Orlando Gunman Scouted WDW ...

[SorcererMC]

Isnt it a bit ironic?

I mean... Dont Islamic extremists hate anything that resemble fantasy, characters, etc.. (aka what disney stands for)?
I honestly believe he was not a fully Islamic follower (think of it as a christian who doesn't go much to church or participate in religious events) and wanted his last "hurray" of fun before going bonkers.

It is not uncommon for individuals who were not otherwise religious, but then become radicalized to engage in haram/forbidden behaviors. It is well-documented that extremist groups/FTOs like ISIS members will behave in ways contrary to Islam (b/c they aren't really practicing Islam, they are cherry-picking to support their extremist jihadist beliefs).

They hate what Disney stands for in so far as it is a representation of American values, beliefs, and way of life. Some extremist groups consider music haram, for example.

ETA: This shooter appears to have been equally motivated to commit terror by his homophobia as much as his radicalized religious beliefs. Not unusual, according to the persecution of homosexual individuals taking place by ISIS in Middle East.

 

[oceanbreeze77]

Isnt it a bit ironic?

I mean... Dont Islamic extremists hate anything that resemble fantasy, characters, etc.. (aka what disney stands for)?
I honestly believe he was not a fully Islamic follower (think of it as a christian who doesn't go much to church or participate in religious events) and wanted his last "hurray" of fun before going bonkers.

While disney is all about fantasy and fun, it also attracts those who may be cynical.People with a mental illness tend to enjoy those types of things, especially disney things, and although it is a great escape for the mentally ill who DONT intend to cause harm (not all mentally ill people are cynical), its also some sort of escape for those who may be more cynical than others but an escape in a creepier way.

God I love psychology and I just wish we could understand it all.

 

[Incomudro]

At this point, how does his presence at Disney Springs equate to scouting?

 

[SorcererMC]

[my transcript from video]
11:46 am CNN Gunman Visited Disney Site Before Attack

Evan Perez, Justice Correspondent - He visited Disney Springs as well as Pulse nightclub at the beginning of June, between June 1 and June 6, we don’t know how many times he visited, should note that it coincides w/ ‘Gay Days’ during that time, investigators believe that the purpose was to surveill the locations. Disney security officials believe and have reported to the FBI that there was an earlier visit on April 26 by Mateen, and wife and family, possibly for reconnaissance, and FBI is still investigating that possibility.

Learning about what investigators have been able to get by using search warrants, a computer, smartphone, digital camera.

Comes about the time when he was buying these firearms, the SigSaure rifle and pistol found at the site.

 

[MrHappy]

Th

According to his wife (who should be in jail btw) he was there for more than an ice cream
http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/06/...ted-disney-world-potential-target-report-says

Thank you for sharing this link. Perhaps I'm in denial, but I'd like to get more concrete evidence other than:

Noor Zahi Salman told
"a federal law enforcement source" who
told People Magazine that
Trace Gallagher reported

 

[oceanbreeze77]

At this point, how does his presence at Disney Springs equate to scouting?

Because someone who has just committed the worse mass shooting in America had frequented the place by himself leading up to the attack, and its been talked about how he may have done nothing while there (no purchases, activities, etc). No one is saying for sure that he was scouting WDW but it is being investigated because this could have been much worse than the worst shooting that america has seen.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Listening to a CBS Newsreport on WTOP as we speak saying that WDW was "cased " twice by the perpetrator, once in April and once more recently.

 

[PhotoDave219]

At this point, how does his presence at Disney Springs equate to scouting?

Thats an excellent question. What I'm posting comes from news reports quoting unnamed federal officials. Why do they feel he was casing/scouting? Damn good question.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

He specifically scouted Downtown Disney because its a soft target with a lot of possibilities for calamity. No security check, no metal detectors, crowds that will panic, etc. Disney has made it a point to say that you may not carry a concealed weapon here or anywhere else on their property even if you have a permit. Hence a "soft" target where its expected to be easier to do damage with less "risk" if you are a bad guy. And not because if you can conceal carry you can simply stop a bad guy, but lets face it, you don't bring a knife to a gun fight. Police cannot be everywhere but I don't want to see this thread hijacked with that debate

No one has any idea whether or not he "scouted" DS as a target, and to say so is simply rumor-mongering. Maybe he just likes Ghirardelli Ice Cream or likes Earl of Sandwich.

Is DS a "soft" target? Yes, but so are thousands of other places in central Florida alone.

 

[Donald Razorduck]

Agreed 100% on all counts.

God help us if this shooting doesn't do what the Columbines and Sandy Hooks and Auroras haven't. Weapons of mass killing were never guaranteed by our forefathers and, even if they had been, times and realities change. Maybe I didn't understand my history, but I don't believe Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson would have advocated Americans having the 'right' to commit mass slaughters on a regular basis.

Ya know I usually agree with you but this is so off it's kinda sad.

What is a weapon of mass killing? You cla8m guns. That's nice, how about a Ford 150? A person hell bent on committing mass murder can just as easily plow thru a crowd and kill as many as this shooting, especially if the crowd was targeting and the driver had a plan. Let's ban Ford Trucks.

To ban such weapons now is pointless, there way too many. Have you seen the guns sales numbers in the past 8 years? So, you would have to confiscate guns from legal owners. That would sign the death warrant of the United Statea, it would literally split the country. You must not spend much time in flyover country.

Here is a Ruger 10/22 semi auto rifle, the amount of these out in the ol' US of A is likely in the 100,000s of thousands. We folk in Arkansas consider this a hunting gun for the likes of squirrel or varmints like rats.

Now, here is a Ruger SR 22

Those guns are the same, the internal mechanisms are the exact same, the only thing different is the the outward appearance or basically how they are dressed. While the wood stock version only holds 10 rounds out of the box, but...it will accept much larger clips like the evil looking one.

There are 100,000s of thousands of extra capacity clips out there, maybe more than actual gun. They were banned the last time and massed produced before the ban went in effect. Goodness knows how many have been made since the lapse.

What's really scary is how either one is turned fully out with a drimel.

Now, if DC wants to outlaw those, go ahead, like I said, the country is full of them and 100,000s of 1,000s of people have been hoarding .22 ammo as well. You would be insane to try and confiscate them, you'll have a full on modern day rebellion. You may not know the folks I know. So many of them are ex and even current military and they will not go along with that.

 

[SorcererMC]

No one has any idea whether or not he "scouted" DS as a target, and to say so is simply rumor-mongering. Maybe he just likes Ghirardelli Ice Cream or likes Earl of Sandwich.

Is DS a "soft" target? Yes, but so are thousands of other places in central Florida alone.

Please see my above post (ETA: #211). Disney security officials are cooperating with the FBI investigation. There may not be a definitive statement (from Disney or the feds) as to the shooter's known intentions/motivations for some time, but I think it is safe to say that it is not rumor-mongering in the context of the attack which has taken place.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

Thats an excellent question. What I'm posting comes from news reports quoting unnamed federal officials. Why do they feel he was casing/scouting? Damn good question.

Unnamed federal sources who have an agenda of - let's make it look bigger than it was so our funding and reach can grow. Fear monger the people, and they'll let us even deeper into their personal lives than ever before. Don't think that's the reason? Think again.

 

[mgf]

I am reasonably certain the likely low level FLO leaking the info does not have that sophisticated of an agenda. If the leak is coming from higher up, they would likely not mess around with freaking people out about going to Disney for no reason. Disney and FL tourism have too much influence to be toyed with for political gain. No one wants to own that kind of economic fall out. There is no upside.

(More likely this is probably Hanlon's Razor in action.)

 

[LuvtheGoof]

Please see my above post (ETA: #211). Disney security officials are cooperating with the FBI investigation. There may not be a definitive statement (from Disney or the feds) as to the shooter's known intentions/motivations for some time, but I think it is safe to say that it is not rumor-mongering in the context of the attack which has taken place.

But my problem is that all of the news agencies are now making it out like he was definitely targeting Disney or at least implying it. Disney has probably been talking with federal officials for the past 15 years, and maybe even before then, since there have been other terror attacks from the 80's and 90's. That isn't news, and never has been. What security measures are being taken by Disney is no one's right to know, since if they tell you, they tell the terrorists as well.

So yes, it is rumor-mongering by the press for clicks and views. Nothing more. You are simply helping it along by repeating the drivel, since the fact that he visited DS has NOTHING to do with the attack he perpetrated.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Unnamed federal sources who have an agenda of - let's make it look bigger than it was so our funding and reach can grow. Fear monger the people, and they'll let us even deeper into their personal lives than ever before. Don't think that's the reason? Think again.

Mine is not to agree nor disagree. Simply passing on that this story isnt going away, rather the converse.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

Mine is not to agree nor disagree. Simply passing on that this story isnt going away, rather the converse.

Fair enough.

 

[bebert]

I would imagine WDW and Disney Springs is scouted every day by people who want to do terrible things, just like every other major social gathering place. It did not start or end with this nut job.Sad reality on today's world.

 

[evnted]

looks like Disney notified the FBI in April about this guy and nothing happened...

https://twitter.com/KRayWFTV/status/742761598822035456

 

[ford91exploder]

I believe that there is generally no duty to report a crime. The only way they could get her is if she did something to help conceal or aid in the crime, but not reporting someone is not a crime. It is obviously a serious moral issue but perhaps not a legal one

Depends on the crime bog standard property crimes no, A terrorist act or a crime which can result in bodily injury or death yes you MUST report that kind of crime.

 

[ford91exploder]

Why the HELL was this guy NOT in Gitmo having his 'buddy list' sweated out of him, He was talking for MONTHS on how he was going to kill a bunch of people in the name of his so called god.

And right up there on the top of the list of despicable acts he abandoned his 3 year old son, Who right now is crying his eyes out because the daddy he idolized is not coming home, 3 year olds don't care about mythical moon gods their whole world is mommy and daddy.

For those who have read Dante's Inferno the lowest level of the hells is too good for this guy.