch of middle-aged white guys with "traditional" values. (Try to imagine where Walt Disney would have stood on this.) Not anymore.

Things change.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
…yeah…even still…

Newsweek was one of the most trusted journals…when print was key

They are a fringe kinda weirdo clickbait thing now.

Just saying
Two things. Yes, once upon a time, many years ago Newsweek was a reliable and trusted news journal. Those days are history. The other is, regardless of the title, heading, name etc. of the organization conducting a poll, polls have historically (specially in recent history) proven to be wrong and misleading. To get any reasonable idea of the truth multiple and varied sources need to be looked at / read.
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
“It’s time for Disney executives to have a sober conversation and retake the company from the woke ideologues who hijacked it.

You’re in the business of entertaining families*, not promoting radical ideologies.

If you think you are, I have news: Florida is where woke goes to die.”

I hope a judge would not minimize this.
* only if your family fits our narrow view of what a family should look like.
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member

Sir_Cliff

Well-Known Member
As much as Republicans used to be pro-business, Democrats historically have believed in strong government oversight of private businesses. I think the poll reflects a mix of traditional Democrat/Republican values for some, and how those values have evolved for others.

Similarly, private businesses used to be among the most conservative organizations within the United States, headed by a bunch of middle-aged white guys with "traditional" values. (Try to imagine where Walt Disney would have stood on this.) Not anymore.

Things change.
I think there's something to this when it comes to Democrats potentially feeling that, whether they support the reason behind it or not, they don't want Disney to have "special privileges".

This may point further to the lack of wisdom in Disney's decision to lie low, not say anything publicly, and try to outmanoeuvre DeSantis. Essentially, virtually the only narrative that has been out there about RCID is that Disney was getting some kind of massive tax break and allowed to self-govern, and Disney never tried to counter that despite the fact it wasn't true.

I do also suspect, as one commentator in the article suggests, this poll doesn't quite capture how this will play out politically. But, we shall see.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Can someone speak on how this would look in a lawsuit regarding intention of the governor:

Carolina Amesty - Florida State Representative - Windermere
April 17, 2023. Gov. DeSantis press conference WDW

“It’s time for Disney executives to have a sober conversation and retake the company from the woke ideologues who hijacked it.

You’re in the business of entertaining families, not promoting radical ideologies.

If you think you are, I have news: Florida is where woke goes to die.”

I hope a judge would not minimize this.
…there’s abjectly stupid…
…and then there’s “this”


…it’s one thing to say Disney’s market research is not the best tactic…but it’s quite another to say they aren’t capable of doing it altogether.

…like it or not…to say that TWDC is incapable of collecting market data and formulate a business plan based on it may be the dumbest political “stance” ever.


It’s mental failure.

Par for the course in the orange groves these days…it seems?
 

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