No Pixie Hollow???

Grizzly Hall 71

New Member
wana know something. parents wouldNT blow a thousand dollors to take a teen that dosent like disney to disney, your just a person who needs to leave the thread because your one of them or an adult who needs to understand the concept of disney, if you dont love the atmospher then you dont love it at all, your a disney killer so back off the kid cause you are a fail, ive been to diseny 14 times and i see kids and teens alike all intrested and entertained by every attraction in MK. SO KEEP YOUR OPINON TO YOURSELF

I understand the concept I've been here 40 times (prob more), a vacation club member, a d23 member, annual passholder at WDW and DL. Calling me a Disney killer, far from it. I embrace Disney more than anything else. I am a teen by the way.
 

Grizzly Hall 71

New Member
One poster got a little harsh with you. The rest of us just disagreed with you. Nobody hates you. Please continue to post your opinions.

But I would urge you to consider the points the rest of us are making.

Yeah I undenstand your points and they make total sense. At the end of the day it's all opinion. The fact is you and me are going to keep going to Disney for the rest of our lives and most likely in the future we will see new e tickets or family rides. Done and done. It was a fun debate though lol.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
Yeah I undenstand your points and they make total sense. At the end of the day it's all opinion. The fact is you and me are going to keep going to Disney for the rest of our lives and most likely in the future we will see new e tickets or family rides. Done and done. It was a fun debate though lol.

You are probably correct on all points.

I'll make another prediction. One day, you will be amazed by the details in the Haunted Mansion. ;)
 

MichWolv

Born Modest. Wore Off.
Premium Member
I have seen that the past few days... personally, I think that if Disney were looking to add a new thrill ride to the world putting it in the magic kingdom would be an irresponsible choice. If you are going to put in a thrill ride it NEEDS to go to one of the other parks. My preference would actually be hollywood studios back in the area that has what... a single show for the entire area?

DHS is quickly becoming the thrill/teen capital of WDW. ToT, RnRC, Star Tours 2.0 coming, plus Toy Story Mania all appeal to that audience, I think. And probably AIE as well. If there's another thrill ride to be added, I don't think it need to go at DHS. My preference for DHS is some family-targeted rides. The only rides at DHS that are really for the whole family are GMR and TSM, and GMR is tough for kids who haven't seen the movies referenced. The stunt shows, animation and backstage tours are family attractions as well, but anoher family ride or two would be helpful.

I'd put a new thrill ride in MK (Adventureland would be nice), Epcot (WS, as I've suggested) or AK (in a new land -- Mysterious Island, Australia, Antarctica, whatever).
 

Grizzly Hall 71

New Member
You are probably correct on all points.

I'll make another prediction. One day, you will be amazed by the details in the Haunted Mansion. ;)

I love the haunted mansion. I brought that point up because everytime I bring my friends up there they hate it. They don't appreciate detail like us Disney fans do. And like you said they're better off going to universal. I just try to get people on the Disney bandwagon. Most times it works sometimes it doesn't.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
I love the haunted mansion. I brought that point up because everytime I bring my friends up there they hate it. They don't appreciate detail like us Disney fans do. And like you said they're better off going to universal. I just try to get people on the Disney bandwagon. Most times it works sometimes it doesn't.

That's cool. I wouldn't sweat the ones who don't get it. I know plenty of adults who don't like Disney either.
 

UberPlannerMom

Well-Known Member
DHS is quickly becoming the thrill/teen capital of WDW. ToT, RnRC, Star Tours 2.0 coming, plus Toy Story Mania all appeal to that audience, I think. And probably AIE as well. If there's another thrill ride to be added, I don't think it need to go at DHS. My preference for DHS is some family-targeted rides. The only rides at DHS that are really for the whole family are GMR and TSM, and GMR is tough for kids who haven't seen the movies referenced. The stunt shows, animation and backstage tours are family attractions as well, but anoher family ride or two would be helpful.

I'd put a new thrill ride in MK (Adventureland would be nice), Epcot (WS, as I've suggested) or AK (in a new land -- Mysterious Island, Australia, Antarctica, whatever).


Do you really think Toy Story Mania is a thrill ride? I love toy story mania, but I just don't see it as a thrill ride. I think my biggest reason for advocating hollywood studios is that the two biggest thrills they have are right next to eachother. I would love to see people have to "discover" the rest of the park on their way to another thrill. I did totally forget about star tours because it has been soo long since I got to experience it, so my bad there. I still hate that the whole back (it is the back in my thinking, I am sure you know what area I am referring to) is wasted on cardboard signs, a playground, a show and a currently unmarked meet and greet.

By the way, what is muppet vision 3-D if not a family experience? And I should add in playhouse Disney and the little mermaid show seem like family experiences to me...

I would love for more things to go in to Animal Kingdom, but I don't know that the focus shoud be a single thrill ride right now. I think we need an entire area added with some smaller experiences in it. You can get a lot more bang for the buck with smaller experiences. Animal Kindgom already has two "coasters" (if you call primeval whirl a coaster type experience) plus dinosaur, which is supposed to bring thrills. It also has Kali River Rapids, which I have always found to be exciting and fun. It has great shows with the Lion King and Finding Nemo. It has, of course, some animal experiences. What it seems to me to need is an indoor, calm, air conditioned story telling experience, or three. I am sure that there is enough Disney animal movie fare to be able to pull this off. And it would add another way to distinguish themselves from zoos while also adding a way to cool off in what is often considered the hottest park! Does that make sense?
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
For my money, what DHS and DAK need the most are dark rides. But DAK needs anything it can get. A new land with one e-ticket to anchor it and some smaller attractions would be perfect.

Seems pretty likely DHS will get the MI coaster. It's not exactly what I would have chosen for the park (see comment on dark rides) but I think it'll present a nice balance.

MK and Epcot could both benefit from a thrill ride. But I don't think they suffer without them. I'd rather see DHS and DAK get built up before putting more thrill rides in the two most attended parks on property.
 

UberPlannerMom

Well-Known Member
For my money, what DHS and DAK need the most are dark rides.
I was hesitant to use the term dark ride for fear people would think I was looking to add peter pan's flight to animal kingdom:ROFLOL:!
I'd rather see DHS and DAK get built up before putting more thrill rides in the two most attended parks on property.

That is exactly what I was thinking when I said it would seem irresponsible to put the next thrill ride in MK... the other parks need the boost. MK does not, at least at this point it doesn't!
 

Evil Genius

Well-Known Member
On the topic of other Disney parks that are being neglected...I'm still shocked that after a little more than a decade DAK is still so underdeveloped!

I wish I could be a fly on the wall during planning and budget meetings to really understand the mindset of TDO and get a grasp on their rationale for making DAK the red headed step child.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
On the topic of other Disney parks that are being neglected...I'm still shocked that after a little more than a decade DAK is still so underdeveloped!

I wish I could be a fly on the wall during planning and budget meetings to really understand the mindset of TDO and get a grasp on their rationale for making DAK the red headed step child.

I think their mantra goes something like this: "If you don't build it, they will STILL come. And the bonuses will be HUGE!"
 

Evil Genius

Well-Known Member
I think their mantra goes something like this: "If you don't build it, they will STILL come. And the bonuses will be HUGE!"
You know you joke, but that probably is far from the reality!

Saddly we're all a part of the perpetuation of this issue. We do continue to go...and spend money...and lead them to believe the status quo is fine.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
You know you joke, but that probably is far from the reality!

Saddly we're all a part of the perpetuation of this issue. We do continue to go...and spend money...and lead them to believe the status quo is fine.

Hey, if I could get fat bonuses for sitting on my hands, I'd probably do it too.

Someone high up at Disney needs to make it clear that this isn't an appropriate way to run their flagship resort. But until that happens, why not?
 

Evil Genius

Well-Known Member
Hey, if I could get fat bonuses for sitting on my hands, I'd probably do it too.

Someone high up at Disney needs to make it clear that this isn't an appropriate way to run their flagship resort. But until that happens, why not?


I guess I'm just wired differently.

If I happened to be in a position of power with TDO my thought would constantly be..."what amazing thing can we blow our guests' mind with next?". I suppose it's the showman in me.
 

COProgressFan

Well-Known Member
I guess I'm just wired differently.

If I happened to be in a position of power with TDO my thought would constantly be..."what amazing thing can we blow our guests' mind with next?". I suppose it's the showman in me.

I agree, I think there are many folks like that. But I think so much of the problem has to do with the culture of TDO and the Disney Company in general. For years, the mantra straight from the top exec leadership was that quality would win out, that things might cost more to do this way sometimes, but if we do them right, guests will love us and keep coming back with their $$$.

But the culture of the company has shifted to one where cost savings are drilled down everyone's throats at all times, that spending money is bad (even if it brings returns down the road) because it makes things not as profitable in the short term, and that there are expectations that all areas of property must all be profitable at all times, and that profits must continually GROW from year to year. Add to this fear of layoffs/firings, and it doesn't always lead to a positive culture.

Changing this takes a radical shift in leadership at the top of TDO and higher. This is what truly good leadership is about. And while I don't want to defend TDO execs, for those who DO want to constantly make WDW a better place, there are just too many forces that work against them. Why risk your career by being difficult? It's better to just collect your pay and play it safe.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
I agree, I think there are many folks like that. But I think so much of the problem has to do with the culture of TDO and the Disney Company in general. For years, the mantra straight from the top exec leadership was that quality would win out, that things might cost more to do this way sometimes, but if we do them right, guests will love us and keep coming back with their $$$.

But the culture of the company has shifted to one where cost savings are drilled down everyone's throats at all times, that spending money is bad (even if it brings returns down the road) because it makes things not as profitable in the short term, and that there are expectations that all areas of property must all be profitable at all times, and that profits must continually GROW from year to year. Add to this fear of layoffs/firings, and it doesn't always lead to a positive culture.

Changing this takes a radical shift in leadership at the top of TDO and higher. This is what truly good leadership is about. And while I don't want to defend TDO execs, for those who DO want to constantly make WDW a better place, there are just too many forces that work against them. Why risk your career by being difficult? It's better to just collect your pay and play it safe.


Bingo!
 
Do you really think Toy Story Mania is a thrill ride? I love toy story mania, but I just don't see it as a thrill ride. I think my biggest reason for advocating hollywood studios is that the two biggest thrills they have are right next to eachother. I would love to see people have to "discover" the rest of the park on their way to another thrill. I did totally forget about star tours because it has been soo long since I got to experience it, so my bad there. I still hate that the whole back (it is the back in my thinking, I am sure you know what area I am referring to) is wasted on cardboard signs, a playground, a show and a currently unmarked meet and greet.

By the way, what is muppet vision 3-D if not a family experience? And I should add in playhouse Disney and the little mermaid show seem like family experiences to me...

I would love for more things to go in to Animal Kingdom, but I don't know that the focus shoud be a single thrill ride right now. I think we need an entire area added with some smaller experiences in it. You can get a lot more bang for the buck with smaller experiences. Animal Kindgom already has two "coasters" (if you call primeval whirl a coaster type experience) plus dinosaur, which is supposed to bring thrills. It also has Kali River Rapids, which I have always found to be exciting and fun. It has great shows with the Lion King and Finding Nemo. It has, of course, some animal experiences. What it seems to me to need is an indoor, calm, air conditioned story telling experience, or three. I am sure that there is enough Disney animal movie fare to be able to pull this off. And it would add another way to distinguish themselves from zoos while also adding a way to cool off in what is often considered the hottest park! Does that make sense?

When I did the college Program, I started in August, it took my roommates almost 3 months to realize that there was even more of the park because all they would do every time is turn straight down sunset blvd and stay there. It wasn't until the star wars nerd of our group wanted to ride star tours that they even realized that things like Muppet Vision and Backlot tour even existed. They really need to put some more stuff in the back lol
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
That is lovely! How could anyone have a problem with that going in?

I have no idea.

And again, Pixie Hollow at Disneyland takes up a tiny little corner of the park. It was actually the gardens and foundation area for the old Monsanto House of the Future from 1957-1967. It was a Little Mermaid meet n' greet in the 1990's and early 2000's, but the House of the Future foundation and some original landscaping is still there in todays Pixie Hollow. It takes up very little space, and you can't tell me that a similar postage stamp piece of land can't be found in the sprawling Magic Kingdom.

futurehouse_disney.jpg
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Let me sum up the whole "Disney needs thrill rides to appeal to teens" thing so I can move on.

1. Not all teens like thrill rides.

Definitely true, but that's not what is meant by a target market. The market as a whole is more apt to seek out thrill rides vs. a Fantasyland style dark ride.

2. WDW and MK offer lots of rides that appeal to all age groups.
3. Even if teenagers only liked thrill rides, it would not be wise for Disney to base their designs around appealing to one demographic.

Yes, this is definitely true - although I would argue that it's easier to sell Rock 'n' Roller Coaster or Tower of Terror to a teen as opposed to Toy Story Mania. That's not to say that once the "thrill ride minded teen" rides Toy Story Mania they won't come off smiling, but it's a harder sell the other two.

4. The demo in question (teenage thrill seekers - presumably male) have thrill parks to visit all over the country.
True, I've had debates with friends that love roller coasters but have little to no interest in Disney because from a coaster standpoint, the Disney coasters are tame. They'd rather experience the bare bones coasters at a six flags because they create a greater thrill.

5. This same demo has a stigma about Disney. If Disney built the greatest coaster park in the world, but called it Disney's Thrill Park, a lot of teens wouldn't give it a second look because of the Disney name.
Absolutely. This is why the name Disney XD was a bad choice.

Disney is what it is. They specialize in entertainment for the whole family. That includes thrill rides, but thrill rides have always been a relatively small piece of the formula. Never the focus. If thrill rides are the only thing that interest you, you would be better served by another company.

Seriously, Islands of Adventure is a marvelously themed park. It is up to Disney standards in every way. But it is focused on thrill rides. The teen thrill-seeker demo is always going to choose IoA over Disney. Disney shouldn't waste their time and resources making a play for this crowd.

They thought about it, but realized very quickly that the didn't have to. Seriously, I see very little reason to go to Islands of Adventure with a child that won't go on thrill rides.

Instead, Disney's going to continue focus on the "all ages" approach. Rides that grandparents can ride with their grandkids. They are going to throw in some thrill rides to fill out the roster. But Disney parks will never be designed for people who just want to ride thrill rides all day. That's not Disney.

It's how the maintain the status as a resort destination. If there isn't enough that appeals to the entire family, they're not going to get the entire family.

Finally, I don't think anyone is against another thrill ride in MK. As fans, I think we would all be for it. But you have to look at it from a business perspective. Putting a big thrill ride in MK (the most attended park which sometimes closes due to capacity issues) while you have parks with much lower attendance like DHS and DAK makes no sense at all.

If you're Disney and you've got the budget to put in a new e-ticket, you want to get the most bang for your buck. Putting that e-ticket in MK will not generate as much ticket sales as putting it in a park people might otherwise skip. A single e-ticket might turn DHS or DAK from a half-day park (for some) into a full day park. It might cause a family to extend their vacation.

And let's be real, a thrill park at MK will always be relatively tame anyway. How many thrill junkies really think Splash Mountain is a thrill? If you are bored by Pirates and Haunted Mansion, the Mountains really aren't going to be that big of a draw anyway. And one more excellent themed but relatively tame thrill ride isn't going to change your mind about the park.

I do think that the Magic Kingdom could use another thrill ride, but I agree - it's not the park to put in an ultra intense attraction. You mentioned capacity, and a new thrill ride would help that because it is actually an issue that needs to be addressed. However your point is well taken. A thrill ride of the scope of Everest would not have the same effect on the Magic Kingdom as it did to the Animal Kingdom.

Extending the vacations is the aim of Disney for adding new attractions. They were successful in doing this when MGM opened because they also opened Mickey's Birthdayland, Norway and Wonders of Life at around the same time. The plan was to do something similar when the Animal Kingdom opened but Test Track was delayed and the funding ran out for David Copperfield's Magic Underground.

Grizzly Hall 71, I understand that obviously these rides appeal to you. And I guess none of the other rides at MK do. But I think you are mistaken in generalizing your feelings to your entire generation. Most teens fall into two camps:

1. Those who like Disney (and while they might enoy another mountain-style thrill ride at MK they don't need it to continue enjoying the parks).
I would say that this group of Teens probably grew up going to the parks and are exempt from the "Disney is for kids" or "Disney is for girls" mentality

2. Those who think Disney is lame (and one more family-style thrill ride won't matter to them one bit).

I understand that you are in a third category. But I think the vast majority of teens fit into one of the first two.

That's the general perception of those people that have not been to Disney World in the last 10 years.
 

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