Orlando Gunman Scouted WDW ...

[rob0519]

Megyn Kelly just tweeted https://twitter.com/megynkelly/status/742879009055215616

"Reports now suggesting that Disney notified the FBI that Mateen & his wife may have been scouting the park back in April... more at 9p ET."

I can guarantee that he will not be the last Muslim Terrorist to do so.

The key phrase in all these reports is "may have been". Mateen and his wife" may have just been taking their son to the Magic Kingdom" like thousands of other parents. Until and unless the wife confesses they were there to scout the part for attack, anything put out by the press is pure speculation.

 

[puntagordabob]

The key phrase in all these reports is "may have been". Mateen and his wife" may have just been taking their son to the Magic Kingdom" like thousands of other parents. Until and unless the wife confesses they were there to scout the part for attack, anything put out by the press is pure speculation.

No the fbi has stated that there is evidence that he did in fact scout Disney Springs (though they called it Downtown Disney)....

 

[rob0519]

No the fbi has stated that there is evidence that he did in fact scout Disney Springs (though they called it Downtown Disney)....

No, you didn't read the tweet correctly "Reports now suggesting that Disney notified the FBI that Mateen & his wife may have been scouting the park back in April... more at 9p ET." There is no substantiated report that I have seen about scouting the "park". I've not seen any report that the FBI (capital letters) has stated there is evidence of him scouting Disney Springs, but I'll take your word for it. If someone sees him in a Publix, does that mean he was scouting that too?

 

[puntagordabob]

No, you didn't read the tweet correctly "Reports now suggesting that Disney notified the FBI that Mateen & his wife may have been scouting the park back in April... more at 9p ET." There is no substantiated report that I have seen about scouting the "park". I've not seen any report that the FBI (capital letters) has stated there is evidence of him scouting Disney Springs, but I'll take your word for it. If someone sees him in a Publix, does that mean he was scouting that too?

Uh how about his wife has actually stated so on the record to investigators........ Further down Disney Security officials are also on record stating that they believe this guy as their to conduct surveillance.

So I am not sure about the tweet you mentioned...but this article is from literally 20 minutes ago so I stand behind my original post.

according to CNN ( http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/14/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/index.html )

(CNN)Investigators believe the Orlando nightclub gunman made surveillance trips to the club and a Disney shopping complex earlier this month -- the same week Disney and other sites were hosting Gay Days 2016.

Omar Mir Seddique Mateen's visits to the Pulse gay nightclub and Disney Springs happened between June 1 and June 6, a law enforcement official said Tuesday. Gay Days 2016 celebrations took place at Walt Disney World and other Orlando locations between May 31 and June 6.


(Still from CNN) Disney security officials told the FBI they believe Mateen visited Disney World on April 26 to conduct surveillance, a law enforcement official told CNN. The FBI is investigating that possibility.
Mateen's wife also was with him on the Disney World visit. Federal authorities have questioned Salman, who told them, according to a law enforcement official, that her husband had talked about a jihadist attack but she denied knowing he planned to attack the gay club.

More than a month after that Disney World trip, Mateen and his wife visited Pulse and Disney Springs -- an entertainment and shopping complex -- apparently to scout out the locations, a law enforcement official said. Authorities believe he was conducting surveillance, based on information learned in interviews.
The early June visits took place during the same period Mateen was purchasing the weapons used in the devastating attack.

 

[SorcererMC]

Orlando Sentinel:
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...y-springs-adding-security-20160614-story.html
Excerpt re: Disney Springs Gunman Presence


Mateen has visited a number of Disney properties since April, and was most recently spotted early this month in Disney Springs, according to a U.S. law enforcement official briefed on the Pulse shooting investigation.

Another U.S. official said that information provided to the FBI by Disney made it clear that Mateen was not simply acting as a tourist during a visit to Disney World two or three months ago.

U.S. officials say Mateen may have been casing the sites for potential attack but reaching a firm conclusion on that theory would be difficult because he was killed.

 

[WDW1974]

fix gun sale black lists and fix whatever systematically broke down on the FBIs part. but stop blaming guns.
i was two blocks away from the marathon bombing i saw thousands of people running in fear....i saw army soilders on corners the next day and those killers did not blow anything up with a firearm. ps an AR15 is not an assualt rifle.

I'm going to blame guns. Guns in the hands of evil people or mentally ill people do untold carnage in this country every year. And there is no getting around that. We have a national hardon for guns and no great society will survive the mass bloodletting that we seem to think is acceptable. It isn't. Not in a civilized society that values human life.

I'm not talking about banning all guns (although that has worked in many nations). I am talking about banning these weapons of mass destruction and greatly reducing just what an average person can stockpile.

This mentality of playing to crazy gun-lovers who think that either a zombie apocalypse or a power-mad Prez (only worry if you're voting for the hair) is going to come after them has just got to stop. It's sheer insanity. Not a difference of opinion. Insanity.

I saw a meme passing earlier showing two kids (one holding a candy egg with a plastic toy in the middle, the other showing a kid with an assault rifle and talking about what one we deem a danger for children). Our love for weapons of killing and maiming is grotesque. Totally.

I have been to 28 freaking countries, including evil, Godless, Commie, pinko China and never felt as unsafe as I often do in FL. Take a look at how much gun violence we have ...

 

[WDW1974]

Welp, guess you gotta arm up. That seems to be the general consensus in our country. You mention later in this thread that we don't live in the Wild West, but there are an overwhelming amount of people here who would prefer that. Get yer gun and defend the homestead. Oh, and also carry it everywhere you go in case you need to go into Rambo mode and defend the movie theater or the bar or the theme park in this case. Cowboy up everyone, there's shootin to do.

This is the problem. This redneck/hillbilly/military mentality that has no place in a civilized western democracy. I don't want a gun. And, no, I don't think people should be able to get them easier than kids-- or veterans -- can get healthcare. This is insanity and I have never heard one legit argument for why we need all these guns. The government has every right to do what's best for all the people when there is a horrific safety issue. And let's all realize that while it's cool to attack radical Islamic nutjobs, most gun violence isn't caused by anyone resembling them.

 

[WDW1974]

Guns are a tool. Hate and evil are the terror.

You can place a gun on a table and it will lay there for ever without terrorizing anyone.

Except guns don't exist in a world where people don't ... a world where kids don't find them ... a world where an angry spouse decides in a fit of anger and depression to kill his/her entire family ... a world where people aren't screwed by employers after decades of loyalty and cause people to snap. How much more do you need?

I certainly agree that if everyone respected each other and guns themselves that we could have them. But then what would the purpose be? They exist to maim and kill.

 

[WDW1974]

Disney has ALWAYS been considered a threat, ever since 9/11. To bring it up as a LEAD piece in a news story about this attack, as fox news apparently is, is wrong. Why not a headline that reads Universal City Walk was cased for the attack as well? I haven't seen that one, have you? Only Disney. And just because he bought tickets in April again has NO bearing on this attack. Maybe he likes Disney, and wanted to visit there. It's click bait pure and simple.

The media coverage on Disney being a potential target has been fair. I think we all get, by now, that you don't. Can we move on?

 

[PhotoDave219]

Except guns don't exist in a world where people don't ... a world where kids don't find them ... a world where an angry spouse decides in a fit of anger and depression to kill his/her entire family ... a world where people aren't screwed by employers after decades of loyalty and cause people to snap. How much more do you need?

I certainly agree that if everyone respected each other and guns themselves that we could have them. But then what would the purpose be? They exist to maim and kill.

Speaking of that...... Sheriff's Office was zero help tonight. Thankfully i have a 900 mile buffer.....

 

[rob0519]

Uh how about his wife has actually stated so on the record to investigators........ Further down Disney Security officials are also on record stating that they believe this guy as their to conduct surveillance.

So I am not sure about the tweet you mentioned...but this article is from literally 20 minutes ago so I stand behind my original post.

according to CNN ( http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/14/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/index.html )

(CNN)Investigators believe the Orlando nightclub gunman made surveillance trips to the club and a Disney shopping complex earlier this month -- the same week Disney and other sites were hosting Gay Days 2016.

Omar Mir Seddique Mateen's visits to the Pulse gay nightclub and Disney Springs happened between June 1 and June 6, a law enforcement official said Tuesday. Gay Days 2016 celebrations took place at Walt Disney World and other Orlando locations between May 31 and June 6.


(Still from CNN) Disney security officials told the FBI they believe Mateen visited Disney World on April 26 to conduct surveillance, a law enforcement official told CNN. The FBI is investigating that possibility.
Mateen's wife also was with him on the Disney World visit. Federal authorities have questioned Salman, who told them, according to a law enforcement official, that her husband had talked about a jihadist attack but she denied knowing he planned to attack the gay club.

More than a month after that Disney World trip, Mateen and his wife visited Pulse and Disney Springs -- an entertainment and shopping complex -- apparently to scout out the locations, a law enforcement official said. Authorities believe he was conducting surveillance, based on information learned in interviews.
The early June visits took place during the same period Mateen was purchasing the weapons used in the devastating attack.

Uh, how about:
"believe the Orlando nightclub gunman made surveillance trips to the club and a Disney shopping complex"
Believe means not know for sure. Disney Shopping Complex is not one of the parks which was my original comment.

"apparently to scout out the locations, a law enforcement official said. Authorities believe"
Apparently is not definitely and again, the use of the word believe. Until there is some way to confirm intent it's all speculation.

Do I think he was scouting Disney Springs? If he was indeed there, I would imagine he was scouting and realized a closed building was a better target than an open air mall.

This whole topic is simply depressing. This is my last post in any thread regarding this topic. I wish the forum would now remove them for good.

 

[Cesar R M]

Uh how about his wife has actually stated so on the record to investigators........ Further down Disney Security officials are also on record stating that they believe this guy as their to conduct surveillance.

So I am not sure about the tweet you mentioned...but this article is from literally 20 minutes ago so I stand behind my original post.

according to CNN ( http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/14/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/index.html )

(CNN)Investigators believe the Orlando nightclub gunman made surveillance trips to the club and a Disney shopping complex earlier this month -- the same week Disney and other sites were hosting Gay Days 2016.

Omar Mir Seddique Mateen's visits to the Pulse gay nightclub and Disney Springs happened between June 1 and June 6, a law enforcement official said Tuesday. Gay Days 2016 celebrations took place at Walt Disney World and other Orlando locations between May 31 and June 6.


(Still from CNN) Disney security officials told the FBI they believe Mateen visited Disney World on April 26 to conduct surveillance, a law enforcement official told CNN. The FBI is investigating that possibility.
Mateen's wife also was with him on the Disney World visit. Federal authorities have questioned Salman, who told them, according to a law enforcement official, that her husband had talked about a jihadist attack but she denied knowing he planned to attack the gay club.

More than a month after that Disney World trip, Mateen and his wife visited Pulse and Disney Springs -- an entertainment and shopping complex -- apparently to scout out the locations, a law enforcement official said. Authorities believe he was conducting surveillance, based on information learned in interviews.
The early June visits took place during the same period Mateen was purchasing the weapons used in the devastating attack.

The question is, what if she is now trying to save face.
like going "I totally tried to prevent him from doing so" yet she did nothing and did not alert authorities.
she could be lying.
After all the whole case is weird. I mean, he's being reported to have had encounters in gay bars before.
Had a gay dating app and used it..
I wonder if that Iman who was supposedly spreading anti homosexual agenda affected him and make him go nutso.

 

[UpAllNight]

So IF the story about Disney notifying the FBI in April is true....can we accept there is more than security 'theater' in place at Disney World. Someone noticed suspicious behaviour, meaning there are people looking out. IF that story is true. There's millions of visitors a year, it takes a certain level of security to notice something like this, I'd argue. Once again, I specify If that story is correct. It possibly isn't.

 

[seabreezept813]

I'm going to blame guns. Guns in the hands of evil people or mentally ill people do untold carnage in this country every year. And there is no getting around that. We have a national hardon for guns and no great society will survive the mass bloodletting that we seem to think is acceptable. It isn't. Not in a civilized society that values human life.

I'm not talking about banning all guns (although that has worked in many nations). I am talking about banning these weapons of mass destruction and greatly reducing just what an average person can stockpile.

This mentality of playing to crazy gun-lovers who think that either a zombie apocalypse or a power-mad Prez (only worry if you're voting for the hair) is going to come after them has just got to stop. It's sheer insanity. Not a difference of opinion. Insanity.

I saw a meme passing earlier showing two kids (one holding a candy egg with a plastic toy in the middle, the other showing a kid with an assault rifle and talking about what one we deem a danger for children). Our love for weapons of killing and maiming is grotesque. Totally.

I have been to 28 freaking countries, including evil, Godless, Commie, pinko China and never felt as unsafe as I often do in FL. Take a look at how much gun violence we have ...

I used that specific ad in my AP class. It certainly generated a great deal of discussion. I have to completely agree with this mentality. No one needs machine guns for self defense.

 

[SorcererMC]

And let's all realize that while it's cool to attack radical Islamic nutjobs, most gun violence isn't caused by anyone resembling them.

People often forget that prior to 9/11, the worst terrorist attack in the US was the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing carried out by an anti-govt extremist (another case of homegrown terrorism).

 

[SorcererMC]

"believe the Orlando nightclub gunman made surveillance trips to the club and a Disney shopping complex"
Believe means not know for sure. Disney Shopping Complex is not one of the parks which was my original comment.

"apparently to scout out the locations, a law enforcement official said. Authorities believe"
Apparently is not definitely and again, the use of the word believe. Until there is some way to confirm intent it's all speculation.

The reason that there will continue to be statements implying uncertainty is b/c there is no 100% certainty, there is 'allegedly'. Within the context of an ongoing investigation and of terrorism, an investigator can only assign a probable value to what is known from the observable evidence, whether that is what is found on the shooter's computer, statements made by people who knew him or other eyewitness accounts, and his behavior on video/security camera surveillance. It is why the FBI says that they are 'highly confident' that he was radicalized.

 

[SorcererMC]

There's millions of visitors a year, it takes a certain level of security to notice something like this, I'd argue.

I'm very curious to know what sort of 'suspicious activity' was exhibited by the shooter. This does attest to the level of skill/ knowledge/ experience of Disney security.

I believe that the WDW Disney property is as safe as can be reasonably expected, that further measures will be added, and if I had plans for a trip this summer, I wouldn't cancel them (ETA: hypothetically....I know that some of you do have plans and have to make a decision about your own level of comfort/safety.)

 

[BrerJon]

It's pretty obvious isn't it? I don't think there is any other way to explain it. Terror attack anywhere on property will signal the end of WDW as we know it. That's not some fear mongering conjecture, that's a cold hard fact

It will certainly change security arrangements, but I don't think it would signal the end of WDW as we know it. There would be an attendance dip, and probably a lot less international guests for a while, but people would come back to show solidarity and prove the terrorists wrong, as they always do in these events.

 

[epcotWSC]

You know, when I was Italy, they place Military outside of every major tourist attraction, train station, etc. with assault rifles ready in case anything went down. It seriously would not bother me if we did the same in the US with the way things are going.

 

[BrerJon]

So IF the story about Disney notifying the FBI in April is true....can we accept there is more than security 'theater' in place at Disney World. Someone noticed suspicious behaviour, meaning there are people looking out. IF that story is true. There's millions of visitors a year, it takes a certain level of security to notice something like this, I'd argue. Once again, I specify If that story is correct. It possibly isn't.

People are misunderstanding the wording of 'Disney informed the FBI he visited in April'... they mean since the weekend they've checked the records and found he visited in April and have now told the FBI, not that they told the FBI about a random suspicious character a couple of months before the shootings.