Not good but saw it coming

[GothMickey]

Okay....we got it...you don't like the ride, but I guess that's not an agenda.

Let's move on.

Right, I do not like the ride, but I am not leading a charge to Disney's door to get it shut down.. By all means, go on it if you like it... My choice is not to... Doesn't make me right or wrong... Just like it doesn't make you right or wrong.. But a lot of people are quick to blame the woman and not the ride.. I was just tossing up the idea that maybe instead of making Disney innocent and blaming the victim, that could it be M:S is dangerous and therefore not right for a Disney park???? An agenda would be me trying to convince all of you that M:S is bad and trying to force you to accept it... Not stating my feelings toward it, and opinions..

 

[peter11435]

What triggered his condition leading to his death???

Mission: Space may very well have been what triggered his condition. However that does not mean the ride killed him.

There are a million other things that would have done the same thing to that boy.

 

[GothMickey]

Nothing "triggered his condition". That makes no sense. His condition was already there. The ride may or may not have exacerbated the condition, but of course we do not know.

How does it not make sense? He had a pre-existing condition that his doctor didn't even notice... he rode M:S and died... Wouldn't it be fair for someone to put 2 and 2 together and say M:S could have triggered this condition to a point where it killed him????

Wannabe posted other factors that could have caused his death and I do agree with them....

 

[Shaman]

If Disney could somehow demonstrate the forces involved to the people before they go into the ride perhaps it would get people to be more thoughful about their conditions...maybe have some sort of model, and explain to people that they have to be healthy to ride, as it is one of the most realistic simulation of space travel available to civilians.

All signs are clear...and they repeat it...but maybe they should have an actual person on those screens explaining things. They should incorporate that into the theme of the ride..."all trainees must be in excellent healthly conditions to proceed"...explain why, etc....

 

[Pete C]

Yo GothMickey, we are on the same page. I think we are fighting a losing battle here though. People keep bringing up the same pointless arguments, and sticking up for the ride as if it can't be at fault becuase WDI designed it to some specifications that are bulletproof in their minds. Apparently Disney opened the ride this morning, so they are content to let the ride die naturally as bad publicity and fear spreads. Eventually someone is going to die on it again...I would bank on that, and we will re-visit this same arguement again in the future.

 

[Timmay]

How does it not make sense? He had a pre-existing condition that his doctor didn't even notice... he rode M:S and died... Wouldn't it be fair for someone to put 2 and 2 together and say M:S could have triggered this condition to a point where it killed him????

Wannabe posted other factors that could have caused his death and I do agree with them....

Well, how can something "trigger" a condition when it is already there? Take asthma...something may trigger an attack, but the person already has asthma in the first place, so something cannot trigger the disease itself...only exacerbate it or worsen it.

 

[WDWGuide]

Look, if you like M:S then by all means go on it.. But responding with sarcasm like this only leads me to think one way of people on here, which I won't post as to not offend.... Ride M:S, I hope you never get sick from it...

That wasn't sarcasm - the centrifuge pits are large enough to install small hub-and-spoke carousels. Eisner (during his later years) and Pressler had a well-documented history of preferring cheap off-the-shelf rides with a minor themed overlay over major e-ticket attractions.
If it came out that Mission: Space really is the innocent-guest-slaughtering-ride-of-ultimate-doom, that would be a suitable temporary repurposing of the building. While I did say that slightly tongue-in-cheek (which is part of my lovable personality, which I am sadly not about to change to suit your preferences), I would prefer such a solution to simply tearing the building down altogether or it playing "Mission: Idle" for ten years like the 20,000 Leagues legoon did.

I do hope neither will be necessary, but like I said - safety should be a major priority.

 

[sleepybear]

I'm probably going to regret getting into this fray, but here goes:

First, I enjoy Mission:Space. I'm not advocating they tear it down. And I'm not blaming the ride per se on any tragic happenings. But I am curious as to how many park guests need to die after going on a ride for some people in this forum to at least admit that perhaps Mission:Space DID play some small role in it. It's OK if you love the ride and love Disney and want it to stay open for eternity. But at least acknowledge that maybe the ride had something to do with it.

It seems to me that if two people die within a year of each other (regardless of their ages, medical history, etc.) then all of us need to take a step back, take a deep breath and ponder whether Mission:Space is doing more harm than good. Right now, I'm on the fence. On one hand, it's enjoyed (safely) by hordes of people every year. But on the other hand, whether it caused the deaths or not, it is becoming a liability for Disney.

 

[Legacy]

Possible it was a combination of everything you mentioned... Guess you are right, we'll never know.. However, that does not change the fact he ws on M:S when ti happened, which would lead people to believe the ride help aggravate it leading to his death.... That is all I am saying... And it does not change the fact that many people have gotten sick as a result of the ride itself...

I guess we can determine one thing from this.. We all agree to disagree... A lady lost her life on vacation.. What was to be a happy time turned tragic, no matter what the circumstances are...

So... if someone takes Ambien and decides to go for a drive, they fall asleep at the wheel and kill themselves when the car drifts off the road and hits a tree, who is to blame? The Ambien or the car?

People get sink from drinking too much alcohol... who is to blame? The beer or the bars?

People die from overdosing on sleeping pills... who is to blame? The doctor for prescribing them or the pills themselves?

How about we blame the people who made the choice.

 

[GothMickey]

That wasn't sarcasm - the centrifuge pits are large enough to install small hub-and-spoke carousels. Eisner (during his later years) and Pressler had a well-documented history of preferring cheap off-the-shelf rides with a minor themed overlay over major e-ticket attractions.
If it came out that Mission: Space really is the innocent-guest-slaughtering-ride-of-ultimate-doom, that would be a suitable temporary repurposing of the building. While I did say that with a hint of sarcasm (which is part of my lovable personality, which I am sadly not about to change to suit your preferences), I would prefer such a solution to simply tearing the building down altogether or it playing "Mission: Idle" for ten years like the 20,000 Leagues legoon did.

I do hope neither will be necessary, but like I said - safety should be a major priority.

I appreciated the slight sarcasm... Made me laugh actually. We need some relief in this thread... Thank you...

 

[MickeyTigg]

First, I enjoy Mission:Space. I'm not advocating they tear it down. And I'm not blaming the ride per se on any tragic happenings. But I am curious as to how many park guests need to die after going on a ride for some people in this forum to at least admit that perhaps Mission:Space DID play some small role in it.

Is M:S an intense ride...yes. Did it contribute to the deaths of these people....possibly but unlikely.

If the last death was caused by a health problem that was known...there are enough warnings in the queue and on any Guidemap that the responsibility rides with the guest to not get on the attraction.

If it was an undetected problem....my take is that sometimes it's just your time to go and riding or not riding an attraction isn't going to change the outcome a whole lot. She could have died later eating a churro or riding a bus. Would we blame the churro or the bus for contributing to her death? No, of course not.

While I understand your point about being "Disney Blind", we also have to acknowledge that M:S and Disney have huge targets on them and when anything happens that is remotely related to them it gets big headlines and a lot of notice much of it unwarranted.

Hundreds of injuries and probably a few deaths happen at theme parks/amusement or thrill parks every year. Do we hear about them no....why? Because they don't have the "Disney target" on them and there aren't discussion boards like this to keep the talk going on those incidents.

So yeah...let's keep this all in perspective.

 

[wannab@dis]

I'm probably going to regret getting into this fray, but here goes:

First, I enjoy Mission:Space. I'm not advocating they tear it down. And I'm not blaming the ride per se on any tragic happenings. But I am curious as to how many park guests need to die after going on a ride for some people in this forum to at least admit that perhaps Mission:Space DID play some small role in it. It's OK if you love the ride and love Disney and want it to stay open for eternity. But at least acknowledge that maybe the ride had something to do with it.

It seems to me that if two people die within a year of each other (regardless of their ages, medical history, etc.) then all of us need to take a step back, take a deep breath and ponder whether Mission:Space is doing more harm than good. Right now, I'm on the fence. On one hand, it's enjoyed (safely) by hordes of people every year. But on the other hand, whether it caused the deaths or not, it is becoming a liability for Disney.

There's another thread that discusses exactly this issue. It's been much less heated than this one. http://forums.wdwmagic.com/showthread.php?t=73778

 

[GothMickey]

Yo GothMickey, we are on the same page. I think we are fighting a losing battle here though. People keep bringing up the same pointless arguments, and sticking up for the ride as if it can't be at fault becuase WDI designed it to some specifications that are bulletproof in their minds. Apparently Disney opened the ride this morning, so they are content to let the ride die naturally as bad publicity and fear spreads. Eventually someone is going to die on it again...I would bank on that, and we will re-visit this same arguement again in the future.

Disney apologists I call them... Like Clinton apologists.. Bush apologists.. People who can see no wrong in the person or entity they follow as a die hard fan... Disney makes mistakes... And they dropped the ball on M:S.. In order to justify spening 160 million on a ride that is now well known to cause illness, they reopen it... Sooner or later Disney is going to have to be held accountable for this attraction... Whether people like it or not... Personally, I don't care if Disney shuts it down for good or keeps it open... But how many will have to get sick or die before Disney realizes this ride may be dangerous???

 

[JimboJones123]

Nothing "triggered his condition". That makes no sense. His condition was already there. The ride may or may not have exacerbated the condition, but of course we do not know.

um-- isn't this a family friendly site? Are words like that necessary?

 

[SpongeScott]

um-- isn't this a family friendly site? Are words like that necessary?

what the heck are you talking about?

ex·ac·er·bate ([FONT=verdana, sans-serif] P [/FONT]) Pronunciation Key (

g-z

s

r-b

t

)
tr.v. ex·ac·er·bat·ed, ex·ac·er·bat·ing, ex·ac·er·bates
<DL><DD>To increase the severity, violence, or bitterness of; aggravate</DD></DL>

 

[Timmay]

I'm probably going to regret getting into this fray, but here goes:

First, I enjoy Mission:Space. I'm not advocating they tear it down. And I'm not blaming the ride per se on any tragic happenings. But I am curious as to how many park guests need to die after going on a ride for some people in this forum to at least admit that perhaps Mission:Space DID play some small role in it. It's OK if you love the ride and love Disney and want it to stay open for eternity. But at least acknowledge that maybe the ride had something to do with it.

It seems to me that if two people die within a year of each other (regardless of their ages, medical history, etc.) then all of us need to take a step back, take a deep breath and ponder whether Mission:Space is doing more harm than good. Right now, I'm on the fence. On one hand, it's enjoyed (safely) by hordes of people every year. But on the other hand, whether it caused the deaths or not, it is becoming a liability for Disney.

Of course M:S may have aggrivated the medical conditions of the two people that died...I don't think there is anyone here saying otherwise. And we all know that Disney knows that thses type rides can aggrivate medical conditions...see, that is why they have all those warnings. Disney undertands there is a risk to riding some of their attractions and warns us.

 

[GothMickey]

So... if someone takes Ambien and decides to go for a drive, they fall asleep at the wheel and kill themselves when the car drifts off the road and hits a tree, who is to blame? The Ambien or the car?

People get sink from drinking too much alcohol... who is to blame? The beer or the bars?

People die from overdosing on sleeping pills... who is to blame? The doctor for prescribing them or the pills themselves?

How about we blame the people who made the choice.

Where are you trying to go with this??? Nothing here makes sense because nothing here remotely comes close to M:S and these unfortunate incidents with the attraction... If you are trying to say people should be held accountable for their actions, then Imagineering/Disney needs to be added too because their action of building this attraction has resulted in a lot of people getting sick, 2 deaths, and a load of people not enjoying what should be an enjoyable vacation...

And again, people do have UNDETECTED health issues... What you posted above is people doing something they know they shouldn't be doing... if a person has an undected health issue, they make the choice to go on M:S because they don't know something is wrong with them, and then they die... I cannot see how that person should be held accountable for their action...

 

[SpongeScott]

Disney apologists I call them... Like Clinton apologists.. Bush apologists.. People who can see no wrong in the person or entity they follow as a die hard fan... Disney makes mistakes... And they dropped the ball on M:S.. In order to justify spening 160 million on a ride that is now well known to cause illness, they reopen it... Sooner or later Disney is going to have to be held accountable for this attraction... Whether people like it or not... Personally, I don't care if Disney shuts it down for good or keeps it open... But how many will have to get sick or die before Disney realizes this ride may be dangerous???

isn't any thrill ride dangerous?

 

[Timmay]

what the heck are you talking about?

ex·ac·er·bate ([FONT=verdana, sans-serif] P [/FONT]) Pronunciation Key (

g-z

s

r-b

t

)
tr.v. ex·ac·er·bat·ed, ex·ac·er·bat·ing, ex·ac·er·bates
<DL><DD>To increase the severity, violence, or bitterness of; aggravate</DD></DL>

I think he may have been kidding...

 

[JimboJones123]

I think he may have been kidding...

thanks beavis -- just trying to lighten the mood.