OS: Confederate Flag Removed from Epcot

[Sage of Time]

You do understand that you walk through this hall to get to the show right? This hall is a part of the show, it sets up what is about to be told. These are the flags that are a part of the history of the US, now follow us through here to learn more about them.

Of course, but I think that symbolism needs to be unpacked more.

 

[s8film40]

Of course, but I think that symbolism needs to be unpacked more.

You mean like talking about it in a show? Are you one of those who uses this for naps?

 

[flynnibus]

no one is denying that it was a part of history

No, but we are trying to hide it from view and from the conversation. It's burying the topic vs facing it. Removing it from a setting intended as part of a historical presentation is a poster child of over-sensitivity that is sweeping the nation currently.

 

[AgeEight-E]

Of course, but I think that symbolism needs to be unpacked more.

Fine then, add something to the display that contextualizes the flag further.

But removing it altogether? How does that help anybody? Isn't that nothing more than corporate PR reactionism? They took the easy way out of the conversation.

 

[aw14]

Disney had a decision to make regarding a symbol that has received a tremendous amount of attention over the last month +. It is entirely within their right to remove it and/or leave it. They chose to remove it, in similar fashion to the Cosby bust to avoid any controversy. While I don't necessarily agree 100% with the decision, it is their decision to make

 

[flynnibus]

Several states were part of Mexico before they part of the United States- should we fly the Mexican flag in the right alongside Old Glory?

Logic fail... mexican territories were not territories that had become STATES (hence part of the union) that in turn left the union.

 

[AgeEight-E]

Disney had a decision to make regarding a symbol that has received a tremendous amount of attention over the last month +. It is entirely within their right to remove it and/or leave it. They chose to remove it, in similar fashion to the Cosby bust to avoid any controversy. While I don't necessarily agree 100% with the decision, it is their decision to make

Their right to do it isn't really in question here.

 

[Disneys America]

I honestly think most miss it as it was not the big ol' image most think of like on the roof of the General Lee, but the more subtle representation.
As posted on page 3, I believe.

So they left the 14-star version of the Stars and Bars on the left and removed the third flag of the Confederacy, the so-called "Blood-stained flag" on the right? Is that what I am to understand? If so, that is probably appropriate.

 

[wdisney9000]

I just dont understand how sooooooo many people are ALL OF THE SUDDEN offended by the flag. All those people have had their whole lives to make a statement about the flag but NEVER did. If the media had never shown the gunman with the flag, we wouldnt be discussing this and you could show a picture of the flag to those same people and I doubt they would be outraged. And people selectively choose where and when to get offended. Hilary Clinton wore the flag as a pin along side her husband who became president and is now marching around demanding it be removed. ITS ALL A SHOW

and Im not bashing Hill-Dog, just making a point as to how silly the whole issue is and how selective people CHOOSE to be.

 

[flynnibus]

Oh good lord.... Are liberals going to remove everything that we are not proud off. So we wont talk about civil rights, civil war, ect ect.... Just unicorns and rainbows.

Sorry, Unicorns are not organic. They represent the fixation of our government to genetically engineer things. I am offended by this idea that horses should be depicted as items to entertain us... Free the unicorns!!! err.. I mean free us from this mental oppression that unicorns are good!!!

 

[Mad Stitch]

Well I saw this coming. When I read a news article that the flag items were being removed from the bookstore in Gettysburg, I knew it wouldn't last long at the American Adventure. That's why I started the other thread asking about it.

As I noted earlier, had Disney used the earlier CSA flag (the one the CSA flew for the majority of it's existence), I doubt most people would even have noticed or cared (and it's a large leap to even assume most people even knows what the "Stars and Bars" really is, and what it looks like). But, instead they chose the final edition of the flag, which had the Battle Flag as part of it.

Look again. The 1st and 3rd national flags of the Confederate States of America are both on display in the Hall of Flags. According to the Orlando Sentinel article, only the 3rd national flag was taken down. Like you said, most people probably don't even recognize the 1st national flag as a confederate flag.

 

[Tigger1988]

I just dont understand how sooooooo many people are ALL OF THE SUDDEN offended by the flag. All those people have had their whole lives to make a statement about the flag but NEVER did. If the media had never shown the gunman with the flag, we wouldnt be discussing this and you could show a picture of the flag to those same people and I doubt they would be outraged. And people selectively choose where and when to get offended. Hilary Clinton wore the flag as a pin along side her husband who became president and is now marching around demanding it be removed. ITS ALL A SHOW

and Im not bashing Hill-Dog, just making a point as to how silly the whole issue is and how selective people CHOOSE to be.

View attachment 100447

That was not an official campaign button from Clinton/Gore and it's hilarious to watch people share it and spread false info.

I'd love to see proof of her wearing it, since apparently you've seen it.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Isn't that nothing more than corporate PR reactionism?

That's what this is in the end. The flag was there for 30+ years, with concerns over the flag's meaning going on long before that. I doubt many complained about this particular flag's presence, so why draw attention to it by taking it down?

 

[WDF]

England and France were prominent colonizers of Africa, and along with Portugal and Spain, the main participants in the Atlantic Slave Trade. It is a part of history, should we remove their flags from the display?

This flag that was removed flew over the very state in which Epcot is located. It is part of history.

 

[AgeEight-E]

I just dont understand how sooooooo many people are ALL OF THE SUDDEN offended by the flag. All those people have had their whole lives to make a statement about the flag but NEVER did. If the media had never shown the gunman with the flag, we wouldnt be discussing this and you could show a picture of the flag to those same people and I doubt they would be outraged. And people selectively choose where and when to get offended. Hilary Clinton wore the flag as a pin along side her husband who became president and is now marching around demanding it be removed. ITS ALL A SHOW

and Im not bashing Hill-Dog, just making a point as to how silly the whole issue is and how selective people CHOOSE to be.

You're talking about politicians making compromises to win votes. That's nothing new.

People have been offended by the Confederate flag for many, many years. There just was too much pushback from the other direction until now, and the church shooting was the straw that broke the camel's back for many.

 

[bhg469]

That's what this is in the end. The flag was there for 30+ years, with concerns over the flag's meaning going on long before that. I doubt many complained about this particular flag's presence, so why draw attention to it by taking it down?

Streisand Effect!

 

[aw14]

Their right to do it isn't really in question here.

I understand, just pondering why the arguments here?

Of course everyone is entitled to their own opinions, however, WDO is not going to care for a moment what a few folks on an online forum say.

This was a CYA move, and an understandable one at that.

 

[Sage of Time]

You mean like talking about it in a show? Are you one of those who uses this for naps?

I think my desire to see this in a show would speak volumes about my respect for history and my enjoyment of the American Adventure.

Don't take offense, but your desire to paint people as disrespectful and bored by history because they disagree with you on this subject is off-putting. Your admirable skills as a debater would be taken with greater respect if you were to drop that defensive pretext.

 

[Nubs70]

Atcually this is false, the emancipation proclamation was designed to give slaves that were in rebel terrorities immediate legal status if they managed to get to Union controlled territories either by union advances or running away. In fact it did not free all slaves.All slave states that stayed in the Union including Delaware, Kentucky, Maryland, and Missouri were not included. This was a war measures act that was as much a solution to a war time problem as it was a political statement. It was not until the 13th amendment was passed that slavery was outlawed in all states

Read the text.

The Emancipation Proclamation declared:
1. States, and parts of States, that were considered in rebellion.
2. State of rebellion was only for a period of 100 days.
3. Those held as slaves in the areas considered to be in rebellion were considered free men.

Problem is the Union had not legal binding authority on any of the areas considered to be in rebellion as those areas were no longer part of the political union known as the United States.

The political union was not restored until after the war. Then the Emancipation Proclamation would have legal binding authority.

 

[Sage of Time]

Fine then, add something to the display that contextualizes the flag further.

But removing it altogether? How does that help anybody? Isn't that nothing more than corporate PR reactionism? They took the easy way out of the conversation.

They did.

That's OK for a theme park to do. Not a museum.