PHOTO - NextGen RFID entry system installed at the Haunted Mansion

[Engenie]

What inferior product? Paper FastPasses?

Yes, Disney should maintain their infrastructure. By that, I am referring to their monorail system which is far more important to the operation of the parks than virtual FastPasses.

Again, I honestly disagree, the whole nextgen thing is a lot more than electronic fastpasses... I'll re-state that from the little bits we know now, it is attempting to tie together a lot of systems; accounting, security, entertainment, logistics, hotel reservations, dining, etc. And yes, I do believe the sum of all these things combined is a greater impact on the whole of the property than the monorail.

 

[flynnibus]

I still don't see at all how they can/should be doing far more at once. If they closed down any other attractions for maintenance or refurbishment there'd be nothing left to ride!

An odd thing to say when there are no currently closed attractions due to refurb in the MK and only Test Track elsewhere on property. So by your logic - they should never close anything..

But I digress... I guess it all comes down to personal opinion and I am just personally amazed at everything they have going on right now.

I'm not amazed when it takes them several years to do limited building.. the same company that build entire theme parks in less time. And for 'juggling' - remember they built EPCOT (their most ambitious project ever) at the same time they were building TDL.

Doing new amazing things like EPCOT were awe inspiring. FLE is far from that kind of awe striking in terms of it's boldness and ambitions. It's going to be a beautiful implementation of what we already have learned to expect from the company.

 

[Poirot4]

I agree with ExtinctJenn. I have been going to WDW since the 70's and on my last visit in Jan '11, I thought the parks looked great. I didn't notice this deplorable state of the parks that everyone keeps talking about. YES, I noticed the Yeti (LOL) but overall I was very impressed. What can I possibly be missing?

In addition, the only thing that bothers me about the naysayers is that they say that they criticize only because they love Disney so much. I get that. However, I would tend to accept that if their comments were more balanced. When 95% of your comments are negative, then why are you surprised that people get the impression that you hate Disney? How about posting something when you LIKE what Disney is doing? It makes me wonder if there is ANYTHING that Disney has done in the last 10 years that they like.

This is not directed to anyone in particular, by the way, but there are definitely a few people on these boards whose posts skew very heavily to the negative side.

 

[alissafalco]

I agree with ExtinctJenn. I have been going to WDW since the 70's and on my last visit in Jan '11, I thought the parks looked great. I didn't notice this deplorable state of the parks that everyone keeps talking about. YES, I noticed the Yeti (LOL) but overall I was very impressed. What can I possibly be missing?

In addition, the only thing that bothers me about the naysayers is that they say that they criticize only because they love Disney so much. I get that. However, I would tend to accept that if their comments were more balanced. When 95% of your comments are negative, then why are you surprised that people get the impression that you hate Disney? How about posting something when you LIKE what Disney is doing? It makes me wonder if there is ANYTHING that Disney has done in the last 10 years that they like.

This is not directed to anyone in particular, by the way, but there are definitely a few people on these boards whose posts skew very heavily to the negative side.

I think everyone writing on here does LOVE Disney. That is why we are all on here. I think the negativity comes out more often because we expect a certain very high standard from Disney, and when that very high standard is not met people are upset. I see what you're saying though, from reading these boards it does sound like the park is dilapidated LOL. It's not, its amazing, that's why we are all members of WDWmagic.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I still don't understand how they aren't investing what it takes to maintain the parks. I see photo after photo posted to this site of the work going on all across property. They can only do so much at once right? That's true of any company. I'm a project manager for one of the biggest banks in the country. We have huge lists of things we want to do to improve our customer experience but we only have so much we can budget for and fit in each quarter. It takes time to get everything done and when you have a project the size of the FLE in addition to all the other things they are doing across property, some of the other stuff just has to be pushed out to a future "release."

The argument is that their price point dictates that we should have higher standards. Our complaints are that those higher standards aren't being met.

 

[JWG]

But Disney is focusing on this Next Gen cr... stuff at the expense of attractions (C through E) and maintenance. That's the problem.

I disagree. Maybe there's some overflow and sliding of funds for NextGen, but the reality is - NextGen has to happen. If Disney doesn't do it someone else will first - and then we'll all be that Disney charges too much to "be behind their competition in technology". Resort internet is the perfect example. Disney has been 10 years behind in that and now they're having to invest to catch up. It's an investment whether now or later and later usually only adds $$ and creates bad will about being behind.

I think they can successfully do both. The new FLE is going on, Test Track redo, supposedly prep work for Pandora, rumors of something at DHS (I get, still blue sky). I consider the work they're doing infrastructure to support the growth of the parks for years to come and a component of attractions and both need be happening.

 

[wdwmagic]

I disagree. Maybe there's some overflow and sliding of funds for NextGen, but the reality is - NextGen has to happen. If Disney doesn't do it someone else will first - and then we'll all be that Disney charges too much to "be behind their competition in technology". Resort internet is the perfect example. Disney has been 10 years behind in that and now they're having to invest to catch up. It's an investment whether now or later and later usually only adds $$ and creates bad will about being behind.

You are absolutely right on that.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I agree with ExtinctJenn. I have been going to WDW since the 70's and on my last visit in Jan '11, I thought the parks looked great. I didn't notice this deplorable state of the parks that everyone keeps talking about. YES, I noticed the Yeti (LOL) but overall I was very impressed. What can I possibly be missing?

In addition, the only thing that bothers me about the naysayers is that they say that they criticize only because they love Disney so much. I get that. However, I would tend to accept that if their comments were more balanced. When 95% of your comments are negative, then why are you surprised that people get the impression that you hate Disney? How about posting something when you LIKE what Disney is doing? It makes me wonder if there is ANYTHING that Disney has done in the last 10 years that they like.

This is not directed to anyone in particular, by the way, but there are definitely a few people on these boards whose posts skew very heavily to the negative side.

I'm firmly considered a "doom and gloomer" and have made TONS of positive comments about the parks. With all due respect, it's not my job to make sure people notice those. Frankly, I don't care.

What I find funny is that none of the firmly pro-WDW folks ever notice (or at least they won't admit it) that virtually every single "doom and gloomer" here raves about Disneyland. From show quality to food options to night time shows, it's nearly impossible to find someone complain about what's going on out there. I actually don't believe that anyone here could name one person that posts here that seems to be anti-WDW AND anti-DL. That to me is clear proof that all the D&G'ers are Disney Parks fans... And that they are able to objectively look between properties and see where the value lies. They compare Disney against itself (literally) and complain about the clearly inferior product. That, to me, isn't a "hater". That's a good consumer.

I truly believe that a VAST number of people that are so pro-WDW are that way because frankly they don't know any better. They have nothing to compare it to. They've never been to the west coast, or god forbid Tokyo (which would REALLY ruin your view of WDW, trust me). They still have a swell time when they visit WDW, so everything is peachy. They don't mind that the Magic Kingdom hasn't had an E-ticket add in 20 years (20 YEARS!!!!!!!!!!). They're blissfully unaware. In a way, I envy them. I was one of them once. But I can't un-see what I've seen with my own eyes. What's done is done. There's a much better product out there than what WDW offers... Maybe even a few. And that's sad, because WDW used to be our "home resort". Not anymore.

I dare any of you to watch a good HD video of Sinbad's Storybook Voyage at DisneySea and not have it make your WDW heart sink just a bit. In fact, here's a link. Look at the detail. Look at every single effect fully functional. Listen to the MUSIC. The entire ride is in Japanese, and even with that, the storytelling is so amazing you know exactly what's going on. Jaw dropping. Completely jaw dropping.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I disagree. Maybe there's some overflow and sliding of funds for NextGen, but the reality is - NextGen has to happen. If Disney doesn't do it someone else will first - and then we'll all be that Disney charges too much to "be behind their competition in technology".

Instead we're all complaining about lack of maintenance and lack of new E-tickets.

Guess which one I'd rather complain about with regard to my Theme Park going experience?

 

[ExtinctJenn]

They don't mind that the Magic Kingdom hasn't had an E-ticket add in 20 years (20 YEARS!!!!!!!!!!).

Right but there are 3 other parks on property that have. I actually kind of agree with your theory though... I've never been anywhere other than WDW simply because I can't afford it. Now that said, I'm one of those "pixie dust snorters" I hear the D&G's talk about all the time but it's not being oblivious or blissfully unaware. As I walk the parks I see little things that need to be fixed... paint chipping here and there, whatever. I actually point them out to my DH and we often discuss. The difference is that I am able to take those things, compare/contrast them to all the positive things happening on property and come out feeling like I got my money's worth as well as feeling like they really are trying to make up for "the dark days" (as I put it). I just choose to focus on the positive and understand that sometimes... paint chips. LOL!

 

[lebeau]

I think they can successfully do both. The new FLE is going on, Test Track redo, supposedly prep work for Pandora, rumors of something at DHS (I get, still blue sky). I consider the work they're doing infrastructure to support the growth of the parks for years to come and a component of attractions and both need be happening.

You can and should do both. I disagree that Disney is doing both successfully.

The new FLE has been going on forever... When did that thing even start? I won't start another debate about the merits of the FLE. It is what it is. But there's no way it should have taken this long to build. And it won't be done for another 2 years because they tacked on a kiddie coaster? This is not a success.

Test Track redo sounds great. Funded by a sponsor. (Big surprise)

Pandora - at best a long ways off. May never happen.

DHS - Lots of plans, no funding. Even the rumors have TDO cutting away at the budget even at these early stages.

Yeti - Still broken.

I could run down the whole list of things Disney could (and should) be doing better. But you've got to be sick of hearing them. I'm sick of repeating them.

I'm happy Disney's investing some in technology. But not at the expense of this other stuff. As you say, they need to do both.

 

[lebeau]

Right but there are 3 other parks on property that have. I actually kind of agree with your theory though... I've never been anywhere other than WDW simply because I can't afford it. Now that said, I'm one of those "pixie dust snorters" I hear the D&G's talk about all the time but it's not being oblivious or blissfully unaware. As I walk the parks I see little things that need to be fixed... paint chipping here and there, whatever. I actually point them out to my DH and we often discuss. The difference is that I am able to take those things, compare/contrast them to all the positive things happening on property and come out feeling like I got my money's worth as well as feeling like they really are trying to make up for "the dark days" (as I put it). I just choose to focus on the positive and understand that sometimes... paint chips. LOL!

Now it's my turn to be inquisitive. What do you see as "the dark days"? I'm especially interested to know at what point you believe they turned things around.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I disagree. Maybe there's some overflow and sliding of funds for NextGen, but the reality is - NextGen has to happen. If Disney doesn't do it someone else will first - and then we'll all be that Disney charges too much to "be behind their competition in technology". Resort internet is the perfect example. Disney has been 10 years behind in that and now they're having to invest to catch up. It's an investment whether now or later and later usually only adds $$ and creates bad will about being behind.

I think they can successfully do both. The new FLE is going on, Test Track redo, supposedly prep work for Pandora, rumors of something at DHS (I get, still blue sky). I consider the work they're doing infrastructure to support the growth of the parks for years to come and a component of attractions and both need be happening.

The investment in the infrastrucure is definitely understood. But there are other things associated with it that are far more substantial than the technological advancements.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Right but there are 3 other parks on property that have. I actually kind of agree with your theory though... I've never been anywhere other than WDW simply because I can't afford it. Now that said, I'm one of those "pixie dust snorters" I hear the D&G's talk about all the time but it's not being oblivious or blissfully unaware. As I walk the parks I see little things that need to be fixed... paint chipping here and there, whatever. I actually point them out to my DH and we often discuss. The difference is that I am able to take those things, compare/contrast them to all the positive things happening on property and come out feeling like I got my money's worth as well as feeling like they really are trying to make up for "the dark days" (as I put it). I just choose to focus on the positive and understand that sometimes... paint chips. LOL!

And I think that's probably how so many of us started, Jenn. We'd go for a while and those things wouldn't bother us. Then we'd branch out and go other places and see more and more differences. Eventually I reached a point where it was obvious to me that my 3 to 4 trips to WDW a year were going to get seriously trimmed back, because we were having better experiences at DL or Tokyo, or even Paris. And it's frustrating to me that the product is better elsewhere. I wish it weren't. Like I said... WDW was our "home resort". So... I come here to voice my displeasure where I think it's warranted. I don't think WDW is ALL bad... We just visited in March. But it's not like it once was, and it's not like its sister properties elsewhere.

And I think that part of why I post here is to try to show folks like you that there's a better product out there... Because I know full well that nothing at WDW will change till the bottom line is effected. I'm trying to have others "bite the forbidden apple" to open their eyes to what's going on elsewhere, so to speak.

Watch the video I attached above of the Sinbad ride at Disney Sea. Really... Watch it. Look at all the characters and their unique movements. Look how they all work perfectly, and add to the story. Get swept up in the music. You won't understand a word (other than "compass of your heart" everyone once in a while), but it won't matter. Watch the story unfold. Look at the genie that's got to be 15 feet tall. check out the whale that literally takes up an entire room. It could make a person cry, it's so close to perfection. AND IT DOESN'T HAVE SOME KIND OF DISNEY MOVIE TIE-IN!!!!!!!!!! It's just... There. Buried in a back corner of Disney Sea... For those that happen upon it. Awe-inspiring. My kids couldn't wait to spend my money on plushes and the music CD of the ride the instant we stepped off the boat, and I could wait to LET them.

THAT is what WDW could be. THAT is what some Disney Parks already ARE.

THAT is why I post as I do here.

 

[ExtinctJenn]

Totally understand where you're coming from 20k. Trust me if I could visit the other options out there I would. We can afford a trip to WDW but if we had to add in airline tickets we'd be in trouble (so you can imagine why visiting the others isn't an option... yet). I do have a goal of visiting DL before I turn 40 (I won't mention how many years that gives me LOL) or on my 40th birthday but it's because I want to visit "the original" and walk where Walt once did. I can't say it's to see any specific thing because by then, who knows what'll be around.

 

[lebeau]

I watched your video. And all I can say is...

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Totally understand where you're coming from 20k. Trust me if I could visit the other options out there I would. We can afford a trip to WDW but if we had to add in airline tickets we'd be in trouble (so you can imagine why visiting the others isn't an option... yet). I do have a goal of visiting DL before I turn 40 (I won't mention how many years that gives me LOL) or on my 40th birthday but it's because I want to visit "the original" and walk where Walt once did. I can't say it's to see any specific thing because by then, who knows what'll be around.

And I totally understand that. I'm glad you get your WDW trips... So many these days can't even swing that.

And I really hope you get your DL trip you're wanting. But beware... You might come back from there and become a certified D&G cardholder! (You can forward your club fees to me... I'll make sure they get to the right place.)

I'm mostly just trying to give you some context behind why I am the way I am. I can't speak for everyone else... But I'd venture to say I'm not alone.

Btw, did you watch that video? Please do. It really is amazing. Gawd, I miss that ride. Ugh.

 

[djlaosc]

Can we get Sinbad and Indiana Jones Adventure to fill the two expansion plots in Adventureland?

 

[flynnibus]

What I find funny is that none of the firmly pro-WDW folks ever notice (or at least they won't admit it) that virtually every single "doom and gloomer" here raves about Disneyland. From show quality to food options to night time shows, it's nearly impossible to find someone complain about what's going on out there.

Not so - they are making plenty of bonehead moves out there too. Right now everything is overshadowed by the DCAv2 reboot, but they aren't flawless for sure (Rt66 bathrooms in Paradise Pier?? Indy effects.. etc). It's just often DL when brought up here is used comparatively to a situation in WDW where WDW is doing far worse in the comparison.

DL went far far lower than WDW did during it's dark times, but largely recovered in sense of show standards and most upkeep. They still deal with the sins of their fathers, and still face things like reductions in show, upkeep, pricing, merchandise, etc. But in many ways they are keeping their head above water much better than WDW as a whole. People give them a lot more slack when they are actually adding a ton of things consistently, where WDW keeps treading water hoping 'good enough' will carry them further.

WDW is fixing things (everyone loves to point out recent Main Street) - but only after unacceptable periods of time and running the show with subpar standards in the mean time.

Even if people don't want to believe the upkeep aspects - try comparing MK's parades and fireworks changes to the other parks...

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Can we get Sinbad and Indiana Jones Adventure to fill the two expansion plots in Adventureland?

Not unless they figure out a way to work Sinbad into a movie tie-in.