Possible Frontierland expansion

MisterPenguin

Rumormonger
Premium Member
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I never stated the intent has changed, I said its thrown off. Yes those changes were made to the exterior, BGM etc because of the location/aesthetics but at its core its a trip thru Georgia. The designer's original intent for you to travel from the New England/Mid Atlantic coast, then the Midwest and finally the West, is still the same. But since '92 you take a detour south. We still end up in the West though. That's what I was pointing out.
Indeed, Frontierland unfortunately routinely mashes "Southern" with "Frontier".

And yes, "The South" was at one time a frontier, but it was a frontier two centuries before "The West".

This throws off the idea of a timeline from HM to BTMR. HM is early 1800s, then you go through Liberty Square which is 40 - 60 years earlier, not later in time.

I'm not saying that there aren't general geographic and temporal groupings; it's just not a nice, neat linear path through FL and LS.

People have a tendency to create a deeper story than what the imagineers created. And it's not surprising to hear CMs repeating such false narratives. Just think about all the back stories to the HM trying to create a complete narrative to what's mostly a collection of only tenuously connected scenes. All the rules people make up to what makes a Disney Princess part of the branded Disney Princess are wrong since they don't know that the origin was just a marketing ploy.
 

Movielover

Well-Known Member
The difference here is that Martin posted what amounts to a skit - those don't survive. I'm talking a larger seated mid-range people-eater with a set on the level of Indy Stunt Show. The IP is the justification needed to see that concept built. IP puts butts in seats.
I honestly would actually love to watch a fun, action packed Lone Ranger stunt show in the vein of the old Wild Wild Wild West Stunt Show at Universal. That or a more swashbuckling version with Zorro. Of course I'm a bit biased since I love stunt shows...
 

doctornick

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
When you travel from Haunted Mansion to Big Thunder Mountain, you go from one end of the USA to the other across time.

Something connecting the upper half of RoA should do the reverse and bring everything full circle.
Zorro doesn't work for the chronological progression but the California setting does for the geographic one.

The logical progression would be a Pacific Northwest/Alaska theme set to the Klondike gold rush.
 

egg

Well-Known Member
Both Thunder Mountain and Splash Mountain are quintessentially frontier even though they are the west and south. Fantasyland and Tomorrowland have plenty of different locations too that isn’t really an issue.

I’d say its better than what they did for Splash at DL, overthinking it and creating a separate land.
 

Movielover

Well-Known Member
I’d say its better than what they did for Splash at DL, overthinking it and creating a separate land.
Disneyland's Splash Mt wouldn't have fit in Frontierland even if they tried, and was always intended to overhaul the Bear Country land in the back of the park. It wasn't until the attraction was adapted to WDW that it was redesigned to fit Frontierland.
 

egg

Well-Known Member
Disneyland's Splash Mt wouldn't have fit in Frontierland even if they tried, and was always intended to overhaul the Bear Country land in the back of the park. It wasn't until the attraction was adapted to WDW that it was redesigned to fit Frontierland.
And in my opinion, which seems to be widely held, WDW’s adaptation is better. Point is they should’ve went that route from the start in DL.
 

Disneyson

Well-Known Member
I agree. A generic cowboy shootout works perfectly fine and IMHO would still be a hit with guests.
If/When Indy, BatB, and VotLM bite the dust, I can see a lot of the performers headed around WDW in the spirit of the pirate atmosphere test the did a few years back, the IncrediFans, or like Knott’s Berry Farm’s Ghost Town. Splitting the giant cast into groups of three or four would SEEM like a lot of entertainment is being added for the 50th, but actually be a cost-saving measure in terms of the ops and pyro needed to run Indy. A staged cowboy show here, Jack Sparrow running around Adventureland, return of the Muppets, a PUSH-style character in Tomorrowland, re-creating scenes from BatB in Belle’s village... by re-using a lot of actors they could save big bucks and distract from entertainment cuts elsewhere. And market a ton of small things that add up to “50”.

Whenever I see atmosphere get cut, I always like to see how they distract with one or two shows and experiences that use exactly the same amount or less people. Throw in an extension of someone’s character shift and it seems like more cast was hired.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
And in my opinion, which seems to be widely held, WDW’s adaptation is better. Point is they should’ve went that route from the start in DL.
Where can I get a good comparison of the two versions of Splash Mountain? I’ve ridden both many times, but I’m not sure I understand how it was adapted to fit.
 

marni1971

WDW History nut
Premium Member
Where can I get a good comparison of the two versions of Splash Mountain? I’ve ridden both many times, but I’m not sure I understand how it was adapted to fit.
There’s no direct comparison since both have different layouts, Orlando has side by side seats (Anaheim is six one behind another), Anaheim runs faster than Orlando...

I think the comment was more how Orlando’s theme was adapted from a Dixieland style to a more rustic backwater theme. But, since I’ve plenty of time on my hands give me a few minutes..
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
There’s no direct comparison since both have different layouts, Orlando has side by side seats (Anaheim is six one behind another), Anaheim runs faster than Orlando...

I think the comment was more how Orlando’s theme was adapted from a Dixieland style to a more rustic backwater theme. But, since I’ve plenty of time on my hands give me a few minutes..
Thanks! I always noticed differences between the two, but I've never considered how they might all work all together as an intentional iteration on the theme.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
It’s a quick sketch so isn’t 100% to scale nor 100% accurate, but you get the idea:

View attachment 457997

Tokyos will really confuse you!
Thanks for doing this! Very helpful. You mention that Anaheim runs a bit faster. I'm assuming this is due to having more drops along the ride path? Maybe it has to do with lighter weight boats?

Also, regarding the thematic differences, what else went into making Orlando's version a bit more "Frontierland-friendly" than Anaheim's deep South version?
 

marni1971

WDW History nut
Premium Member
Thanks for doing this! Very helpful. You mention that Anaheim runs a bit faster. I'm assuming this is due to having more drops along the ride path? Maybe it has to do with lighter weight boats?

Also, regarding the thematic differences, what else went into making Orlando's version a bit more "Frontierland-friendly" than Anaheim's deep South version?
Like others have said, Orlando’s music is the same but different. The original is more orchestral, maybe mardi gras in its approach. I’m sure you know Orlando’s is more “bayou” in style. Orlando has for want of a better word more wood in its design, Anaheim has more stone as well as wood. Hard to explain, it’s more a “thing” you subconsciously pick up on. Take this example. Anaheim top. Same place on both rides.

28759FD9-4618-4438-BB39-18601375D075.jpeg
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
Like others have said, Orlando’s music is the same but different. The original is more orchestral, maybe mardi gras in its approach. I’m sure you know Orlando’s is more “bayou” in style. Orlando has for want of a better word more wood in its design, Anaheim has more stone as well as wood. Hard to explain, it’s more a “thing” you subconsciously pick up on. Take this example. Anaheim top. Same place on both rides.

View attachment 458020
Thank you so much for this! I could never really put my finger on what made them feel different, but this helps a lot!
 
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