Rumor New Monorails Coming Soon?

steve2wdw

steve2wdw

WDW Fan Since 1973
From the picture that has been posted, the door appears to be in the car that is directly behind the pilot....don't the ECV's usually use cars that are in the center of the train, where cast members use a ramp to load the ECV and guest?
 
Voxel

Voxel

President of Progress City
monothingie said:
Clearly they didn't anticipate anyone using any kind of wheelchair, stroller, ECV otherwise they would have designed them with a different door assembly, and being flat with the platform, and also not initially having the fold up seat compartment in the centers of each cab.
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Well did ECV really exist when they began designing these units in the 80s
 
s8film40

s8film40

Well-Known Member
Voxel said:
Well did ECV really exist when they began designing these units in the 80s
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Not really, but I don’t think the force of an ECV with full weight striking a door should’ve been more than what these doors should’ve been engineered to withstand.

I’ve also seen EVC’s hit these doors really hard without them falling off. So there’s definitely more going on here. Trust me if these things couldn’t withstand an impact from an ECV we would be seeing this incident on at least a weekly basis.
 
correcaminos

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
monothingie said:
The ECV unloaded weighs 350lbs. Let's take your low end estimate that the person weighs 200lbs, that's still 550lbs of motorized mass pushing against a thin fiberglass door which is bolted in 4 places. What do you think would happen? This has nothing the age of the monorails and everything to do with the unique situation of the accident.
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Again the ones we have used are 200-250. I checked one we rented and it was under 250. That was my point. Your ECV number is higher than the ones we've rented.

I double checked with Buena Vista. The heavier one is 215 and the lighter was 175. So I think, again, your numbers are off.

And not very comforting to me if I were riding in a scooter.
 
P

PatriotsFan

New Member
s8film40 said:
Not really, but I don’t think the force of an ECV with full weight striking a door should’ve been more than what these doors should’ve been engineered to withstand.

I’ve also seen EVC’s hit these doors really hard without them falling off. So there’s definitely more going on here. Trust me if these things couldn’t withstand an impact from an ECV we would be seeing this incident on at least a weekly basis.
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Does anyone know why the ECV's are not strapped down like they are on Disney buses? Maybe the person accidentally put it in reverse. Still scary. Without strapping them down this could have happen while in transit.
 
monothingie

monothingie

Nakatomi Plaza Christmas Eve 1988. Never Forget.
Premium Member
s8film40 said:
Not really, but I don’t think the force of an ECV with full weight striking a door should’ve been more than what these doors should’ve been engineered to withstand.

I’ve also seen EVC’s hit these doors really hard without them falling off. So there’s definitely more going on here. Trust me if these things couldn’t withstand an impact from an ECV we would be seeing this incident on at least a weekly basis.
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Is there a specific direction in which you loaded the ECVs based on their destination so they wouldn’t have to back out. Example on the resort line enter on the right side head first to exit straight out at the MK?

I could easily see one of those things set to full power going up the load ramp and through the car at full speed.
 
s8film40

s8film40

Well-Known Member
PatriotsFan said:
Does anyone know why the ECV's are not strapped down like they are on Disney buses? Maybe the person accidentally put it in reverse. Still scary. Without strapping them down this could have happen while in transit.
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They removed the straps on the monorail a LONG time ago. It wouldn’t matter because to use them a wheelchair had to be positioned facing forward or reverse. Most scooter have to go in sideways.
 
mikejs78

mikejs78

Well-Known Member
monothingie said:
An ECV can reach a speeds of several mph. It seems as this was not someone simply leaning or falling against the door, this appears to be a heavy object impacting the door at considerable speed which in turn exceeded door hardware connection's strength causing ti to break.
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This is where people underestimate the potential impact. Some ECV's can hit 5mph. The impact force of a moving object hitting a stationary object is F = (0.5 * m * v^2) ÷ d (where m is mass, v is velocity, and d is the distance the moving object will travel before it stops. Calculating d is another formula, so let's just say an ECV will travel 0.1m on collision before stopping, for the sake of argument. So for a 550lb ECV (250kg) and a velocity of 5mph (8 kph or 2.2 meters/sec) we get: F = (0.5 * 250 * 4.84) / 0.1, or 6,051 newtons, which is equivalent to 1360 pounds-force. Not a small amount of force.

If anyone is more versed in physics and math than I, please check my work.... I'm definitely not an expert here...
 
Voxel

Voxel

President of Progress City
mikejs78 said:
This is where people underestimate the potential impact. Some ECV's can hit 5mph. The impact force of a moving object hitting a stationary object is F = (0.5 * m * v^2) ÷ d (where m is mass, v is velocity, and d is the distance the moving object will travel before it stops. Calculating d is another formula, so let's just say an ECV will travel 0.1m on collision before stopping, for the sake of argument. So for a 550lb ECV (250kg) and a velocity of 5mph (8 kph or 2.2 meters/sec) we get: F = (0.5 * 250 * 4.84) / 0.1, or 6,051 newtons, which is equivalent to 1360 pounds-force. Not a small amount of force.

If anyone is more versed in physics and math than I, please check my work.... I'm definitely not an expert here...
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Take a higher than average force, bolts not up to spec, and possibly material fatigue.. you would have the perfect storm for this type of failure.
 
s8film40

s8film40

Well-Known Member
monothingie said:
Is there a specific direction in which you loaded the ECVs based on their destination so they wouldn’t have to back out. Example on the resort line enter on the right side head first to exit straight out at the MK?

I could easily see one of those things set to full power going up the load ramp and through the car at full speed.
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Not really, although on the resort monorail you would try to load them so that someone didn’t have to get out and back in at one of the stops.

Yes the scenario you described has happened very often. The scooter is on full throttle to go up the ramp, then when it hits the level ground in the car it takes off. Either hits the door or flies out the open doors landing on the platform on the other side.
 
JoeCamel

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
mikejs78 said:
This is where people underestimate the potential impact. Some ECV's can hit 5mph. The impact force of a moving object hitting a stationary object is F = (0.5 * m * v^2) ÷ d (where m is mass, v is velocity, and d is the distance the moving object will travel before it stops. Calculating d is another formula, so let's just say an ECV will travel 0.1m on collision before stopping, for the sake of argument. So for a 550lb ECV (250kg) and a velocity of 5mph (8 kph or 2.2 meters/sec) we get: F = (0.5 * 250 * 4.84) / 0.1, or 6,051 newtons, which is equivalent to 1360 pounds-force. Not a small amount of force.

If anyone is more versed in physics and math than I, please check my work.... I'm definitely not an expert here...
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Now calculate the force it would take to shear a grade 5 bolt of 3/8 diameter and take the other three out enough so the door falls off the train.
 
D

drizgirl

Well-Known Member
peter11435 said:
Parts failing and parts being damaged are very different scenarios. I’m reasonably confident the designers of those trains never considered several hundred pounds of motorized vehicle with a several hundred pound guest driving it into the doors.
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And perhaps never considered them being run a decade past their life expectancy?
 

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