No fastpasses available today?

bugsbunny

Well-Known Member
Are you allergic to standby?

As if I'm acting that waiting is beneath me? My point is that I spent a ridiculous amount of money for tickets that are handicapped because of artificially created reasons by Disney.

And if waiting was irrelevant, there would be no need for fastpass. Your comment is quite ignorant and obviously just trying to dig.

.
 

bugsbunny

Well-Known Member
When this happens (its been common even before next gen), there is a cast member really close to the FP machine you can talk to. They will issue you a "FP only" ticket that can be used to get paper fast passes for the day...instead of having to go to guest relations.

Correct. But not that easy. Next day, none of those actual park tickets would work either. Same thing next day. That gets real old in a hurry. The guest relations line is out the door that early. And that also means the group has to wait so we can all try to FP a ride. Repeat next day. How can anyone say that this is accepatble?
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
..and yes..I do agree it shouldn't be an issue at all...but its not like this is something new caused by the next gen stuff.

Yes it IS caused by the NextGen stuff, From the OP the NextGen system thinks he has not been admitted to park so is not entitled to FP.

The majority of the CM's by the FP machines will not do ANYTHING for guest because they don't want to get whacked by management. This is part of the surly attitude by the CM's these days they are not ALLOWED to help guests.

DW has a bunch of CM friends who are VERY unhappy these days because they are not ALLOWED to help guests because of the 'God Machine' which is NextGen and It's information is assumed to be accurate by management even when its provably wrong.

A classic case of what we in the industry call 'Garbage IN, Gospel OUT' or GIGO for short.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
The CM is literally right there near FP machines. If the guest had presented them with the issue, the solution which I listed would have been presented. This happened to my friend last week, and it took less than a minute to resolve. I guess we should have complained that they HELPED us and it took away a whole minute from our vacation? They have a fix, and have had one for a long time..just takes a moment to talk to someone really close by.


And their answer is Sorry go see GR, They are no longer allowed to help.
 

bugsbunny

Well-Known Member
And their answer is Sorry go see GR, They are no longer allowed to help.

Exactly. They gave us the paper pass to get around FP, but the tickets were "broken" and only fixable at GR. Regardless of FP, broken tickets everyday is unacceptable.

To further compound this, a CM at Epcot said that the problem was that he registered his tickets on My WDW like it ASKS you to do. Said once you do that, the tickets don't work. suggested he get out of line,after waiting 30 minutes, and use one of the kiosks to DELETE his My WDW account so it would fix the tickets. He's like " What if I delete my account and that doesn't fix it? And my friend is setup the same way and all his tickets work. So how about YOU fix them?"

They then proceeded to fix them by stacking his tickets to make all of them a duplicate of his. We found that out the next day at MK. He went in first and nobody else could. Another trip to GR. And they fixed them by doing the same exact thing. Found that out at MK again. Weeeeeeeeeeee!!

Even at the entrances they have specail CMs with iPads to handle this, but they can't. They just send you to GR where the line is ridiculously long. They even said just go into the park but when we asked if FP would work, they said no. So why tell us to go in?

I came here for vacation. Not this crap.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
As if I'm acting that waiting is beneath me? My point is that I spent a ridiculous amount of money for tickets that are handicapped because of artificially created reasons by Disney.

FP+ doesn't create people in front of you... it only shifts how people get FPs. FP+ doesn't create more people. If all of a sudden there are 500 more people in SSE's line causing your increased wait... those 500 people can't be somewhere else at the same time. And those 500 people can't be in front of other people more than 3 times in the day... so how are more people in front of you at every attraction all the time?

I get that people don't like as many FPs being available.. but FP+ doesn't create more people.

And given FPs ran out all the time, and were so popular before.. I have a hard time believing FP+ has all of sudden made everyone redeem so many more FP reservations than before to cause these outrageous lines you and other are complaining about.

And if waiting was irrelevant, there would be no need for fastpass. Your comment is quite ignorant and obviously just trying to dig.

Or maybe you're coming across as a petty with 'My trip was ruined... I had to get in a standby line!!!'
 

Tom Morrow

Well-Known Member
In your case the CM broke the rules. Which is truly pathetic that Disney which was once the gold standard of customer service is now attempting to emulate the DMV for customer service.
You only say this because Disney has been overly generous all these years with compensation, and by doing so they have conditioned their guests to expect free things just for complaining.

I'm not saying that having issues with your specific magic bands of MM+/FP+ reservations aren't legitimate complaints, but if a Cast Member says there is nothing else he or she can do, they are probably telling the truth and not just blowing you off.
 

dupac

Well-Known Member
If double-dipping was eliminated, I don't think there would be a huge problem. Sure there are fewer FP available, but there are also fewer people who are using FP. Of course this assuming average attendance stays constant despite daily fluctuations.
 

djlaosc

Well-Known Member
Slightly off-topic...

It has been expected by people on here that the addition of FastPass+ will result in the removal of EMHs.

Here in the UK, now that the free gift cards promotion finished, the WDW Website is now promoting their 2014 packages as follows...

WDW said:
Hurry, it's your last chance to book and enjoy FREE dining for 2014 holidays!

Book today and enjoy FREE dining for your whole stay, plus a 14 for 7 ticket.

Packages available for 2014 arrivals:
•1st January - 8th April 2014
•27th April - 30th November 2014

Plus, stay at a Walt Disney World Resort hotel and enjoy additional time in Walt Disney World parks - above and beyond the standard operating schedule - at no extra charge. Details

It's going to be interesting to see if they try to get rid of EMH before the end of 2014, as they are now promoting them as part of a package that they are selling...
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
You only say this because Disney has been overly generous all these years with compensation, and by doing so they have conditioned their guests to expect free things just for complaining.

I'm not saying that having issues with your specific magic bands of MM+/FP+ reservations aren't legitimate complaints, but if a Cast Member says there is nothing else he or she can do, they are probably telling the truth and not just blowing you off.

Really,

GR lines 50-100 people deep, people who cannot use entitlements they have in most cases paid thousands of dollars for, Queues for attractions rivalling the old Soviet Union and all this SINCE the rollout of NGE, Yeah I think Disney is aiming for and achieving a DMV level of experience.

I know as a result of our last visit in August we cut Christmas vacation for us from 10 days to 4 - And that was to allow DMIL to see Osbourne Lights before their discontinuance otherwise would have skipped entire. If I want this kind of aggravation I can at least get paid for it instead of PAYING for it.
 

Jeffxz

Well-Known Member
FP+ doesn't create people in front of you... it only shifts how people get FPs. FP+ doesn't create more people. If all of a sudden there are 500 more people in SSE's line causing your increased wait... those 500 people can't be somewhere else at the same time. And those 500 people can't be in front of other people more than 3 times in the day... so how are more people in front of you at every attraction all the time?

I get that people don't like as many FPs being available.. but FP+ doesn't create more people.

And given FPs ran out all the time, and were so popular before.. I have a hard time believing FP+ has all of sudden made everyone redeem so many more FP reservations than before to cause these outrageous lines you and other are complaining about.

Or maybe you're coming across as a petty with 'My trip was ruined... I had to get in a standby line!!!'

I don't think his problem is FP+ in general, it is that the current working creates a huge advantage for people who are eligible for FP+ and a very large disadvantage for those that aren't. It isn't just that standby is longer, it is that those that aren't eligible for FP+ are forced to spend more of their time standing in it.

On a moderately busy day, it is now impossible to get a normal FP for both Soarin and Test Track assuming they are both gone by 11:00 where as 2 months ago it was a reasonable expectation to be able to do so with a little planning. So now if a non-FP+ eligible person would like to ride most attractions in EPCOT, they not only need to wait in at least one long stand-by (TT or Soarin), they now need to wait in longer stand-bys for all rides.

I believe you have stated before that FP+ doesn't create longer wait times for guests as a whole, it just shifts around the wait times. Well, right now those wait times are all being shifted to guests who can't use FP+. In my opinion, it is perfectly resonable for these guests to be upset. Investments were made in these vacations way before this information was avaialble to them. Had this info been avaialble some may have chosen not to invest in a WDW vacation, while others may have been ok with it. But as of right now, this decision is being forced on guests.

Once the system is finalized and the rules are clearly stated, I will agree that there shouldn't be any complaints. If Disney chooses to keep FP+ resort guests only, and states that info clearly for all to see then I think that is fair. Then a guest will be able to make the choice to pay more for a resort room or not use FP+.

As it stands today, Disney has created a system of 'All guests are equal, but some are more equal than others' without clearly explaining to those spending thousands of dollars which side they fall on. I assume this will change when they finalize how the system will work, but as of right now I consider it to be completely unfair to the guest.

As a side-note, I would like to point out that I have participated in the FP+ test twice so far, I didn't have any major issues and I actually enjoy the changes introduced by FP+.
 

wannab@dis

Well-Known Member
Yes it IS caused by the NextGen stuff, From the OP the NextGen system thinks he has not been admitted to park so is not entitled to FP.

This was very prevalent when the original FP system was introduced. We saw it happen to someone in our party or someone else in a FP line multiple times and it took at least a couple of years before it was completely fixed. Guess they should have just scrapped that system also?

The majority of the CM's by the FP machines will not do ANYTHING for guest because they don't want to get whacked by management. This is part of the surly attitude by the CM's these days they are not ALLOWED to help guests.

DW has a bunch of CM friends who are VERY unhappy these days because they are not ALLOWED to help guests because of the 'God Machine' which is NextGen and It's information is assumed to be accurate by management even when its provably wrong.

Don't believe it. I've never seen a CM refuse to help with FP. Just read where @NowInc mentioned they received timely help. I'm raising the flag on this one...

bsflag.gif



A classic case of what we in the industry call 'Garbage IN, Gospel OUT' or GIGO for short.
Not sure what industry you're in, but GIGO has always been garbage in, garbage out... apropos for your posts.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
Actually they should have scrapped the original FP as well as it slows down queues, TSMM in Anaheim does not have FP and lines are 30-45minutes. And you seem to be behind the times on what front line CM's are allowed to do these days.

They are not refusing to help it's just now that the only action available to them is to send the guest to GR to have the issue fixed or get written up if caught letting people on ride without a go indication from the MickeyHead. no matter how much paperwork they have on them.

I'm in an industry where I have several patents for software, I am very much aware of Garbage out, In this case poor input and flawed processes result in data which TDO management believes is gospel.

This was very prevalent when the original FP system was introduced. We saw it happen to someone in our party or someone else in a FP line multiple times and it took at least a couple of years before it was completely fixed. Guess they should have just scrapped that system also?



Don't believe it. I've never seen a CM refuse to help with FP. Just read where @NowInc mentioned they received timely help. I'm raising the flag on this one...

bsflag.gif




Not sure what industry you're in, but GIGO has always been garbage in, garbage out... apropos for your posts.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
On a moderately busy day, it is now impossible to get a normal FP for both Soarin and Test Track assuming they are both gone by 11:00 where as 2 months ago it was a reasonable expectation to be able to do so with a little planning. So now if a non-FP+ eligible person would like to ride most attractions in EPCOT, they not only need to wait in at least one long stand-by (TT or Soarin), they now need to wait in longer stand-bys for all rides.

Again.. FP+ doesn't create more people. This is also why the 3 limit is so important. I totally get you don't like not having a FP... but it's not like FP+ users have FP+ have unlimited use of the system.. once beyond their 3 uses.. they are in the same boat as everyone else.

If Disney is suddenly giving out tons of new FP+ slots... the people in those slots are now NOT somewhere else. They can't be boosting the lines everywhere all the time. I think its going to take time before people and visiting patterns adjust to how the crowds move.

I believe you have stated before that FP+ doesn't create longer wait times for guests as a whole, it just shifts around the wait times.

Someone else...

I just think there is more than just 'adding FP+...' happening here. The paper FP must be way down, the total FP+ slots must be way up, as well as the crowd numbers. Else, if people are limited to 3 FP+, where are all the extra bodies coming from in the FP+ lines... and what are the FP+ users doing AFTER their 3 FP+ allotment is up?
 

dupac

Well-Known Member
I just think there is more than just 'adding FP+...' happening here. The paper FP must be way down, the total FP+ slots must be way up, as well as the crowd numbers. Else, if people are limited to 3 FP+, where are all the extra bodies coming from in the FP+ lines... and what are the FP+ users doing AFTER their 3 FP+ allotment is up?

I believe it was mentioned that FP+ users could also get regular FP as well. Lots of double dipping maybe?
 

Jeffxz

Well-Known Member
Again.. FP+ doesn't create more people. This is also why the 3 limit is so important. I totally get you don't like not having a FP... but it's not like FP+ users have FP+ have unlimited use of the system.. once beyond their 3 uses.. they are in the same boat as everyone else.

If Disney is suddenly giving out tons of new FP+ slots... the people in those slots are now NOT somewhere else. They can't be boosting the lines everywhere all the time. I think its going to take time before people and visiting patterns adjust to how the crowds move.


I think you are missing my point. I personally don't mind switching to FP+ from paper FP. My comments were pertaining to today's system (not necessarily the final system) where only some guests are eligible for FP+. As of today, some guests can have 3 FP+, while others get 0 FP+. So yes, after the 3 FP+ are used they are in the same boat as everyone else, except they were allowed to expierience 3 attractions that a guest who can't use FP+ couldn't without a higher wait time.

Someone else...

I just think there is more than just 'adding FP+...' happening here. The paper FP must be way down, the total FP+ slots must be way up, as well as the crowd numbers. Else, if people are limited to 3 FP+, where are all the extra bodies coming from in the FP+ lines... and what are the FP+ users doing AFTER their 3 FP+ allotment is up?

I also wasn't debating the amount of FP/FP+ slots distributed. I was pointing out that some guests, through no fault of thier own, no longer have equal access to the FP/FP+ inventory.
 

NowInc

Well-Known Member
In your case the CM broke the rules. Which is truly pathetic that Disney which was once the gold standard of customer service is now attempting to emulate the DMV for customer service.

...right. He just happened to be able to pull out these magic paper passes that are designed SPECIFICALLY to help in this situation...printed them out from his magic printer thats in his pocket.

He had a large stack of them, and I am pretty sure that they were provided by park management...which I am failing to see falls into him "breaking the rules"
 

ParentsOf4

Well-Known Member
Again.. FP+ doesn't create more people. This is also why the 3 limit is so important. I totally get you don't like not having a FP... but it's not like FP+ users have FP+ have unlimited use of the system.. once beyond their 3 uses.. they are in the same boat as everyone else.

If Disney is suddenly giving out tons of new FP+ slots... the people in those slots are now NOT somewhere else. They can't be boosting the lines everywhere all the time.
Actually, FP+ just might be boosting the lines at some headliner attractions even if attendance hasn't changed.

We are getting lots of reports of longer than normal lines for late October. (Especially at Guest Relations.:)) Something has changed. Do I think what we are seeing is permanent? I hope not. I hope Disney gets the right balance between FP+ and Standby and things return to normal but, given reports, it seems what they have today is encouraging more to stand in line, especially in popular attractions. In other words, FP+ might be making a bad problem worse.

First, I believe Disney is distributing too many FP+ or, more specifically, a higher percentage of guests are actually using their FP+ selections. We all understand that a lot of FP tickets went unused. (I have a pretty big stack of them at home!) As a result, WDW got into the habit of distributing more FP than they had capacity for.

When switching over from FP to FP+, it's not too difficult to imagine that management would be reluctant to reduce the combined number of FP/FP+ being distributed. "What? We just spent $2 Billion for this system and you are telling me I have to hand out fewer return times? You want me to try to justify that to my boss?"

Disney wants us to plan our days around our FP+ selections. Perhaps guests are doing exactly that. Perhaps, as a result, a much higher percentage are actually redeeming their FP+ selections. Perhaps, as a result, Disney is going to have to adjust its FP+ distribution algorithm.

Second, FP+ is designed to change the way guests tour the parks. Given the reports of longer lines on some of the more popular attractions, it could very well be that rather than distributing crowds evenly, FP+ is encouraging guests to concentrate on the more popular attractions and discouraging guests from riding less popular attractions, attractions that tend to have spare capacity.

Hypothetically, let's say it's before FP+ and I arrive at DHS at 10 AM. I walk over to TSM and the return time is already for 7 PM that night while there is a 120-minute Standby line. Not wanting to wait, I grab a FP and head to something else with a short wait. Maybe I do One Man's Dream, Backlot Tour, Lights, Motor, Action, Honey I Strunk the Kids Playset, Star Tours, Indiana Jones. Anything with a typically short wait. Now it's getting around 5 PM and the kids are tired. They really want to head back to the pool to swim. Do I really want to hang around for another 2 hours for TSM? Maybe. Maybe not.

The point is that I've spent hours in the park and not one minute in the TSM FP or Standby lines and, possibly, very little time in a headliner attraction line. (Despite the best intentions of touringplans.com, most guests still tour the parks randomly. :))

Conversely, let's say FP+ is now in use and I get a TSM FP+ for 7 PM because that's what was left. I'm not going to bother to show up at DHS at 10 AM. I'm going to do something else. Maybe sleep in. Maybe shop. Maybe go to another theme park with better rides. (Hello Magic Kingdom!) I'm not going to try to fill my day on the Backlot Tour (which always has excess capacity) or One Man's Dream. Instead, if I go to another theme park in the morning, I'm more likely to head to that theme park's premiere attractions. If I'm at MK, I'm going to ride Peter Pan, not Hall of the Presidents. The point is, now I'm going for more E ticket attractions at another park, knowing that my FP+ selection for TSM for later in the day is secure.

Something has changed. We're reading lots of reports of long FP+ lines on the headliners, particularly at DHS and Epcot where there simply aren't enough E ticket attractions.

Are there suddenly more guests at WDW than in the past? Maybe. But, just maybe, FP+ is changing the way guests tour the parks, as it was intended to do. And, just maybe, Disney hasn't yet taken this into account in their FP+ distribution models.
 
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