News Park attendance showing significant softness heading into the Fall 2018

[smile]

Unless the theatres were suffering their infamous meltdowns again...

here's hoping big bird has big heat sinks!

 

[xdan0920]

With as many problems as I see my friends who own have finding availability less than 7 months out?? No thank you!! Marie

There is never anything available at 7 months, forget inside 7 months. It's simple math, and for some reason DVC owners, myself included, are not up in arms over it. They have over saturated the market with points, and made it (nearly) impossible to book anywhere but your home resort right at the 11 month mark.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

There is never anything available at 7 months, forget inside 7 months. It's simple math, and for some reason DVC owners, myself included, are not up in arms over it. They have over saturated the market with points, and made it (nearly) impossible to book anywhere but your home resort right at the 11 month mark.

Depends on when you travel and room type wanted. We own at SSR, and while we love the resort, we want to stay at all DVC resorts eventually. We’ve not had any problems at 7 months, and are booked in a 1 bedroom at BWV for F&W, and at a Poly studio for next trip. Not saying people don’t have problems, but it’s nowhere near “impossible”.

 

[wannabeBelle]

There is never anything available at 7 months, forget inside 7 months. It's simple math, and for some reason DVC owners, myself included, are not up in arms over it. They have over saturated the market with points, and made it (nearly) impossible to book anywhere but your home resort right at the 11 month mark.

Exactly so I think. Sir's post earlier in the thread about dead points seems to make a lot of sense, given the problems I have seen with a friend getting a week long reservation unless it is done far enough in advance or willing to break her trip up into different resorts. Marie

 

[disneyflush]

We always rent points and the people we go through have availability at all the resorts at 11 months. We get studios so we have our request in the minute 11 months becomes official. We are staying at Boardwalk next year and if I read the room information correctly they only have 5 or 6 deluxe studios available in the DVC section of the resort. I also assume a lot of renters are being pulled into renting by the savings it provides (5 nights at Boardwalk for $1100ish plus no parking fees or taxes added on) and studios offer the lowest entry point for the deluxe resorts. This makes me think the demand for studios is being pushed hard by the rental folks like myself who have to get in at 11 months to get one. Once it hits 7 months I bet its super hard to get one outside of SSR and OKW. For anyone not owning DVC I think its becoming a pretty easy decision to rent points before the price per point starts catching up to the prices for rooms on the Disney website. We rent deluxe for a tiny bit more than renting a value would be when all the taxes and parking are included.

 

[ghidorah97]

Four of us were there this past weekend (Fri - Sun). Did MNSSHP Friday night and it was fairly busy. Overheard two CMs talking - the first said that they heard the event was sold out, the second said "No. It's 3,000 oversold." We had a 40 min. wait for Pirates pre-fireworks, 50-min. wait for Mine Train post-fireworks. Saturday was Epcot and, while the food booth lines never got to long (surprisingly), the wait for TT was 120 mins and SSE was 45 (which I have never seen before and would never wait that long for).

Sunday we decided to relax and did Tea at the GF.

Oh, and it was CRAZY hot (particularly on Friday) and humid.

 

[flynnibus]

Four of us were there this past weekend (Fri - Sun). Did MNSSHP Friday night and it was fairly busy. Overheard two CMs talking - the first said that they heard the event was sold out, the second said "No. It's 3,000 oversold." We had a 40 min. wait for Pirates pre-fireworks, 50-min. wait for Mine Train post-fireworks. Saturday was Epcot and, while the food booth lines never got to long (surprisingly), the wait for TT was 120 mins and SSE was 45 (which I have never seen before and would never wait that long for).

Sunday we decided to relax and did Tea at the GF.

Oh, and it was CRAZY hot (particularly on Friday) and humid.

So parties for sept have become the complete opposite of what the parties started out to be... a good way to experience the parks without the daily crowd load.

Goto party - limited and crowded
Go during week - bottom 10% of crowd levels of the year

Seems like the choice is obvious

 

[RustySpork]

So parties for sept have become the complete opposite of what the parties started out to be... a good way to experience the parks without the daily crowd load.

Goto party - limited and crowded
Go during week - bottom 10% of crowd levels of the year

Seems like the choice is obvious

If we go to the parks and make our own parties, will it help increase the crowds?! #SAVEWDW

 

[tirian]

I’ve heard that Guest surveys have been rating their trips as “overwhelming,” requiring too much planning for newbies who aren’t familiar with the resort. It’s probably not the sole reason for soft attendance, but it can’t be helping.

 

[Horizons '83]

So parties for sept have become the complete opposite of what the parties started out to be... a good way to experience the parks without the daily crowd load.

Goto party - limited and crowded
Go during week - bottom 10% of crowd levels of the year

Seems like the choice is obvious

The Night time afterhours at MK is the new Halloween and Christmas parties. Small crowds but you'll pay for it.

 

[tirian]

And coming.from a sales perspective, it takes 12 positive customer experiences to overcome 1 negative experience.

To maintain a neutral experience index:
For every 1 negative experience of a return customer requires 12 new one and done customers.

Is WDW running out of one and done customers?

...very interesting.

As far as your last question...I have wondered about that a lot. Much of the iger era - infact.

Even though it was never “cheap”...there was a long period where you could go without a HELOC.

Every labor study (US) seems to come to the same conclusion: the average worker hasn’t made more in a long time...any earnings gets gobble up immediately by the CPI.

So when a room at port Orleans goes up 100% (not an exaggeration...actually an understatement) in about 10 years...as does the one day ticket...

Can they cast the net as wide and is that trend of lower numbers to generate similar revenue going to continue that we’ve seen of late?

It’s a fair question. Have they lost clientele in a meaningful way?

For people like me who travel for work and stay in upper-middle-end hotels (Waldorf, Hyatt Regency, Swissotel, etc.), the Disney rates have gone from slightly higher to straight-up ridiculous.

But who actually pays rack rate? The rooms are often discounted.

 

[tirian]

I was just thinking about the lack of refurbs today when Expedition Everest went offline with "major technical difficulties" shortly after we arrived at 10am, and CMs clustered at the entrance were telling folks it would be down all day long.

15 years ago, on my "once in a lifetime" WDW trip as a faraway dreamer, I remember having to be very mindful when planning vacation dates around refurbishments that started in late summer-ish and stretched well through autumn and winter. Today, as a newly minted local, I've been amazed and appreciative of the lack of planned downtime - but unexpected ride breakdowns do seem to be happening much more frequently than anticipated. Are the "rolling refurbs" a thing of the past completely?

The MK still gets them. The other parks seem to operate until failure.

 

[Princess Leia]

I’ve heard that Guest surveys have been rating their trips as “overwhelming,” requiring too much planning for newbies who aren’t familiar with the resort. It’s probably not the sole reason for soft attendance, but it can’t be helping.

I'd understand if it kept a few guests away. I'm going with some Californians next month who have only done Disneyland, and they've put all planning in my hands because they're not accustomed to it (granted, until last year's trip, I wasn't accustomed to it either). I've had to explain a lot.

 

[flynnibus]

I’ve heard that Guest surveys have been rating their trips as “overwhelming,” requiring too much planning for newbies who aren’t familiar with the resort. It’s probably not the sole reason for soft attendance, but it can’t be helping.

Obviously the solution is to cut back on the # of offerings and attractions. That will solve it..

 

[RustySpork]

Obviously the solution is to cut back on the # of offerings and attractions. That will solve it..

If we cut back on offerings and attractions, we will need less cast, if we need less cast we will save more money, if we save more money we can pay more bonuses, IF WE PAY MORE BONUSES WE WILL HAVE MORE MONEY!

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

For people like me who travel for work and stay in upper-middle-end hotels (Waldorf, Hyatt Regency, Swissotel, etc.), the Disney rates have gone from slightly higher to straight-up ridiculous.

But who actually pays rack rate? The rooms are often discounted.

I’m in your general boat...just bought DVC before it priced itself out...

Anyone that contends iger has raised prices “normal with inflation” is putting their heart over their head...and thinking with their tuckus...

Just not accurate.

So they did the “Kohl’s pricing” thing about 10 years ago...but they continually bump prices all over the place.

The sun is the same: much higher increase rates than normal life

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I'd understand if it kept a few guests away. I'm going with some Californians next month who have only done Disneyland, and they've put all planning in my hands because they're not accustomed to it (granted, until last year's trip, I wasn't accustomed to it either). I've had to explain a lot.

The sad reality is Disneyland is simple compared to the magic band justification developing mess in Florida.

Here’s Disneyland:
Book hotel (mostly non Disney)
Buy ticket
Walk into park and go to fastpass kiosks if you want.
Prebook your food...or don’t...you decide.

That level of commitment barely gets you to the gates across from vista way from MCO in Florida...

 

[wannabeBelle]

Anyone that contends iger has raised prices “normal with inflation” is putting their heart over their head...and thinking with their tuckus...

Just not accurate.

@ParentsOf4 had a great graph that showed the pricing increases relative to inflation, which was awesome!! Marie

 

[Princess Leia]

The sad reality is Disneyland is simple compared to the magic band justification developing mess in Florida.

Here’s Disneyland:
Book hotel (mostly non Disney)
Buy ticket
Walk into park and go to fastpass kiosks if you want.
Prebook your food...or don’t...you decide.

That level of commitment barely gets you to the gates across from vista way from MCO in Florida...

The only thing that I would describe as slightly more complicated for them is that you need 2 tickets for the parties (can't just show up to a Halloween party without having a regular Disneyland ticket). I've been completely in charge of MagicBands, FP+, the hotel, and soon, Magical Express.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

@ParentsOf4 had a great graph that showed the pricing increases relative to inflation, which was awesome!! Marie

I saw it and it was ticket price...if I recall? It was a good chart.

Unfortunately there’s no way to account for all the details tied to a trip. Cherry picking a specific price allows them to hide much of the deets in the weeds...unfortunately.